Republicans are generally bad for the economy

[BartenderElite]

We really can't ignore the history on this. You have to go back to Reagan's 1st term to cite a time when a Republican President actually improved the economy in a sustainable way.

Bush Sr. left us w/ a Recession, Bush Jr. left us with a crash, and Trump lost more jobs than any President in modern history.

I don't necessarily disagree w/ some of the fiscal conservatism that USED to characterize the GOP. But austerity measures in general don't work during times like this. They would have been a disaster in Obama's 1st year, when everyone on the right was saying his stimulus would lead us to a Depression. Once again, they were wrong - it ended the downward spiral Obama inherited, and spurred the longest recovery we've had in the modern era.

Fool me once, shame on you & all that. Give Biden time - it's only been a year and a half, which is hardly any time at all in economic cycles. Don't buy the Republican promise that they can "fix" anything. They never have, at least w/ economics.

 

[Grokmaster]

Horse shit. The 2008 economelt was due , ENTIRELY to Democrat polices, starting with the CRA (Clinton), and the rescinding of long-standing exec orders blocking investment houses from dealing in mortgage=backed securities, people frmo going directly from an administration into the field they were regulating, etc.(ALSO CLINTON), and then, the placuing the US taxpayer, via Fannie & Freddie (The GSEs etc.) on the hook for all the SUBPRIME LOANS the CRA CAUSED, and investment houses full of former Clinton Adm. members invested in, then blaming it all on GW Bush.

Just like the Dunce-o-crats now try to "BLAME TRUMP" for the SHUTDOWNS THAT WERE ENTRIELY THEIR DOING, AND THE DAMAGE THEY CAUSED.

 

[Truth Detector]

We really can't ignore the history on this. You have to go back to Reagan's 1st term to cite a time when a Republican President actually improved the economy in a sustainable way.

Bush Sr. left us w/ a Recession, Bush Jr. left us with a crash, and Trump lost more jobs than any President in modern history.

I don't necessarily disagree w/ some of the fiscal conservatism that USED to characterize the GOP. But austerity measures in general don't work during times like this. They would have been a disaster in Obama's 1st year, when everyone on the right was saying his stimulus would lead us to a Depression. Once again, they were wrong - it ended the downward spiral Obama inherited, and spurred the longest recovery we've had in the modern era.

Fool me once, shame on you & all that. Give Biden time - it's only been a year and a half, which is hardly any time at all in economic cycles. Don't buy the Republican promise that they can "fix" anything. They never have, at least w/ economics.

Your myopic economic views are moronic and ignore reality. Biden has done more to divide us and destroy our economic future than any of his predecessors with no hint he will retreat from massive inflationary Government spending.

As for the Trump recession, what did you think would happen when everyone demanded we shut down an entire economy over Fauci's moronic advice? That was on the Chinese you dumb fuck.

Bush Jr was handed a recession from Bill Clinton. It was due to the .com bust and had nothing to do with policy.

The 2008-2009 recession had NOTHING to do with policies Bush implemented but were the result of Democrat demands with their race hustling to give unqualified loans and a greedy unrepentant market that packaged these mortgages as safe investments.

Democrats believe they can spend their way out of recessionary periods. That's stupid. Democrats think they throw money at problems, and they will go away. That's stupid. Democrats think Government is the answer to everything. That's stupid.

What we are witnessing today is how Democrats can fuck up a perfectly good recovery in the blink of an eye. They passed trillions in wasteful spending and paid people to stay at home. They worshipped Fauci and his shut down mentality which exacerbated supply lines. Had Democrats done NOTHING, we would still be in a recovery with low gas prices and moderate inflation. Instead, these morons want to double down and pass another several trillions in spending.

What do you think happens when governments print trillions of dollars without any subsequent GDP growth to support it? Dunce.

 

[cawacko]

We really can't ignore the history on this. You have to go back to Reagan's 1st term to cite a time when a Republican President actually improved the economy in a sustainable way.

Bush Sr. left us w/ a Recession, Bush Jr. left us with a crash, and Trump lost more jobs than any President in modern history.

I don't necessarily disagree w/ some of the fiscal conservatism that USED to characterize the GOP. But austerity measures in general don't work during times like this. They would have been a disaster in Obama's 1st year, when everyone on the right was saying his stimulus would lead us to a Depression. Once again, they were wrong - it ended the downward spiral Obama inherited, and spurred the longest recovery we've had in the modern era.

Fool me once, shame on you & all that. Give Biden time - it's only been a year and a half, which is hardly any time at all in economic cycles. Don't buy the Republican promise that they can "fix" anything. They never have, at least w/ economics.

For the sake of discussion please allow me to ask a couple of questions. You reference austerity measures in a time like this. I don't know how comparable what's happening now is to the past as we've not had too many instances of global pandemics shutting down good portions of the world economy. But we do know our excessive monetary and fiscal stimulus has contributed strongly to inflation we currently have. But your argument is the government and the Fed should go ahead and continue spending anyway along with the Fed either stopping rate hikes or lowering rates and stop QT to stimulate the economy?

I don't want to misrepresent what you are saying so am I understanding your position correctly?

 

[Truth Detector]

Horse shit. The 2008 economelt was due , ENTIRELY to Democrat polices, starting with the CRA (Clinton), and the rescinding of long-standing exec orders blocking investment houses from dealing in mortgage=backed securities, people frmo going directly from an administration into the field they were regulating, etc.(ALSO CLINTON), and then, the placuing the US taxpayer, via Fannie & Freddie (The GSEs etc.) on the hook for all the SUBPRIME LOANS the CRA CAUSED, and investment houses full of former Clinton Adm. members invested in, then blaming it all on GW Bush.

Just like the Dunce-o-crats now try to "BLAME TRUMP" for the SHUTDOWNS THAT WERE ENTRIELY THEIR DOING, AND THE DAMAGE THEY CAUSED.

Spot on. Democrats even attacked the person assigned to regulate Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 2004. Republicans attempted to fix it and warned about this.

Senate Committee Hearings on Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac 2004

 

[BartenderElite]

For the sake of discussion please allow me to ask a couple of questions. You reference austerity measures in a time like this. I don't know how comparable what's happening now is to the past as we've not had too many instances of global pandemics shutting down good portions of the world economy. But we do know our excessive monetary and fiscal stimulus has contributed strongly to inflation we currently have. But your argument is the government and the Fed should go ahead and continue spending anyway along with the Fed either stopping rate hikes or lowering rates and stop QT to stimulate the economy?

I don't want to misrepresent what you are saying so am I understanding your position correctly?

No. I just don't think austerity works when we're struggling - but I also think we've hit the limit of the Fed taking aggressive action.

I don't think we should do much more to "combat" inflation. It was inevitable, it's running its course, and we've already done everything that should likely be done. It becomes a game of diminishing returns at this point - I get tired of politicians taking more extreme measures just for short-term electoral prospects. And yes, that means Biden too.

I hardly think he's a great economic President, but I also know that the lag between policy and results can be much longer than the time he's been in office. He deserves a full shot to fix things. I also think Republicans have no answers when it comes to the economy. They're running primarily on "Biden is so bad, gotta get him out of there" - but I've heard no real proposals or plans to make inflation go away. Inflation is just something we have to ride out at this point, painful as it is.

 

[BartenderElite]

It's so surprising that Republicans hop on this thread to make the argument that 'everything bad that ever happened is due to Democrats, even when Republicans had power.' Just a shocker.

 

[cawacko]

No. I just don't think austerity works when we're struggling - but I also think we've hit the limit of the Fed taking aggressive action.

I don't think we should do much more to "combat" inflation. It was inevitable, it's running its course, and we've already done everything that should likely be done. It becomes a game of diminishing returns at this point - I get tired of politicians taking more extreme measures just for short-term electoral prospects. And yes, that means Biden too.

I hardly think he's a great economic President, but I also know that the lag between policy and results can be much longer than the time he's been in office. He deserves a full shot to fix things. I also think Republicans have no answers when it comes to the economy. They're running primarily on "Biden is so bad, gotta get him out of there" - but I've heard no real proposals or plans to make inflation go away. Inflation is just something we have to ride out at this point, painful as it is.

In many ways we attempted to just ride it out in the 70's and how did that work for us? The Fed under Aurther Burns would raise rates but then would stop before completing the job (stopping inflation) and it never went away. It wasn't until Volker stepped in and forced the country into recession that we finally beat inflation. If I read you correctly you're suggesting we repeat what we did in the 70's and have the Fed let inflation run wild. That's not a mindset I understand.

 

[Into the Night]

For the sake of discussion please allow me to ask a couple of questions. You reference austerity measures in a time like this. I don't know how comparable what's happening now is to the past as we've not had too many instances of global pandemics shutting down good portions of the world economy. But we do know our excessive monetary and fiscal stimulus has contributed strongly to inflation we currently have. But your argument is the government and the Fed should go ahead and continue spending anyway along with the Fed either stopping rate hikes or lowering rates and stop QT to stimulate the economy?

I don't want to misrepresent what you are saying so am I understanding your position correctly?

BartenderElite has worked himself into numerous paradoxes. He is being irrational.

 

[BidenPresident]

We really can't ignore the history on this. You have to go back to Reagan's 1st term to cite a time when a Republican President actually improved the economy in a sustainable way.

Bush Sr. left us w/ a Recession, Bush Jr. left us with a crash, and Trump lost more jobs than any President in modern history.

I don't necessarily disagree w/ some of the fiscal conservatism that USED to characterize the GOP. But austerity measures in general don't work during times like this. They would have been a disaster in Obama's 1st year, when everyone on the right was saying his stimulus would lead us to a Depression. Once again, they were wrong - it ended the downward spiral Obama inherited, and spurred the longest recovery we've had in the modern era.

Fool me once, shame on you & all that. Give Biden time - it's only been a year and a half, which is hardly any time at all in economic cycles. Don't buy the Republican promise that they can "fix" anything. They never have, at least w/ economics.

Most financial statistics I have seen show that Democrats are better for the economy.

Clinton ran on repairing the economy Reagan ruined. Obama ran on repairing the economy Bush ruined.

 

[Into the Night]

No. I just don't think austerity works when we're struggling

Trying to print your way out of a depression doesn't work, dude.

- but I also think we've hit the limit of the Fed taking aggressive action.

There shouldn't be a Fed. Communism doesn't work. The fiat dollar is unconstitutional. The reason why is only too painfully obvious.

I don't think we should do much more to "combat" inflation.

You can't combat inflation with inflation, dude.

It was inevitable, it's running its course, and we've already done everything that should likely be done.

No. The Fed should be dissolved and ALL the gold the government stole should be returned to the estates of those they stole it from. This, of course, would lead to the destruction of most of the government.

It becomes a game of diminishing returns at this point - I get tired of politicians taking more extreme measures just for short-term electoral prospects. And yes, that means Biden too.

The destruction of the government is cast in stone now. It will be an uncontrolled cash crash. It's already in progress.

I hardly think he's a great economic President, but I also know that the lag between policy and results can be much longer than the time he's been in office. He deserves a full shot to fix things.

Biden and the Democrats are CAUSING these things. No. Overthrow The Oligarchy. Restore the republic. If that can happen peacefully in November, so be it. One way or the other though, it WILL happen.

I also think Republicans have no answers when it comes to the economy.

Live within your means. The government is not doing that. It's really pretty simple.

They're running primarily on "Biden is so bad, gotta get him out of there" - but I've heard no real proposals or plans to make inflation go away.

It won't go away. Fiat currency is failing all over the world, the States included. The world has never been here before.

Inflation is just something we have to ride out at this point, painful as it is.

No. People will simply start using something else for currency. No government can stop that.

 

[Into the Night]

Most financial statistics I have seen show that Democrats are better for the economy.

Clinton ran on repairing the economy Reagan ruined. Obama ran on repairing the economy Bush ruined.

Argument from randU fallacies. Making up numbers and using them as data is a fallacy, dude.
Fiction isn't helping you either.

 

[BartenderElite]

In many ways we attempted to just ride it out in the 70's and how did that work for us? The Fed under Aurther Burns would raise rates but then would stop before completing the job (stopping inflation) and it never went away. It wasn't until Volker stepped in and forced the country into recession that we finally beat inflation. If I read you correctly you're suggesting we repeat what we did in the 70's and have the Fed let inflation run wild. That's not a mindset I understand.

I mean, it's hardly apples to apples. I don't know where in the world you're getting that I think we should "repeat what we did in the 70's." If that's what you want to believe, fine.

We're probably already in a Recession. Inflation is more likely to take care of itself than any further gov't action - which you seem to be advocating.

 

[Into the Night]

It's so surprising that Republicans hop on this thread to make the argument that 'everything bad that ever happened is due to Democrats, even when Republicans had power.' Just a shocker.

Word stuffing. Stop making shit up.

 

[Into the Night]

I mean, it's hardly apples to apples. I don't know where in the world you're getting that I think we should "repeat what we did in the 70's." If that's what you want to believe, fine.

We're probably already in a Recession. Inflation is more likely to take care of itself than any further gov't action - which you seem to be advocating.

Irrational. Which is it, dude?

 

[cawacko]

I mean, it's hardly apples to apples. I don't know where in the world you're getting that I think we should "repeat what we did in the 70's." If that's what you want to believe, fine.

We're probably already in a Recession. Inflation is more likely to take care of itself than any further gov't action - which you seem to be advocating.

My apologies if I misunderstood but that was my interpretation of your 'letting it run its course' comment. Keeping easy money flowing is just going to prolong inflation (you said the Fed has hit the limit of taking aggressive action - i.e. they don't need to raise rates anymore). Yes, I believe the Fed needs to continue raising rates until we've wrung inflation out of the system (in a similar method to Volker).

 

[LV426]

We really can't ignore the history on this. You have to go back to Reagan's 1st term to cite a time when a Republican President actually improved the economy in a sustainable way.

Bush Sr. left us w/ a Recession, Bush Jr. left us with a crash, and Trump lost more jobs than any President in modern history.

I don't necessarily disagree w/ some of the fiscal conservatism that USED to characterize the GOP. But austerity measures in general don't work during times like this. They would have been a disaster in Obama's 1st year, when everyone on the right was saying his stimulus would lead us to a Depression. Once again, they were wrong - it ended the downward spiral Obama inherited, and spurred the longest recovery we've had in the modern era.

Fool me once, shame on you & all that. Give Biden time - it's only been a year and a half, which is hardly any time at all in economic cycles. Don't buy the Republican promise that they can "fix" anything. They never have, at least w/ economics.

Absolutely fucking true.

A year after the GOP passed the Russia Tax Cut, manufacturing plunged into a recession and the rest of the economy followed the month before any COVID lockdowns.

 

[LV426]

My apologies if I misunderstood but that was my interpretation of your 'letting it run its course' comment. Keeping easy money flowing is just going to prolong inflation (you said the Fed has hit the limit of taking aggressive action - i.e. they don't need to raise rates anymore). Yes, I believe the Fed needs to continue raising rates until we've wrung inflation out of the system (in a similar method to Volker).

It's not inflation, it's price gouging.

The true inflation rate is whatever the rate is for wage growth...anything above that is corporate price gouging and greed.

 

[LV426]

My apologies if I misunderstood but that was my interpretation of your 'letting it run its course' comment. Keeping easy money flowing is just going to prolong inflation (you said the Fed has hit the limit of taking aggressive action - i.e. they don't need to raise rates anymore). Yes, I believe the Fed needs to continue raising rates until we've wrung inflation out of the system (in a similar method to Volker).

I have very, very, very, very bad news for you.

Raising interest rates right now isn't going to affect inflation at all because it's not inflation we are experiencing...it is price gouging.

You know it's not inflation because wages haven't inflated at the same rate, and inflation affects every dollar equally.

So the real inflation rate is whatever the rate is for wage growth and everything above that is just greed.

 

[LV426]

Spot on. Democrats even attacked the person assigned to regulate Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 2004. Republicans attempted to fix it and warned about this.

Nope. Wrong.

Completely fucking wrong.

A lie.

It was the Bush Administration that put the kibosh on the bipartisan GSE reform in 2005, NOT DEMOCRATS you fucking liar:

"Strong opposition by the Bush administration forced a top Republican congressman to delay a vote on a bill that would create a new regulator for mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac."
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/oxley-pulls-fannie-freddie-bill-under-heat-from-bush

"Despite what appeared to be a broad consensus on GSE regulatory reform, efforts quickly stalled. A legislative markup scheduled for October 8, 2003, in the House of Representatives was halted because the Bush administration withdrew its support for the bill"
https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.392.8455&rep=rep1&type=pdf

So you're lying again because you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.