Poor Lil Waxman

[Topspin]

Topper: If you want to make the claim that the elimination of the tax deductibility of the federal subsidy for corporations offering retiree drug benefits is an instance of Obama breaking his tax promise, more power to you. Good luck with that.

if thousand lose it and I'm betting at least that many will you'd be retarded or a hack to claim otherwise. As someone who would say democrat's shit taste good even without ketchup I'm sure you'll never cop to it. In case you haven't noticed employee benefits have been under serious assault. Claiming billions more cost to provide them is not going to reduce the number recieving them is hackery of the highest order.

 

[Bonestorm]

if thousand lose it and I'm betting at least that many will you'd be retarded or a hack to claim otherwise. As someone who would say democrat's shit taste good even without ketchup I'm sure you'll never cop to it. In case you haven't noticed employee benefits have been under serious assault. Claiming billions more cost to provide them is not going to reduce the number recieving them is hackery of the highest order.

I've already said that some might lose it. At the same time, the government is expanding Medicare Part D. On balance it is a net benefit to seniors.

As I said earlier, quit hiding behind Grandma's skirt. This is a corporate welfare issue and you like corporate welfare.

 

[Topspin]

UPDATE 2-FACTBOX-U.S. health overhaul to hit corporate profits
Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:34pm EDTStocks
AT&T Inc.
T.N
$25.88
-0.63-2.38%
1:31pm CDT
Caterpillar Inc.
CAT.N
$63.16
-0.32-0.50%
1:31pm CDT
Deere & Company
DE.N
$61.33
-0.02-0.03%
1:31pm CDT
(Adds Illinois Tool Works)

March 30 (Reuters) - U.S. companies have started to tally up the financial hit they say they will take as a result of the U.S. healthcare overhaul signed into law last week by President Barack Obama.

The government continues to pay subsidies to large companies, including AT&T Inc (T.N), Caterpillar Inc (CAT.N) and Deere & Co (DE.N), to help pay for prescription drug benefits for their large ranks of retirees. [ID:nHEALTH]

However, the revamped law no longer allows companies to deduct the amount of the subsidies from their taxable income. Corporate America complains that the change amounts to a tax hike, while the White House says it essentially closes a tax loophole.

Not all big companies are warning of trouble. General Electric Co (GE.N), for example, says it does not expect a "significant material impact" on its first-quarter results.

But a number of large U.S. employers have started detailing the expected hit to their bottom line. The latest warning came from Illinois Tool Works Inc (ITW.N), which on Tuesday said it would take a $22 million charge related to the change.

The tally so far:

* AT&T said it would record a $1 billion noncash charge for the first quarter and evaluate prospective changes to the healthcare benefits it offers to both active and retired workers. [ID:nN26192636]

* Deere, a maker of farm equipment, said it expects to record a $150 million charge, mostly in its current fiscal second quarter. The expense was not included in the company's earlier 2010 forecast, which called for net income of about $1.3 billion. [ID:nN25216862]

* Caterpillar described the regulatory change as a tax hike. It said accounting standards require the world's largest maker of earth-moving equipment to book a $100 million after-tax charge to reflect the change during the first quarter. [ID:nN24185079]

* No. 2 life insurer Prudential Financial Inc (PRU.N), said it expects a $100 million charge during the first quarter. [ID:nWNAB4727]

* 3M Co (MMM.N), which makes products ranging from Post-It notes to optical films for flat-panel televisions, will record a one-time non-cash charge of up to $90 million, or 12 cents per share. [ID:nN26208452]

* Diversified U.S. manufacturer Honeywell International Inc (HON.N) in January estimated that healthcare reform would trim its first-quarter earnings by 4 cents to 5 cents per share. A Honeywell spokesman said last week that the company had not updated the earlier cost estimate and would continue to review the legislation. [ID:nN19115164]

* AK Steel Holding Corp (AKS.N) will record a non-cash charge of about $31 million in the first quarter due to a reduction in the value of its deferred tax asset as a result of a change to the tax treatment of Medicare Part D reimbursements. [ID:nWNAB2847]

* Diversified manufacturer ITW said it would take a $22 million charge for the change, lowering its first quarter earnings per share by 4 cents. [ID:nN30186804]

* Valero Energy Corp (VLO.N) said it expects to take a charge of $15 million to $20 million in the first quarter due to the new healthcare legislation, and said it expects further tax costs to be calculated later. [ID:nN26150538]

* Metals processor Allegheny Technologies Inc (ATI.N) looks for a first-quarter one-time, non-cash charge of about $5 million, or 5 cents per share, due to the new healthcare law. [ID:nWNAB4692]

(Editing by Richard Chang, Bernard Orr)

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Wait a minute, aren't you the guy that kept on insisting on "decoupling" health insurance from the employer-employee relationship? What happened to that guy? Oh, right. That's no longer a positive outcome when you can use it to bash Democrats. I get it.

My god you are a fucking moron. Keep spinning up your ignorance... it is quite amusing. The over all health care should indeed go back to an individual basis. But with the passage of THIS bill, that is NOT going to be an option you fucking moron. In case you hadn't noticed, this bill is going to be detrimental to the individual insurance market. They would thus be shifted to Medicare. An inferior product that would end up costing the government more money than they are spending on the tax deductibility. Something that was pointed out to your master Waxman and the other moronic Dems that voted for this bill.

Some companies may no longer agree to provide retiree drug benefits, others may keep it despite the loss of this modest tax subsidy as a competitive advantage.

ROFLMAO... keep calling it modest... that is a true gem.

Now... tell us oh wise one. What 'competitive advantage' would they have for keeping RETIREES on their drug plan? Perhaps the older people on the plan make the costs lower for the plan overall?

The article does indeed support my point. Doing away with this corporate welfare tax subsidy is not that big a deal. It appear to be a huge deal because companies have to account for the present value of all future costs associated with the loss of the subsidy. Based on the overall capitalization of these companies, this is a very modest hit.

Regardless of whether this elimination of corporate welfare was part of the Affordable Care Act, it is good policy. Franky, I thought someone who, like you, has oftentimes voiced your opposition to employer provided health insurance and federal policies subsidizing employer provided health insurance, would agree. I suppose that in the end you're just a hack opportunist.

Again you moron... it is not a 'big deal' in terms of long term profitability of the company. It is a big deal in the sense they will DUMP THE RETIREES from their plans and push them on to Medicare.

Again you moron.... I am a proponent of individual plans. But those are not an option in this scenario. This bill of yours is going to kill the individual market. This bill of yours is going to drive up costs. This bill of yours is going to be detrimental to the long term economic stability of this country. This bill of yours is going to blow up in our faces. THAT is a big deal. THIS is just the first of many straws.

 

[Bonestorm]

It's good to know that SF will staunchly defend stupid corporate welfare policies so long as he can attack a Democrat while doing so.

As it stands, the idea that the government should not give corporations $1300 per retiree in a subsidy while permitting corporations to deduct that $1300 from their taxes should not be such a partisan issue. That one of the resident board "deficit hawks" is so staunchly opposed to ending this corporate tax loophole blows my mind. I suppose I should have expected as much.

 

[Topspin]

two things, you talk as if the shysters on Wall Street are the ones who own AT&T. It's millions of middle class folk who own it and potentially millions who might get dropped by your cutting of the corporate welfare. HC reform is wonderful when a D does it , it's corp welfare when seniors get it from a republican. thanks I got it now

 

[Cancel 2018. 3]

two things, you talk as if the shysters on Wall Street are the ones who own AT&T. It's millions of middle class folk who own it and potentially millions who might get dropped by your cutting of the corporate welfare. HC reform is wonderful when a D does it , it's corp welfare when seniors get it from a republican. thanks I got it now

exactly

 

[Bonestorm]

exactly

Yes, exactly. This is exactly the reason that, while everyone talks a big game about cutting waste, no one ever does anything to accomplish it.

Here, we have corporations not only receiving a federal subsidy, but being permitted to deduct the value of that subsidy from their taxable income. The Affordable Care Act got rid of that ridiculous tax deduction, not the subsidy itself, and response is a full-fledged shit-storm.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

It's good to know that SF will staunchly defend stupid corporate welfare policies so long as he can attack a Democrat while doing so.

As it stands, the idea that the government should not give corporations $1300 per retiree in a subsidy while permitting corporations to deduct that $1300 from their taxes should not be such a partisan issue. That one of the resident board "deficit hawks" is so staunchly opposed to ending this corporate tax loophole blows my mind. I suppose I should have expected as much.

Again, to the complete party hack that cannot do anything but defend his masters.... I am not supporting the corporations you fucking moron. I am stating that WAXMAN IS A FUCKING IDIOT FOR CALLING A HEARING ON THIS ISSUE WHEN IT HAS ALREADY BEEN DISCUSSED. SO ENOUGH OF YOUR FUCKING IGNORANT STRAWMEN ATTEMPTS.

Also, to the complete party hack that cannot do anything but defend his masters. By doing this..... THE DEFICIT WILL INCREASE.... NOT DECREASE... if the corporations do indeed dump the retirees. A point you continue to ignrore or perhaps are simply to ignorant to comprehend.

 

[cawacko]

Again, to the complete party hack that cannot do anything but defend his masters.... I am not supporting the corporations you fucking moron. I am stating that WAXMAN IS A FUCKING IDIOT FOR CALLING A HEARING ON THIS ISSUE WHEN IT HAS ALREADY BEEN DISCUSSED. SO ENOUGH OF YOUR FUCKING IGNORANT STRAWMEN ATTEMPTS.

Also, to the complete party hack that cannot do anything but defend his masters. By doing this..... THE DEFICIT WILL INCREASE.... NOT DECREASE... if the corporations do indeed dump the retirees. A point you continue to ignrore or perhaps are simply to ignorant to comprehend.

So what will the net effect be of people being dropped from the corporate plan into Medicare? It seems they are going to get an inferior product and place more of a burden on the government?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

So what will the net effect be of people being dropped from the corporate plan into Medicare? It seems they are going to get an inferior product and place more of a burden on the government?

That is indeed what is expected to happen. But hey... this is a good thing according to Dung. More people on the government dole. More people relying on a system that is grossly underfunded. But do not fret... Obama says its ok... and that is all Dung needs to hear.

 

[Bonestorm]

So what will the net effect be of people being dropped from the corporate plan into Medicare? It seems they are going to get an inferior product and place more of a burden on the government?

Actually, that's the issue to be addressed at the hearing. So, we'll see.

Frankly, I find it very hard to believe that companies will no longer offer benefits to retirees on the grounds that the tax deductibility of a federal subsidy provided to them is taken away.

 

[Topspin]

Actually, that's the issue to be addressed at the hearing. So, we'll see.

Frankly, I find it very hard to believe that companies will no longer offer benefits to retirees on the grounds that the tax deductibility of a federal subsidy provided to them is taken away.

are you a school teacher? Companies are ditching benefits for a lot of different reasons, saving a billion or hundreds of millions would trump all of them.