Teabaggers laugh at women who's daughter they are responsible for killing

[SmarterthanYou]

She went to the hospital and told them she didn't have insurance. They sent her home saying she had a "cold". If she'd had insurance they would have examined her thoroughly and discovered she had pneumonia.

No, they didn't outright deny her medical services because she didn't ask for a specific test. Who does?

Are you suggesting/implying a hospital will thoroughly examine a person knowing they don't have insurance or cash?

The current law states that Emergency rooms need only stabilize a person without insurance. If she came in with breathing issues, but was otherwise stable, they were not obligated to help her. You want to cover hospitals for ER visits for any and all contingencies, fine with me. Where will you cut spending enough in order to pay for it?

 

[TuTu Monroe]

Anyone who requires hospitalization and can't afford it are sent to the state-run hospitals.

The current law states that Emergency rooms need only stabilize a person without insurance. If she came in with breathing issues, but was otherwise stable, they were not obligated to help her. You want to cover hospitals for ER visits for any and all contingencies, fine with me. Where will you cut spending enough in order to pay for it?

 

[USFREEDOM911]

What difference does it make if she went for pre-natal care or not? She became ill and the hospital did not spend time diagnosing the problem because she didn't have insurance.

She wasn't ill a month before. If she had gone for pre-natal care it wouldn't have made any difference unless her pre-natal appointment was scheduled for the same day she went to the hospital.

To my knowledge pre-natal care involves, on average, a monthly visit. She probably didn't have pneumonia a month before she arrived at the hospital so what is the connection between pre-natal care and her illness?

OH-GEE, I don't know.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, let's see.

Maybe if she would have gone in for the pre-natal care, then she would have had a doctor, and then, JUAST MAYBE, she would have had a Doctor to go to, that SHE HAD BEEN ALREADY SEEING.

But then, maybe that's just me.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

Again, why did she not avail herself of the government programs that would have provided her insurance? Those same programs that are supported by both parties and have been for a very, very long time?

You again expect us to ignore the fact that the woman had available coverage, would still have it if nothing at all changed, it's used constantly, the names of government programs that offer such coverage to pregnant women in need were even given...

I refuse to play the straw man game with you.

She had available health care coverage and her family now wants us to support bad legislation simply because she was too foolish to get the coverage before she truly needed it. We're supposed to get so emotive that we suddenly cannot think.

In apple's little "laa-dee-daa" land, everything is just supposed to be laid out; for whereever anyone DECIDES to take advantage of it.

One evening as the sun went down
And the jungle fires were burning,

Down the track came a hobo hiking,
And he said, 'Boys, I'm not turning

I'm headed for a land that's far away
Besides the crystal fountains

So come with me, we'll go and see
The Big Rock Candy Mountains

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains,
There's a land that's fair and bright,

Where the handouts grow on bushes
And you sleep out every night.

Where the boxcars all are empty
And the sun shines every day

And the birds and the bees
And the cigarette trees

The lemonade springs
Where the bluebird sings

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains
All the cops have wooden legs

And the bulldogs all have rubber teeth
And the hens lay soft-boiled eggs

The farmers' trees are full of fruit
And the barns are full of hay

Oh I'm bound to go
Where there ain't no snow

Where the rain don't fall
The winds don't blow

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains
You never change your socks

And the little streams of alcohol
Come trickling down the rocks

The brakemen have to tip their hats
And the railway bulls are blind

There's a lake of stew
And of whiskey too
You can paddle all around it
In a big canoe

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains,
The jails are made of tin.

And you can walk right out again,
As soon as you are in.

There ain't no short-handled shovels,
No axes, saws nor picks,

I'm bound to stay
Where you sleep all day,
Where they hung the jerk
That invented work

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

I'll see you all this coming fall
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains​

 

[apple0154]

The current law states that Emergency rooms need only stabilize a person without insurance. If she came in with breathing issues, but was otherwise stable, they were not obligated to help her. You want to cover hospitals for ER visits for any and all contingencies, fine with me. Where will you cut spending enough in order to pay for it?

If people had free access to general check-ups the emergency rooms would be a lot less crowded. That does not apply to the case in question as it appears the illness progressed rapidly, however, there may have been other people there who wouldn't have needed to be there if they had access to doctors the day before.

People without insurance will wait until the last minute before going to the emergency. That list would be reduced if they had the opportunity to see a family doctor/GP before the infection/disease/illness progressed to the point where immediate attention was required.

It's all about prevention or catching an illness before it progresses. In the case being discussed the cost ended up being 1.5 million dollars. That would pay for a lot of basic check-ups or regular doctor visits not to mention saving lives.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

If people had free access to general check-ups

how do you propose to do that and keep it free?

 

[apple0154]

OH-GEE, I don't know.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, let's see.

Maybe if she would have gone in for the pre-natal care, then she would have had a doctor, and then, JUAST MAYBE, she would have had a Doctor to go to, that SHE HAD BEEN ALREADY SEEING.

But then, maybe that's just me.

You're discounting the time factor. One day she walks into a hospital and the next day she is hospitalized and ends up dying. The first hospital should have run tests. What would have happened if her doctor was away for the day?

Is pre-natal care free? If so, surely the doctors could tell she was pregnant so why concern themselves with insurance if she was entitled to insurance? If the care isn't free then the question is, "Could she afford it?"

 

[apple0154]

In apple's little "laa-dee-daa" land, everything is just supposed to be laid out; for whereever anyone DECIDES to take advantage of it.

If universal medical constitutes a "laa-dee-daa" land there are dozens of "laa-dee-daa" lands around the globe.

That said, I brought up MapQuest to get directions to the Big Rock Candy Mountains. I can't get there from here.

One evening as the sun went down
And the jungle fires were burning,

Down the track came a hobo hiking,
And he said, 'Boys, I'm not turning

I'm headed for a land that's far away
Besides the crystal fountains

So come with me, we'll go and see
"laa-dee-daa" land

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains,
There's a land that's fair and bright,

Where the handouts grow on bushes
And you sleep out every night.

Where the boxcars all are empty
And the sun shines every day

And the birds and the bees
And the cigarette trees

The lemonade springs
Where the bluebird sings

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains
All the cops have wooden legs

And the bulldogs all have rubber teeth
And the hens lay soft-boiled eggs

The farmers' trees are full of fruit
And the barns are full of hay

Oh I'm bound to go
Where there ain't no snow

Where the rain don't fall
The winds don't blow

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains
You never change your socks

And the little streams of alcohol
Come trickling down the rocks

The brakemen have to tip their hats
And the railway bulls are blind

There's a lake of stew
And of whiskey too
You can paddle all around it
In a big canoe

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains,
The jails are made of tin.

And you can walk right out again,
As soon as you are in.

There ain't no short-handled shovels,
No axes, saws nor picks,

I'm bound to stay
Where you sleep all day,
Where they hung the jerk
That invented work

In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.

I'll see you all this coming fall
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains​

 

[apple0154]

how do you propose to do that and keep it free?

Partially by the savings from emergency room visits. Partially by the savings from tragedies like what happened to the woman and partially by folks all contributing to the common pot like a huge group insurance.

I posted this on another thread.
"The U.S. spends much more on health care than Canada, both on a per-capita basis and as a percentage of GDP. In 2006, per-capita spending for health care in Canada was US$3,678; in the U.S., US$6,714."
[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Canadian_and_American_health_care_systems[/ame]

That is the savings between a "pay or suffer" system and a universal system. If folks bring up the waiting time or other concerns about the Canadian system imagine how efficient that system would be if the funds were increased 80% to equal that of the US health costs.

 

[Damocles]

Partially by the savings from emergency room visits. Partially by the savings from tragedies like what happened to the woman and partially by folks all contributing to the common pot like a huge group insurance.

I posted this on another thread.
"The U.S. spends much more on health care than Canada, both on a per-capita basis and as a percentage of GDP. In 2006, per-capita spending for health care in Canada was US$3,678; in the U.S., US$6,714."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Canadian_and_American_health_care_systems

That is the savings between a "pay or suffer" system and a universal system. If folks bring up the waiting time or other concerns about the Canadian system imagine how efficient that system would be if the funds were increased 80% to equal that of the US health costs.

Aaaarrrrgh...

They already do! For gods' sakes, there was available insurance for this woman, there still is for women in the same circumstances, we've named some of the government programs that do this, that she didn't have it 7 months into her pregnancy isn't anybody's fault but her own.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

You're discounting the time factor. One day she walks into a hospital and the next day she is hospitalized and ends up dying. The first hospital should have run tests. What would have happened if her doctor was away for the day?

Is pre-natal care free? If so, surely the doctors could tell she was pregnant so why concern themselves with insurance if she was entitled to insurance? If the care isn't free then the question is, "Could she afford it?"

You are either truly naive, or just plain obtuse; because if she had taken advantage of the pre-natal care (which doesn't stop after the birth has occured), she would have had a primary doctor and would have been covered.

They issue these little things called "CARDS", when they are under the care of a physician, and that "CARD" is acceptable at any hospital.

Give it up; because You truly have no idea of what you're talking about.

 

[TuTu Monroe]

I want to hear the other side of this. Something is fishy and it just doesn't add up.

You are either truly naive, or just plain obtuse; because if she had taken advantage of the pre-natal care (which doesn't stop after the birth has occured), she would have had a primary doctor and would have been covered.

They issue these little things called "CARDS", when they are under the care of a physician, and that "CARD" is acceptable at any hospital.

Give it up; because You truly have no idea of what you're talking about.

 

[apple0154]

You are either truly naive, or just plain obtuse; because if she had taken advantage of the pre-natal care (which doesn't stop after the birth has occured), she would have had a primary doctor and would have been covered.

They issue these little things called "CARDS", when they are under the care of a physician, and that "CARD" is acceptable at any hospital.

Give it up; because You truly have no idea of what you're talking about.

I assume the "card" costs something. Do we know if she was capable of affording it? If these "cards" are so easily obtainable, if any pregnant woman can easily afford one, is the lack of one sufficient reason to not adequately treat a pregnant woman?

We're not talking about heart surgery here. A cursory physical along with a culture could have determined she had pneumonia.

In any case, card or no card, where is the concern over the seventh month fetus? Mommy doesn't have a card so to hell with the fetus, as well.

Just because Mommy didn't have a card, for whatever reason, it justifies lack of proper concern on the part of the doctors/hospital?

The woman was 7 months pregnant! One thing we can conclude is it's obvious those folks weren't pro-life.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

I assume the "card" costs something. Do we know if she was capable of affording it? If these "cards" are so easily obtainable, if any pregnant woman can easily afford one, is the lack of one sufficient reason to not adequately treat a pregnant woman?

We're not talking about heart surgery here. A cursory physical along with a culture could have determined she had pneumonia.

In any case, card or no card, where is the concern over the seventh month fetus? Mommy doesn't have a card so to hell with the fetus, as well.

Just because Mommy didn't have a card, for whatever reason, it justifies lack of proper concern on the part of the doctors/hospital?

The woman was 7 months pregnant! One thing we can conclude is it's obvious those folks weren't pro-life.

You sure do ASSUME an awful lot.
You ASSUME you're correct; because you FEEL that you are!!
Well, you've ASSUMED wrong.
If a person has no income, then THERE IS NO CHARGE.
You're arguing this point and you haven't even bothered to check into it.
That's just total asininity.

Are you now going to FORCE mommy to go to the Doctor??
Why of a sudden all the concern over a clump of cells?
Acoording to you, it isn't anyting but a growth.

We can also conclude that mommy wsn't much along the lines of pro-intelligence.

 

[Damocles]

I assume the "card" costs something. Do we know if she was capable of affording it? If these "cards" are so easily obtainable, if any pregnant woman can easily afford one, is the lack of one sufficient reason to not adequately treat a pregnant woman?

We're not talking about heart surgery here. A cursory physical along with a culture could have determined she had pneumonia.

In any case, card or no card, where is the concern over the seventh month fetus? Mommy doesn't have a card so to hell with the fetus, as well.

Just because Mommy didn't have a card, for whatever reason, it justifies lack of proper concern on the part of the doctors/hospital?

The woman was 7 months pregnant! One thing we can conclude is it's obvious those folks weren't pro-life.

You "assume" wrongly. The government programs meant to help indigent mothers do not require payment and usually give them money, lower rent, and food stamps along with direct coupons to purchase items at the grocery store as well as health coverage.

Again. These programs are supported by both parties and have been for years, they haven't gone anywhere and are still there for people in her situation.

We can conclude one thing, the woman didn't take coverage that was available and now we are supposed to grow retarded because her family cried at us.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

You "assume" wrongly. The government programs meant to help indigent mothers do not require payment and usually give them money, lower rent, and food stamps along with direct coupons to purchase items at the grocery store.

Don't bother apple with FACTS.
He woiuld much rather rant and rave aboiut his ASSUMPTIONS and FEELINGS.
FACTS have nothing to with apple's "rant-du-jours".

 

[apple0154]

You sure do ASSUME an awful lot.
You ASSUME you're correct; because you FEEL that you are!!
Well, you've ASSUMED wrong.
If a person has no income, then THERE IS NO CHARGE.
You're arguing this point and you haven't even bothered to check into it.
That's just total asininity.

Are you now going to FORCE mommy to go to the Doctor??
Why of a sudden all the concern over a clump of cells?
Acoording to you, it isn't anyting but a growth.

We can also conclude that mommy wsn't much along the lines of pro-intelligence.

While it's nice to know you're not running around screaming a 7 month old fetus is a human being it is unsettling to also know you don't believe it should be considered when a pregnant woman asks for help.

 

[apple0154]

You "assume" wrongly. The government programs meant to help indigent mothers do not require payment and usually give them money, lower rent, and food stamps along with direct coupons to purchase items at the grocery store as well as health coverage.

Again. These programs are supported by both parties and have been for years, they haven't gone anywhere and are still there for people in her situation.

We can conclude one thing, the woman didn't take coverage that was available and now we are supposed to grow retarded because her family cried at us.

Great. Then if the cards are freely given what possible difference can it make whether or not a woman has one? At 7 months it is obvious she is pregnant. If the card is free and the program is structured to insure medical care for pregnant women why would the hospital not accept her and she could get the card later and the program would reimburse the hospital?

Again, she is pregnant. She is entitled to medical care. What makes possessing the card necessary unless there is some fee attached to it?

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Great. Then if the cards are freely given what possible difference can it make whether or not a woman has one? At 7 months it is obvious she is pregnant. If the card is free and the program is structured to insure medical care for pregnant women why would the hospital not accept her and she could get the card later and the program would reimburse the hospital?

with all the liberal government programs that have been created with the dozens of hoops to jump through and red tape to cut through (read that as 'numerous qualifications to fulfill before entitlement') you really have to ask that question???????

 

[apple0154]

Don't bother apple with FACTS.
He woiuld much rather rant and rave aboiut his ASSUMPTIONS and FEELINGS.
FACTS have nothing to with apple's "rant-du-jours".

If people would give straight answers the "rants" wouldn't be necessary. Either the card is free to all pregnant women or it is not. If it is not free we do not know if she was able to afford one.

If it is free then it is illogical not to treat her because she doesn't have a card when it is obvious she was pregnant.

Why all the run-around? If pregnant women are entitled to free medical and it's obvious a woman is pregnant, as in this case, that's the end of the story. What the hell does a card have to do with anything unless there are a few facts being omitted.

Spit it out.