Darth Omar
Russian asset
Well, it's a little late for that now. But ISIS could have been contained, under Obama and Clinton, had we kept sufficient forces in Iraq.
Like Bush II warned:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RRdoiTH_iZg
Pence won on style.
- Thread starter Jarod
- Start date
Well, it's a little late for that now. But ISIS could have been contained, under Obama and Clinton, had we kept sufficient forces in Iraq.
Like Bush II warned:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RRdoiTH_iZg
Althea
Althea told me...
Hmmm...so why didn't the idiot son renegotiate the Status of Arms agreement then?
Assuming arguendo that your claim about 'what would have been' would have worked.
Please explain how, and when you think we would have pulled troops out?
Obama's original sin was calling ISIS "JV" and letting them roam unmolested as they occupied city after city in Iraq.
That was a big deal-
if Iran hadn't come in to go after ISIS, the Iraqi army would not fight ( they abandoned even their tank columns) until bolstered by Iran
That was a big deal-
if Iran hadn't come in to go after ISIS, the Iraqi army would not fight ( they abandoned even their tank columns) until bolstered by Iran
Darth Omar
Russian asset
You're not paying attention lol.
You don't pull troops out---you leave a residual number so things like ISIS don't spring up. Bush intended for the SOFA to be renegotiated----that was the topic of the video clip.
It's what he was talking about. Obama didn't listen and the rest is history.
Completely.
Splendid.
That his critics distort doesn't diminish Obama.
FYI:
ISIL's senior military commanders are former senior Iraqi military.
Anyone that wants to point the finger of blame for ISIL should point the finger of blame at the man, the U.S. president that made the "Commander in Chief" decision to fire the senior Iraqi military command, instead of retaining them.
Bush just isn't very bright.
President Bush (younger) is the one that set the groundwork for ISIL.
Blaming Obama is ridiculous.
& removing Malomar Quadaffi created a similar mess.
Thus the wisdom of Thomas Jefferson's wise words:
how were we supposed to"annex" bases overseas? What solid,un-errable options did Putin have in Crimea?
You keep coming up with these "could have worked" when in fact Putin needed something dead solid certain.
why did Putin opt for this scenario? Because it's Sevastopol in his pocket. guaranteed
We were supposed to annex bases overseas?!
"What solid,un-errable options did Putin have in Crimea?"
"You keep coming up with these "could have worked""[/quote]
False!
Your assertion was:
"the only sure way to do it was by annexation."
I never said every other option, or ANY other option was iron-clad.
I simply stated the undisputed fact that there were other options, some of which could have resulted in a Crimea / Russia merger, that would have avoided the scorn that attends military conquest in the 3rd Millennium.
"when in fact Putin needed something dead solid certain."
piffle
What dire consequence would have resulted if Crimea retained its sovereignty for another minute, another day, another week, another month, another year, another decade, another century, another millennium?
"why did Putin opt for this scenario? Because it's Sevastopol in his pocket. guaranteed"
Your premise is your conclusion.
You prove to me Sevastopol would not have been Putin's if he'd used peaceful, lawful means. You prove that, then we can debate it further. UNTIL you prove that; you're just blowing it out your %$#.
ridiculous. you keep saying "Putin could have done this" (plebiscite). Or he didn't have to act.
I don't think you understand that the Black Sea naval Base is Putin's window thru the Bosporous,and the warm waters of the Mediterranean.
With Tartus now getting upgrades,and a new air base in Syria Putin cannot chance any loss of acces..
We've gone over this before - western meddling ( recall Vicoria Nuland tromping around Independence Square)-
Putin played his card-because he knew he had no other 100% viable options..
other then war with Uk.if access was denied.
This conversation is going nowhere..Putin isn't going to leave Crimea,and he has succeeded in cementing his strategic goals.
Now add Syria tothe list -where Russia today said any US planes (like a no fly enforement) could be shot down by Russian air.
Russia has shut us completely out of Syria
Prove I'm wrong.
Prove Putin could have done ONLY what he did, and absolutely nothing else what so ever.
You prove that to an absolute certitude, and I'll concede your point.
Until you do, I'll continue to believe Putin had other options.
AND
Until you PROVE all those other options would have completely failed, I'll continue to believe some of them might have worked better; maybe a little slower, BUT !! leaving Russia in the G8, and the Russian economy on a much better footing.
Your words not mine.
Please do not infer what I did not imply.
And what is the source of these profound delusions of yours? Have you run out of Thorazine?
One of the reasons Putin so fervently backs Assad is PRECISELY because of the warm-water port access Syria's Assad provides.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Not to stay on topic but it's been 4 days since the VP debate and Clinton's lead has grown. Does anyone still think Pence won or anyone really cares?
Darth Omar
Russian asset
There's no question Pence won the debate. Though liberals spin by saying he won on style. Can't very well concede that he won on issues lol.
And no, it doesn't seem to matter. But the election isn't today.
"There's no question Pence won the debate" by your criteria. If wearing a blue necktie is the criterion of victory, Pence won decisively.
The "question", the one you refer to in your uncategorical denial, is which candidate distinguished himself as more worthy of holding U.S. federal executive branch office. Pence lied.
During the debate Kaine cited Pence's assertion Putin's leadership was superior to Obama's.
Pence denied it.
NBC-TV News broadcast the sound-bite of Pence making precisely that assertion in prior statement.
Pence lied.
Althea
Althea told me...
So you agree...we would occupy Iraq forever?
Althea
Althea told me...
I know how ISIS was formed. I'm still waiting for you to explain how long you think troops would need to stay in Iraq, before it became 'absurd'?
Althea
Althea told me...
The general consensus remains 'Pence won the debate. Donald lost'.
Darth Omar
Russian asset
I don't know. Do you think we will 'occupy' Germany forever lol?
(laughing)
I watched him on a morning show the next day. They tried to nail him down on all the issues he was vehemently opposed to Trump's stand during the primaries. Rumblin', fumblin', stumblin'. He deflected, poorly, to avoid the answers. Just as he lied when Kaine made those same claims and Pence lied with "nonsense".
Darth Omar
Russian asset
A majority of liberal pundits concede the loss. The rest is putting a happy face on it lol.
And lied and dodged and denied, you don't win debates by doing those things.
His policies aren't even Trump policies, that is what is so incredible about them being running mates. He was basically setting himself apart from Trump. It was quite amazing.