Solution to Illegal Immigration Problem...

Wickedjews said:
In the long run immigration creates jobs and improves the livelihood of the average American. We are still one of the least population dense countries in the world, we can afford immigration.
Click to expand...

Economic growth for whom? not the americans who's wages are driven down.
 
Wickedjews said:
In the long run immigration creates jobs and improves the livelihood of the average American. We are still one of the least population dense countries in the world, we can afford immigration.
Click to expand...

My comment was regarding illegal immigration, not all immigration.
 
Wickedjews said:
Even if we crack down heavily on official jobs there's still going to be lots of under the table work that will be very difficult to detect. Also, if we managed to actually get rid of illegals entire livelihood we'd have to make some plan to get them back to Mexico.
Click to expand...

Or we could send them to LA.
 
WinterBorn said:
So for 6 years we allow absolutely no immigration from Mexico? And you think this is going to STOP illegal immigration?
Click to expand...

You didn't read all of what I said, did you? This would be what we did AFTER sealing the border. We have to STOP illegal immigration BEFORE we can begin to work on a solution for those who are already here. I made that abundantly clear, but as usual, you hear only what you wish to hear.
 
Wickedjews said:
The pretty obvious problem with that is that it DIRECTLY punishes people who want to legally immigrate, and DIRECTLY puts the illegals in front of the line. That's not going to fly.

And actually we all 1 million immigrants in total from all nations. Mexico probably provides a great deal of those. But it'd take decades to have all of our illegal immigrants naturalized under your plan, and it would also encourage people to illegally immigrate in order to take advantage of it (so you'd definitely have to have much tougher enforcement of the border for it to work).
Click to expand...

As I said... AGAIN... This would ONLY be implemented AFTER we have secured the border. And I am really really sorry to those who want to legally migrate, they will have to be inconvenienced by their fellow Mexicans who are already here. Perhaps they should have done more to discourage the illegal immigration when they had the opportunity? I'm sorry it doesn't fit your template for fairness, but I think it's probably a better idea of how to assimilate these people than lining them up in front of a ditch and shooting them in the head, or just granting them amnesty and getting Obama to declare Mexico "The 58th State!"

Also, many illegal immigrants are just looking for jobs and don't really want to be American citizens. Of course, if they stay here long enough they get attached, have children who are citizens, and the children and the later generations become increasingly Americanized.
Click to expand...

Well, regardless of what they "want" ...they can't just come here to take American jobs, and not be a part of the system. Our infrastructure is designed so that workers pay taxes, which funds the infrastructure, so it's not possible to give jobs to people who aren't citizens.

And, as my last point, I'm not sure that hispanics are going to be a solid base for Democrats forever. They're certainly very religious.
Click to expand...

But that certainly seems to be the objective and motivation for Democrats at the moment. They are indeed very religious, mostly Catholic, which happens to be very historically supportive of the Democratic party. But I tend to agree, nothing always remains the same.
 
Dixie said:
Well, regardless of what they "want" ...they can't just come here to take American jobs, and not be a part of the system. Our infrastructure is designed so that workers pay taxes, which funds the infrastructure, so it's not possible to give jobs to people who aren't citizens.
Click to expand...

Legal resident noncitizens actually do pay the same taxes as citizens. They just don't get the vote and they can be deported for practically anything.
 
Wickedjews said:
Even if we crack down heavily on official jobs there's still going to be lots of under the table work that will be very difficult to detect. Also, if we managed to actually get rid of illegals entire livelihood we'd have to make some plan to get them back to Mexico.
Click to expand...

By reforming our immigration laws, we can bring in the migrant workers under green cards. The problem is, the farmers need them, but they can't afford to hire legal migrant workers due to the costs of the current system.
 
Wickedjews said:
Legal resident noncitizens actually do pay the same taxes as citizens. They just don't get the vote and they can be deported for practically anything.
Click to expand...

Who is talking about "legal resident noncitizens?" They are not the problem, and really have nothing to do with the problem. I don't understand why you would bring them up?

Illegal aliens do not pay taxes, unless they pay a few sales taxes here and there. For the most part, their incomes are never taxed, and go straight back to Mexico. Now we can argue that some illegals have obtained false documents and fake social security numbers, and payroll taxes are deducted from their checks... but the statistics kind of speak for themselves in the border states. The cities closest to the border are having trouble providing essential services. This can only be due to a large number of people using the services, and not paying for them. There is no Federal money getting kicked in to take care of these people, and the State is basically having to foot the bill.

This is not just something that is a problem in border states, they are everywhere. I have a friend who is a second-generation roofer, and he tells me he constantly has trouble getting bids, the Mexicans will do the jobs cheaper than he can buy the materials! I told him he should learn to speak Spanish and hire some Mexicans!
 
Wickedjews said:
Legal resident noncitizens actually do pay the same taxes as citizens. They just don't get the vote and they can be deported for practically anything.
Click to expand...
Permanent residents can't be deported with out due process of law. They do pay the same taxes but are not eligible for entitlement benefits like SS or Medicare.
 
Dixie said:
Who is talking about "legal resident noncitizens?" They are not the problem, and really have nothing to do with the problem. I don't understand why you would bring them up?

Illegal aliens do not pay taxes, unless they pay a few sales taxes here and there. For the most part, their incomes are never taxed, and go straight back to Mexico. Now we can argue that some illegals have obtained false documents and fake social security numbers, and payroll taxes are deducted from their checks... but the statistics kind of speak for themselves in the border states. The cities closest to the border are having trouble providing essential services. This can only be due to a large number of people using the services, and not paying for them. There is no Federal money getting kicked in to take care of these people, and the State is basically having to foot the bill.

This is not just something that is a problem in border states, they are everywhere. I have a friend who is a second-generation roofer, and he tells me he constantly has trouble getting bids, the Mexicans will do the jobs cheaper than he can buy the materials! I told him he should learn to speak Spanish and hire some Mexicans!
Click to expand...
How about throwing the contractors who hire the illegals in jail instead?
 
Mott the Hoople said:
How about throwing the contractors who hire the illegals in jail instead?
Click to expand...

I'll answer the same way as I did in Post #3, after you posed this question in Post #2. You will not hear me defend the Bush philosophy of "jobs Americans won't do." I certainly agree, we should be punishing those who are hiring the illegals, but that is not a complete solution to the problem.

What if the contractor himself is illegal? We tend to think in terms of a stereotype, that all of these illegals are just stupid uneducated labor, who always work for someone else, usually for pennies on the dollar. But lately, many of them have become very enterprising.

Mainly, my solution plan is for what to do about the illegals already here, AFTER we have stopped the flow of new illegals coming across the border. Until we do that, nothing else matters. I am happy to amend my plan to include harsh penalties for people who hire them, I have no problem with that idea whatsoever.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top