Science doesn't know everything

PostmodernProphet said:
I'm not going anywhere, sick lying bastard....you stated God ordered rape....it shouldn't be so hard for someone who isn't a sick lying bastard to back up that claim.....show me the order.....

in considering your allegations of rape, you might want to keep in mind that one of the reasons that there was enmity between the Israelites and the Midianites was the fact that years earlier, when they had camped together near Moab the Israelites and the Midianite women had in fact had sexual relations, and the Midianite women had caused many Hebrew men to give sacrifices to Baal.....God had punished Israel with the plague at Baal Peor.....

you assume that they kept the virgins alive because they wanted them for sex.....in actuality, the virgins were the only ones kept alive because they were too young to HAVE sex, thus they wouldn't have been any of the ones involved in the Baal Peor incident.....

you sick lying bastard.....
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Your exegesis is spot on. I went through this before with bac. I provided a link to the exegesis of this passage and he chose to ignore it preferring of cousre his own special interpretation out of context to what was happening. It would be an exauhstive study all in on its own and of course out of context to the intent of the thread. It is a passage often used by God haters to put you on the defensive. If you are intrested I have a great link on this passage
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http://irregulartimes.com/secrets1.html

Don't believe that the Bible teaches genocide? Check out the following verses, just two of the many from the Bible that suggest that God himself thinks that genocide is a wonderful idea:

Observe what I command you this day. Behold, I am driving out from before you the Amorite and the Canaanite and the Hittite and the Perizzite and the Hivite and the Jebusite. Take heed to yourself, lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land where you are going, lest it be a snare in your midst. But you shall destroy their altars, break their sacred pillars, and cut down their wooden images (For you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.)

Exodus, Chapter 34, verses 11-14


You will chase your enemies, and they shall fall by the sword before you. Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall put ten thousand to flight; your enemies shall fall by the sword before you. For I will look on you favorably and make you fruitful, multiply you and confirm My covenant with you. You shall eat the old harvest, and clear out the old because of the new.

Leviticus, Chapter 26, verses 7-9
 
AssHatZombie said:
Don't believe that the Bible teaches genocide?
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???...do you know what the word genocide means?......(clue: it doesn't mean cutting down their wooden images)......if you're going to cut and paste from some half assed AtheistsRUs website, at least read the stuff you paste first......
 
AssHatZombie said:
Right. The slaughter of others was just some minor property damage, like graffiti. They're just kids blowing off steam. Cut them some slack, I mean, they are jews.....:rolleyes:
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so your mind is capable of encompassing two possibilities....either genocide or graffiti painting....I guess that helps us take measure of your depth....
 
AssHatZombie said:
http://irregulartimes.com/secrets1.html

Don't believe that the Bible teaches genocide? Check out the following verses, just two of the many from the Bible that suggest that God himself thinks that genocide is a wonderful idea:

Observe what I command you this day. Behold, I am driving out from before you the Amorite and the Canaanite and the Hittite and the Perizzite and the Hivite and the Jebusite. Take heed to yourself, lest you make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land where you are going, lest it be a snare in your midst. But you shall destroy their altars, break their sacred pillars, and cut down their wooden images (For you shall worship no other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.)

Exodus, Chapter 34, verses 11-14


You will chase your enemies, and they shall fall by the sword before you. Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall put ten thousand to flight; your enemies shall fall by the sword before you. For I will look on you favorably and make you fruitful, multiply you and confirm My covenant with you. You shall eat the old harvest, and clear out the old because of the new.

Leviticus, Chapter 26, verses 7-9
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Tribal warfare WAS a common practice in ancient times. That the story of Israel and her covenant relationship to God is told, in part, in the context of such warfare is normal. Read any civilizations historical record and see the same kind of behaviour retold.
 
Ice Dancer said:
Tribal warfare WAS a common practice in ancient times. That the story of Israel and her covenant relationship to God is told, in part, in the context of such warfare is normal. Read any civilizations historical record and see the same kind of behaviour retold.
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Atrocity was common. True. Do we let five year olds get away with the "everybody else was doing it" defense?

Why is the god with the same bankrupt morality as every other punk tribe in the desert held on such a pedestal? Look at yourself and readjust.
 
blackascoal said:
When soldiers murder the parents and siblings then take the virgin girls and divide them up to have sex with them .. it's RAPE you ignorant cunt.

AND, I posted other very clear examples of rape in the bible that can hardly be refuted .. as you know because you didn't touch them.

:0)

I win.
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Which verse ordered sexual intercourse? Because I read it, and apparently missed that one.
 
Damocles said:
Which verse ordered sexual intercourse? Because I read it, and apparently missed that one.
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he is lying...

now he says we MUST interpret the verse his way or we are being dishonest...

BAC has come into a whole new light for me...i used to respect him, but after this dishonest episode it is difficult to see any reason to.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
so your mind is capable of encompassing two possibilities....either genocide or graffiti painting....I guess that helps us take measure of your depth....
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Straw man. Dismissing the rationality of his argument using logical fallacy is funny, but not even close to "more rational".

Your attempt at reductionism fails, as does the appeal to authority. "God said so, so it was good." This is a particularly dangerous fallacy as it defies all logic. "God said so, you cannot question that."
 
Damocles said:
Straw man. Dismissing the rationality of his argument using logical fallacy is funny, but not even close to "more rational".

Your attempt at reductionism fails, as does the appeal to authority. "God said so, so it was good." This is a particularly dangerous fallacy as it defies all logic. "God said so, you cannot question that."
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hardly....if anything, his response is a strawman argument....clearly the quoted text says nothing about wiping out an entire nation of people....when challenged with that fact his response was "they weren't there to paint graffiti".....as if that somehow proved genocide was ordered.....

either the verse says what he claims it did, or it doesn't....and it doesn't....
 
AssHatZombie said:
Atrocity was common. True. Do we let five year olds get away with the "everybody else was doing it" defense?

Why is the god with the same bankrupt morality as every other punk tribe in the desert held on such a pedestal? Look at yourself and readjust.
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That's not a defense, it was just an actuality on mans existence in ancient times. If they (the Israelites) had not participated they would have been wiped out. The OT is about actuality and the picture of redemption. Also referred to as the "now and not yet". I am not asking anyone to believe the history with a heart of faith, but it is also not fair or right to misrepresent what the historical linear story tells.

Why the Israelites? Because one man had faith when all others had turned away from God and he, Abraham, became the father of nations (understood biblically as Jew and Gentile) of believers.

Again, Ahz, not asking for you to believe, only to criticize with an accurate understanding.
 
Ice Dancer said:
That's not a defense, it was just an actuality on mans existence in ancient times. If they (the Israelites) had not participated they would have been wiped out. The OT is about actuality and the picture of redemption. Also referred to as the "now and not yet". I am not asking anyone to believe the history with a heart of faith, but it is also not fair or right to misrepresent what the historical linear story tells.

Why the Israelites? Because one man had faith when all others had turned away from God and he, Abraham, became the father of nations (understood biblically as Jew and Gentile) of believers.

Again, Ahz, not asking for you to believe, only to criticize with an accurate understanding.
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You are offering it as a defense.

And you don't know what would have happened had they not participated.

There. Criticized with accuracy. Go get yourself deprogrammed from your murder supporting fairy tales.
 
Yurt said:
he is lying...

now he says we MUST interpret the verse his way or we are being dishonest...

BAC has come into a whole new light for me...i used to respect him, but after this dishonest episode it is difficult to see any reason to.
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LOL... Well at least BAC is now reading The Bible! I guess that's a start, huh?:cof1:
 
AssHatZombie said:
You are offering it as a defense.

And you don't know what would have happened had they not participated.

There. Criticized with accuracy. Go get yourself deprogrammed from your murder supporting fairy tales.
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Sure it's a defense. In ancient times the various tribes of the earth warred with one another. They enslaved their captured people, confiscated their property and layed ruin to their cities. That God operated in the context of mans fallen behavior seems pretty rational to me.

I cannot know that Israelites would have been overtaken had they not defended themselves or taken aggressive steps against their enemies? No, I cannot know for certain. Who can know for certain the alternate path of a road never taken? One can however look at certain indicators to feel more than a little confident in the wisdom of not taking a particular road though.

I recently read a statistic that there have only been 300 years in all of mans recorded history where there has been "world peace". Man it would seem cannot do without war. Hell, the conflicts on this message board prove that out. The story of the bible tells why that is...really that's the story's tale.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
hardly....if anything, his response is a strawman argument....clearly the quoted text says nothing about wiping out an entire nation of people....when challenged with that fact his response was "they weren't there to paint graffiti".....as if that somehow proved genocide was ordered.....

either the verse says what he claims it did, or it doesn't....and it doesn't....
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His response made fun of your dismissal of the order to commit genocide. It was clearly a rational response to a logical fallacy of reductionism.
 
Ice Dancer said:
Sure it's a defense. In ancient times the various tribes of the earth warred with one another. They enslaved their captured people, confiscated their property and layed ruin to their cities. That God operated in the context of mans fallen behavior seems pretty rational to me.
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Really. How awful for you.
I cannot know that Israelites would have been overtaken had they not defended themselves or taken aggressive steps against their enemies? No, I cannot know for certain. Who can know for certain the alternate path of a road never taken? One can however look at certain indicators to feel more than a little confident in the wisdom of not taking a particular road though.
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Or one can not worship a god that promotes slaughter.
I recently read a statistic that there have only been 300 years in all of mans recorded history where there has been "world peace". Man it would seem cannot do without war. Hell, the conflicts on this message board prove that out. The story of the bible tells why that is...really that's the story's tale.
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We need the unity of subservience to a common god. Right? How jihad of you.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
that was what lost you the first debate....the mistaken impression that you can totally discount any argument that doesn't conform to your beliefs.....no, you're simply a coward and not a very well educated one at that....
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Never mind the fact that you completely failed to demonstrate the relevance of that argument. Actually, it's an blatantly dishonest claim on your point as I did factually discount your argument. The fact that you ignored it was your problem.
 
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