Poll: Barack Obama 42%, Ron Paul 41%

Socrtease said:
And if it was guys like you that dominated the GOP primaries Paul would win hands down. But social conservatives won't vote for him. He got 21 total delegates in 2008. Results of the 2008 Republican Party presidential primaries - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia are the results of ALL the 2008 republican primaries. He is not one of the popular kids in the GOP. The party appartus works against him. He is a libertarian's wet dream, but a dream nonetheless.
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In primary polls he wins about 8% of the vote, which is, of course, greatly up from this period in 2006. But I don't think he has much more to gain.
 
Southern Man said:
So drug laws are racist?
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Yes, blacks and hispanics go to prison in rates much higher than their involvment in drugs. Crack cocaine is sentenced 100x more severely than powder cocaine, even though their active ingredient is identical. If you get caught selling crack, 5 grams will get you a 10 year mandatory sentence while you have to sell 500 grams of powder cocaine to get the same sentence.
 
cawacko said:
Regardless of whether you want to call it racist or not the fact of the matter is they overwhemingly hit young poor black men and have done great damage in the black community.
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If you look at the focus of the drug enforcement and the sentences given, the war on drugs is very racist and has caused a huge amount of hamr.
 
cawacko said:
Regardless of whether you want to call it racist or not the fact of the matter is they overwhemingly hit young poor black men and have done great damage in the black community.
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You can equate lack of fathers for that, not drug laws.
 
Socrtease said:
Yes, blacks and hispanics go to prison in rates much higher than their involvment in drugs. Crack cocaine is sentenced 100x more severely than powder cocaine, even though their active ingredient is identical. If you get caught selling crack, 5 grams will get you a 10 year mandatory sentence while you have to sell 500 grams of powder cocaine to get the same sentence.
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I thought Obama eliminated the disparity?
 
Socrtease said:
Yes, blacks and hispanics go to prison in rates much higher than their involvment in drugs. Crack cocaine is sentenced 100x more severely than powder cocaine, even though their active ingredient is identical. If you get caught selling crack, 5 grams will get you a 10 year mandatory sentence while you have to sell 500 grams of powder cocaine to get the same sentence.
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Whites don't have access to crack?

Fertilizer has the same ingredients as a bomb. Do we regulate both the same?
 
Superfreak said:
Ummm... if you look at the statistics, it is very hard to argue that he is wrong. Look at sentencing of a black man vs. a white man for the same crimes. I do not have one of the studies at my fingertips, but it isn't even close to being fair.

The drug war also discriminates against the poor vs. the rich. Which should also not occur.
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It's a stretch to call the war on drugs racist. Crime has always been more prevalent in poor neighborhoods where heavy drug use of narcotics is rampant. I would agree that due to earlier racism in this country more black people, per capita, make up a decidedly higher ratio of poor neighborhoods.

Because crime is higher in poor neighborhoods, more cops are in poor neighborhoods, hence more arrests.

As to sentencing guidelines that show a racial bias, I searched to find statistical links and couldn't find any...do you have a link?
 
Socrtease said:
And if it was guys like you that dominated the GOP primaries Paul would win hands down. But social conservatives won't vote for him. He got 21 total delegates in 2008. Results of the 2008 Republican Party presidential primaries - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia are the results of ALL the 2008 republican primaries. He is not one of the popular kids in the GOP. The party appartus works against him. He is a libertarian's wet dream, but a dream nonetheless.
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If guys like him were mainstream within the GOP, then I would join them. Part of the reason RP cannot win the GOP is that many who are fiscal conservatives and social moderates remain independent and in many states that means we cannot vote in primaries.

Sooner or later our populace will awaken to the fact that we need consistent options other than the two highly corrupt parties we currently have.

Libertarians, Greens etc... somehow we need to level the playing field. The two major parties are so entrenched that the barriers to entry are too high.
 
Superfreak said:
That is not what was said. It was said that the war on drugs is a racist policy.

The laws are fair, but the prosecution of those violating the laws is not.
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Aren't more blacks arrested for doing drugs? Again, this can be equated to lack of fathers in the home. If white fathers abandoned their families at the same rate as blacks I'd expect an equivalent number of whites be prosecuted for drug crimes.

Why not address the cause of a problem instead of claiming that something's racist? Are you suggesting that we need affirmative action when hauling folks off to jail?
 
Here is the publishe Results from the 2008 National Survey on Drug Use and Health: Natiional Findings. Statistically drug use among blacks and whites is less than 2% different, yet blacks are prosecuted far more than whites, primarily because law enforcement focuses on minority areas.
 
Southern Man said:
Aren't more blacks arrested for doing drugs? Again, this can be equated to lack of fathers in the home. If white fathers abandoned their families at the same rate as blacks I'd expect an equivalent number of whites be prosecuted for drug crimes.

Why not address the cause of a problem instead of claiming that something's racist? Are you suggesting that we need affirmative action when hauling folks off to jail?
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Yes, more are arrested, that is the point. Law enforcement disproportionately targets low income/minority areas. I would like to see your evidence that it has ANYTHING to do with lack of fathers in the home. As Soc just stated, drug use is less than 2% different from black to white. So why do cops target low income or minority areas and not the upper class or white neighborhoods?

I am addressing the cause of the problem. As is Ron Paul. Legalize the drugs and treat addicts like you would alcoholics. The drug war is a vast waste of money, time and other resources.
 
Superfreak said:
If guys like him were mainstream within the GOP, then I would join them. Part of the reason RP cannot win the GOP is that many who are fiscal conservatives and social moderates remain independent and in many states that means we cannot vote in primaries.

Sooner or later our populace will awaken to the fact that we need consistent options other than the two highly corrupt parties we currently have.

Libertarians, Greens etc... somehow we need to level the playing field. The two major parties are so entrenched that the barriers to entry are too high.
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The Green and Libertarian message could probably appeal to at most 5-10% of the population. In a plurality system, you really need to be able to maintain at least 20% support at the national level to maintain a party and win a few seats (though you'll win far less than 20% of the seats). Even the people whom the Green or Libertarian message appeals to don't vote for the parties, so yes, it does suppress their vote percentage, but they wouldn't be winning if their votes weren't strategically suppressed anyway.

The only place the Greens are competitive, for instance, is San Fransisco, obviously one of the most liberal places in the country, and even there they're in an extreme minority. At the end of the day it's a lot easier to just run in a party primary than to try to bring the whole system down.
 
Socrtease said:
Here is the publishe Results from the 2008 National Survey on Drug Use and Health: Natiional Findings. Statistically drug use among blacks and whites is less than 2% different, yet blacks are prosecuted far more than whites, primarily because law enforcement focuses on minority areas.
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That's probably because whites have jobs and use that money to buy drugs and blacks commit crimes to buy drugs.
 
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