Question for the mask experts

[Into the Night]

People who wear safety belts are less likely to get into accidents.

Nope. Same number of accidents, whether you wear a seat belt or not. Seat belts do not prevent accidents. The can, however, mitigate the results of an accident.

They care enough to wear safety belts, so they care about other things.

Seat belts are not a mask.

Teflon does not care about protecting himself and others from getting Covid-19,

He does not have Covid19. Masks do not stop a virus.

which does have a bearing on whether he is infectious or not.

None. He is not infected, he cannot infect anyone.

 

[Into the Night]

Maybe a marketing thing who knows. Damn things are made in China, ask them.

Pretty much. Surgical N95 masks are colored green or blue (not white) and are packaged in sterile packaging.

Why do healthcare people wear N-95’s—and not surgical masks, when working with or around COVID patients?

They are both N95 masks. One is simply packaged in sterile packaging.

Back before Fauci and the CDC, pointlessly, knocked me off my job we were bitching about only having one N-95 a piece—because they were intended for single use *because masks aren’t supposed to go from one patient or setting to the next*.

Correct.

Could it possibly be because surgical and cloth masks are useless lol? Stop being led by the nose by the ‘experts’ and start thinking for yourself.

I don't think he can. He is too used to stealing the arguments of others as his own, and too used to making bigoted comments, as if he can speak for the whole world or something.

 

[Into the Night]

And that's because the leader of the dumb party has made noncompliance a symbol of support.
Republicans are hellbent of behaving stupidly in every way about everything. It's disgusting.

Inversion fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

Good idea. I think I'll start designing bridges using my law skills.

So you have forgone any attempt at learning. Gotit.

 

[Into the Night]

hahahahahahahahahaha wearing a seatbelt does absolutely NOTHING to reduce the risk of getting into an accident. hahahahahahahahaha

If I did signatures, I'd put this beauty in it...


Caring about "one thing" does not mean that someone also cares about "other things".

Divisional Error Fallacy. (right ITN? I think I've got the identification of this fallacy down now)

You are quite correct. This was also a strawman fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

N95s respirators regulated under product code MSH are class II medical devices exempt from 510(k) premarket notification, unless:

The respirator is intended to prevent specific diseases or infections, or
The respirator is labeled or otherwise represented as filtering surgical smoke or plumes, filtering specific amounts of viruses or bacteria, reducing the amount of and/or killing viruses, bacteria, or fungi, or affecting allergenicity, or
The respirator contains coating technologies unrelated to filtration (e.g., to reduce and or kill microorganisms).
The FDA has a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) with CDC NIOSH which outlines the framework for coordination and collaboration between the FDA and NIOSH for regulation of this subset of N95 respirators.

For additional differences between surgical masks and N95 respirators, please see CDC’s infographic.


https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices...-respirators-surgical-masks-and-face-masks#s3

False authority fallacy. The CDC does not establish the N95 specification.

 

[Into the Night]

I like experts.

Define 'expert'.

If I'm getting heart surgery, I prefer someone who has studied the topic, and who may even have a little experience.

What about the incompetent surgeon that has a license?

If I need a house built, I'd probably hire someone w/ some actual experience, ya know...building houses.

Anyone can build a house. If you hire out house building, you need a license. Frankly, there are some pretty crappy house builders for hire out there.

I know the current right-wing trend is to marginalize expertise, experience & knowledge.

Considering the pilots that I see get lost or crash, drunk ship captains that run around and damage or destroy their vessel, the electricians I've seen that wire a plug backwards (unsafe!) or otherwise do not follow the electrical code, plumbers that improperly vent a sewer system or damage house structure with their torches, or set up a galvanic corrosion problem with their fixtures, doctors that treat the wrong patient or misdiagnose a patient, surgeons that leave gauze or even instruments inside patients, chemists that blow themselves up or cause problems by mishandling chemicals, auto mechanics that fuck up trying to change a tire or remove a bolt, aircraft mechanics that use incorrect fasteners, make bubblegum welds, or severely damage rocker bearings trying to remove a cylinder on an engine, etc., programmers that can't sort a list of numbers or reverse a string in memory; I find licenses or other credentials to be pretty meaningless.

We've tried that a few times in human history, and the results have been less than stellar.

'Expert' worship. Go read the N95 specifications. Masks do not stop a virus.

 

[Walt]

Less than 1% of the population is not a concern.

Just one person with a contagious disease would be a concern. 1% of the population with a contagious disease is a disaster.

 

[Walt]

I don't have AIDS either. I am not spreading AIDS or Covid19.

Everyone who spreads AIDS says, "I don't have AIDS". Given that they spread AIDS, we know they are wrong. Maybe you are right, or maybe you are wrong. I will not have sex with you for so many reasons, but if I hypothetically did, I would not believe you, and wear a condom.

Many of the super-spreaders of Covid-19 are claiming they do not have Covid-19. They need to wear masks to reduce their super spreading.

 

[Into the Night]

Just one person with a contagious disease would be a concern. 1% of the population with a contagious disease is a disaster.

No, it isn't. You have a very strange idea of what a 'disaster' is. Fear mongering.

 

[Into the Night]

Everyone who spreads AIDS says, "I don't have AIDS". Given that they spread AIDS, we know they are wrong. Maybe you are right, or maybe you are wrong. I will not have sex with you for so many reasons, but if I hypothetically did, I would not believe you, and wear a condom.

Strawman fallacy. Covid is not spread by sexual contact. It is an airborne respiratory virus. It does not attack the immune system.

Many of the super-spreaders of Covid-19 are claiming they do not have Covid-19. They need to wear masks to reduce their super spreading.

Masks do not stop viruses. See the N95 specifications.
If you are not infected, it is not possible to spread the virus to others, dumbass.
If you ARE infected, and not coughing or showing any other symptoms, you are not spreading it.

 

[anonymoose]

No, it isn't. You have a very strange idea of what a 'disaster' is. Fear mongering.

Even more strange is this disease. Either deathly ill people are out and about spreading the disease or this is a disease that has no symptoms and the body's immune system takes care of it.

 

[gfm7175]

Well, at least in Washington, most people aren't wearing a mask, despite Inslee's order requiring them. Yeah, I kinda miss the open roads. Now I have to put with a lot of idiot drivers again.

My cousin's employer is now requiring their employees to wear masks. He told them that he is not going to comply with that policy. (He said he will wear one if a tenant that he is doing a maintenance request for requests that he wear one, but otherwise he is not going to wear one around everywhere he goes). I assume that they will just let him do that instead, but we'll see.

 

[Into the Night]

Even more strange is this disease. Either deathly ill people are out and about spreading the disease or this is a disease that has no symptoms and the body's immune system takes care of it.

As far as the hypochondriacs are concerned, that seems to be what they are arguing.

Of course, someone that is infected can infect another if they cough or sneeze on them. The virus is also airborne, It's everywhere anyway.

 

[Walt]

Strawman fallacy. Covid is not spread by sexual contact. It is an airborne respiratory virus.

So as long as you have not been having sex recently, nor sharing needles, then we can believe you are HIV-free. I still would not risk it by having unprotected sex with you, but then again, I would not have any sort of sex with you.

We have no way of knowing if you really are Covid-19 free. As long as you are breathing, you are at risk. Which is why I do not want to breath your breath droplets. I want you to wear a mask if you are around me.

 

[Into the Night]

My cousin's employer is now requiring their employees to wear masks. He told them that he is not going to comply with that policy. (He said he will wear one if a tenant that he is doing a maintenance request for requests that he wear one, but otherwise he is not going to wear one around everywhere he goes). I assume that they will just let him do that instead, but we'll see.

Some employers are requiring masks on their employees at all times, others don't give a shit.

 

[Walt]

As far as the hypochondriacs are concerned, that seems to be what they are arguing.

Of course, someone that is infected can infect another if they cough or sneeze on them. The virus is also airborne, It's everywhere anyway.

It is not "everywhere". It is not in New Zealand, nor in most of Taiwan or several other countries. They were able to stop it through testing, contact tracing, social distancing, AND MASKS.

 

[Stretch]

It's nice to be in a smaller country...particularly an island.

 

[Into the Night]

So as long as you have not been having sex recently, nor sharing needles, then we can believe you are HIV-free. I still would not risk it by having unprotected sex with you, but then again, I would not have any sort of sex with you.

Strawman fallacy.

We have no way of knowing if you really are Covid-19 free.

You don't get to speak for others. You only get to speak for you. I don't give a shit if you know whether I am Covid19 free or not.

As long as you are breathing, you are at risk.

Certainly. Covid19 is an airborne respiratory virus. I don't even have to be near an infected person.

Which is why I do not want to breath your breath droplets.

You don't have to.

I want you to wear a mask if you are around me.

Masks do not stop viruses.

Stay in your basement with your agoraphobia. People are out there not wearing masks and enjoying the summer as best as they can, despite people like you.

 

[Walt]

My cousin's employer is now requiring their employees to wear masks. He told them that he is not going to comply with that policy. (He said he will wear one if a tenant that he is doing a maintenance request for requests that he wear one, but otherwise he is not going to wear one around everywhere he goes). I assume that they will just let him do that instead, but we'll see.

I am seeing that in a couple of cases. An associate of mine who I was trying to get a job for refuses to wear a mask, refuses to use a clear backpack, and just about everything else. It is really bizarre that he keeps complaining on Facebook that he can't pay his mortgage, but is refusing excellent paying work.

People who refuse to comply with safety rules where they work should not get unemployment. They have been offered a job, and decided they prefer unemployment. I am tired of hearing their complaining, when there are so many with real problems to complain about.