Pathetic Pelosi... just PATHETIC....

[Canceled2]

It's not a false argument. Whether the person is 5 years old or 50 years old if the brain is at a certain level the person is classified as dead even if there is activity. In other words there is a minimum standard required across the board. Why make exceptions for embryos?

In a society where our most fundamental and cherished belief is every human being is an individual how can one possibly claim something is a human being when it requires the body of another to survive not to mention the legitimate human being be required to offer their body?

Some anti-abortionists go as far as demanding the legitimate human being risk their health and possible permanent damage from uncontrolled blood pressure and diabetes. It's like tossing the word "freedom" into the garbage can.

Because the developing brain of the fetus is NOT considered brain dead. You can keep postng this false argument apple but the retelling won't make it true.

 

[Canceled2]

Now, wait a minute!!
We could use Apples definition as justification to help all the anti-right in "assissted suicide"!

LOL..

 

[Whomever]

Pelosi sold out to the pressure to not appear weak and oppose Bush on Torture.

So did many in congress, even a few republicans.

And they all suck.

Then there are those pathetic excuses for human beings that still support torture.

 

[TuTu Monroe]

Members briefings on enhanced Interrogations.

http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/EIT_Member_Briefings.pdf

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/05/14/pelosi-cia-misled-congress-over-waterboarding/?hp

"House Speaker Nancy Pelosi on Thursday acknowledged that she had learned in 2003 that the C.I.A. had subjected suspects to waterboarding, but she asserted that the agency had misled Congress about its techniques."

Good... she finally owns up to when she knew... ignore the part where she didn't object to the use of waterboarding for five or six years... because it is SPIN time.... master spinna style....

"She accused the C.I.A. and Bush administration of lying to Congress about what was actually transpiring with the detainees.

“I am saying that the C.I.A. was misleading the Congress and at the same time the administration was misleading the Congress on weapons of mass destruction,” Ms. Pelosi said."

hmmm... now she is trying to turn the topic into a 'Bush lied about WMDs' ROFLMAO.... PATHETIC PELOSI...

"Ms. Pelosi said she was told at that briefing that waterboarding, one of the most controversial of the harsh techniques employed, was not being used."

Now its back to lying.... she JUST acknowledged that they told her they were using waterboarding and already in the same interview she is denying it again?

"Ms. Pelosi blamed the dispute on Republicans and others, saying they are trying to shift attention from those who authorized the interrogations and other tactics now found to be questionable."

Hmmm... if she was informed on the techniques and that they were being used then how is she any less responsible than the lawyers she wants to prosecute or thant those who used them? What's the word I am looking for.... oh yeah.... HYPOCRIT

 

[apple0154]

Because the developing brain of the fetus is NOT considered brain dead. You can keep postng this false argument apple but the retelling won't make it true.

I know the fetus is not considered brain dead. That's the whole point. When certain brain activity is missing people are considered brain dead, across the board, but when it comes to fetuses there are always exceptions made like obliging a person to use their body parts to keep it alive.

Doctors weighing the extent of damage to the woman against the viability of the fetus is another example.

It makes a mockery of freedom and individuality.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

Members briefings on enhanced Interrogations.

http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/EIT_Member_Briefings.pdf

It's the old "Plausable Deniablity".
They perfected it by denying that they knew what was in the lead to Irag and now are trying to use it for everything else that they do.

 

[Canceled2]

I know the fetus is not considered brain dead. That's the whole point. When certain brain activity is missing people are considered brain dead, across the board, but when it comes to fetuses there are always exceptions made like obliging a person to use their body parts to keep it alive.

Doctors weighing the extent of damage to the woman against the viability of the fetus is another example.

It makes a mockery of freedom and individuality.

That's because when it comes to a fetus doctors KNOW the brain is active and developing as opposed to the injured brain that is damaged and dead. I am surprised that this simple concept has you so confused.

The damage to the woman is non existant in 97% of abortions.

The woman is free to abstain or use protection to avoid pregnancy. Stupidity and irresponsibility is not a good reason to kill a human being and just another proof to the original point I made that pro-abortionists are illogocal.

 

[christiefan915]

Members briefings on enhanced Interrogations.

http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFiles/EIT_Member_Briefings.pdf

So her name is there only once, not the four times the CIA asserted.

'splain something to me, Lucy.

If cheney et al. are saying that we got crucial information about terrorist activities due to torture, and

if that's true, it's why righties are supporting its use, and

if Pelosi knew about the torture and didn't say anything, then

why isn't Pelosi being praised, instead of vilified, for her supposed support of the procedures righties themselves have been lauding?

 

[Cancel5]

Harmless, then please volunteer to do it for charity, okay...and no toy to throw for relief, you go the full 20-40 seconds they subject the detainee to, okay, since it is harmless.


It seems pretty obvious that waterboarding can cause emotional trauma, but does it threaten a person's physical health?

No doubt about it, says Allen Keller, an associate professor of medicine at New York University School of Medicine (who, it should be noted, testified that waterboarding is a form of torture before the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence in 2007). During waterboarding, some of this water can flow through the nostrils and into the lungs, Keller explains. Water in the lungs, especially if it's dirty, can cause potentially deadly pneumonia or pleuritis, an inflammation of the lung lining.

Waterboarding could also cause hypoxia, a condition in which the body is not getting enough oxygen, either because the victim is holding his or her breath or inhaling water -- and inadequate oxygen supplies can lead to deadly organ failure, Keller adds.

But don't underestimate how tightly intertwined the physical and psychological experiences of waterboarding are, Keller notes. Since it mimics the terrifying sensation of drowning, it triggers the release of stress hormones called catecholamines that can cause heart rate and blood pressure to soar, potentially setting the stage for heart attack in a person with underlying heart disease, he says.

But even healthy people can die from sheer terror, as Martin A. Samuels, chairman of the neurology department at Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston told ScientificAmerican.com earlier this year. The sudden outpouring of stress hormones can cause the heart to beat abnormally, hampering its ability to deliver blood to the body.

Waterboarding might be an ideal way to cause a fear-induced heart problem, Samuels speculates, pointing to experiments by the late Johns Hopkins psychobiologist Curt Richter, who in the 1950s created what he called a "swimming" jar for wild rats that was partially filled with water, allowing them to swim but not escape. The rats often died, and when Richter examined their hearts, he found damage suggesting stress hormones caused heart muscle cells to contract uncontrollably, Samuels explains.

"Make no mistake about it, [waterboarding] is a profoundly traumatic event," Keller says. "The physical and psychological and social aspects are all interdependent and feed off one another."

 

[christiefan915]

Harmless, then please volunteer to do it for charity, okay...and no toy to throw for relief, you go the full 20-40 seconds they subject the detainee to, okay, since it is harmless.


It seems pretty obvious that waterboarding can cause emotional trauma, but does it threaten a person's physical health?

No doubt about it, says Allen Keller, an associate professor of medicine at New York University School of Medicine (who, it should be noted, testified that waterboarding is a form of torture before the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence in 2007). During waterboarding, some of this water can flow through the nostrils and into the lungs, Keller explains. Water in the lungs, especially if it's dirty, can cause potentially deadly pneumonia or pleuritis, an inflammation of the lung lining.

Waterboarding could also cause hypoxia, a condition in which the body is not getting enough oxygen, either because the victim is holding his or her breath or inhaling water -- and inadequate oxygen supplies can lead to deadly organ failure, Keller adds.

But don't underestimate how tightly intertwined the physical and psychological experiences of waterboarding are, Keller notes. Since it mimics the terrifying sensation of drowning, it triggers the release of stress hormones called catecholamines that can cause heart rate and blood pressure to soar, potentially setting the stage for heart attack in a person with underlying heart disease, he says.

But even healthy people can die from sheer terror, as Martin A. Samuels, chairman of the neurology department at Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston told ScientificAmerican.com earlier this year. The sudden outpouring of stress hormones can cause the heart to beat abnormally, hampering its ability to deliver blood to the body.

Waterboarding might be an ideal way to cause a fear-induced heart problem, Samuels speculates, pointing to experiments by the late Johns Hopkins psychobiologist Curt Richter, who in the 1950s created what he called a "swimming" jar for wild rats that was partially filled with water, allowing them to swim but not escape. The rats often died, and when Richter examined their hearts, he found damage suggesting stress hormones caused heart muscle cells to contract uncontrollably, Samuels explains.

"Make no mistake about it, [waterboarding] is a profoundly traumatic event," Keller says. "The physical and psychological and social aspects are all interdependent and feed off one another."

Think how many serial killers, guns for hire, Mafia slayers etc. the country's imprisoned over the years. If waterboarding was so safe and so conducive to getting critical information out of suspects, why wasn't it used on Tony Pro to find out what happened to Jimmy Hoffa, or on Sammy Gravano to find out how many people he whacked, or on Ted Bundy so he'd tell about all the victims he killed that still aren't located?

If this country isn't using it on our own "worst of the worst" to obtain valuable information, the argument doesn't hold up that it doesn't cause severe pain and suffering or is comparable to a harmless fraternity prank.

 

[Cancel5]

Thanks, it is a very good point and one that needs to be emphasized.

 

[apple0154]

That's because when it comes to a fetus doctors KNOW the brain is active and developing as opposed to the injured brain that is damaged and dead. I am surprised that this simple concept has you so confused.

The damage to the woman is non existant in 97% of abortions.

The woman is free to abstain or use protection to avoid pregnancy. Stupidity and irresponsibility is not a good reason to kill a human being and just another proof to the original point I made that pro-abortionists are illogocal.

There's no confusion regarding the brain. When it is incapable of performing certain functions the individual is considered dead. If one insists on referring to a fetus as a human being then let's apply the same standards. I'm surprised that concept is so confusing.

Another strange word play is the use of "developing". We do not classify things that are developing the same as those that are developed. On that subject who can say what will develop. If there is a stillbirth the embryo never developed into a human being. There are probably kids in kindergarten who will become doctors but we do not refer to them as doctors.

Human beings are individual creatures. They do not require the use of body parts while someone else is using them.

 

[Sammy Jankis]

There's no confusion regarding the brain. When it is incapable of performing certain functions the individual is considered dead. If one insists on referring to a fetus as a human being then let's apply the same standards. I'm surprised that concept is so confusing.

Another strange word play is the use of "developing". We do not classify things that are developing the same as those that are developed. On that subject who can say what will develop. If there is a stillbirth the embryo never developed into a human being. There are probably kids in kindergarten who will become doctors but we do not refer to them as doctors.

Human beings are individual creatures. They do not require the use of body parts while someone else is using them.

Yes, but medically a brain which is not fully functional at the moment, but with near 100% certainty will grow into a fully healthy brain, is not considered brain damaged. It's like how a child is considered a child and not a dwarf or a midget.

I know you seek to pervert logic to justify baby killing, but it just makes you look stupid.


"Who can say what will develop" --? Really?

The general pattern of fetal development is well documented.

 

[apple0154]

Yes, but medically a brain which is not fully functional at the moment, but with near 100% certainty will grow into a fully healthy brain, is not considered brain damaged. It's like how a child is considered a child and not a dwarf or a midget.

I know you seek to pervert logic to justify baby killing, but it just makes you look stupid.


"Who can say what will develop" --? Really?

The general pattern of fetal development is well documented.

Exactly, a child is considered a child, not a dwarf or a midget or an adult.

While the general pattern of fetal development is documented so is the development of doctors and lawyers but no one is considered a doctor or a lawyer until they are a doctor or a lawyer.

It's the "embryo is a human being" fruitcakes who pervert logic. When something is developing it means it is not what it may become. A house is not a house until it is built. Why pervert logic and the English language when discussing fetuses?

It's like holding an apple seed in ones hand and claiming it's an apple tree. If the terms and logic that people use to try and justify the "embryo is a human being" argument were used in any other circumstance the person would be considered a nut job.

 

[Sammy Jankis]

Exactly, a child is considered a child, not a dwarf or a midget or an adult.

While the general pattern of fetal development is documented so is the development of doctors and lawyers but no one is considered a doctor or a lawyer until they are a doctor or a lawyer.

It's the "embryo is a human being" fruitcakes who pervert logic. When something is developing it means it is not what it may become. A house is not a house until it is built. Why pervert logic and the English language when discussing fetuses?

It's like holding an apple seed in ones hand and claiming it's an apple tree. If the terms and logic that people use to try and justify the "embryo is a human being" argument were used in any other circumstance the person would be considered a nut job.

It is a human being in embryo state. A brain which will develop into a fully functional brain is not diagnosed with brain damage, for good reason. Because it's idiotic to do so.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

"There's no confusion regarding the brain. When it is incapable of performing certain functions the individual is considered dead."

The above is true for those that have already developed. But for children and young adults, the brain is still developing typically into late teens, early 20's.

" If one insists on referring to a fetus as a human being then let's apply the same standards. I'm surprised that concept is so confusing. "

There is NO question that a unique human life is formed upon fertilization of the egg. None. It is proven by genetics. I am surprised so many people still pretend that isn't the case.

"Another strange word play is the use of "developing". We do not classify things that are developing the same as those that are developed."

This is complete bullshit. A kitten is still a young cat. A child is still a young human. The fact that they are not fully developed does not mean they are ever a different species. To even suggest otherwise is absurd.


"On that subject who can say what will develop."

Again, genetics is going to answer this for you.

" If there is a stillbirth the embryo never developed into a human being."

LMAO... WRONG. It was a human being at conception. There is no magic baby fairy that turns it human at birth. It is human from the start.

" There are probably kids in kindergarten who will become doctors but we do not refer to them as doctors. "

Wow... what absurdity. We do not know what PROFESSION a child will have because they have a choice in the matter. They do not have a choice as to whether they will grow up human or not.

"Human beings are individual creatures."

Well at least you had one sentence that was correct.

"They do not require the use of body parts while someone else is using them.

No idea what that last sentence is supposed to imply.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

"Exactly, a child is considered a child, not a dwarf or a midget or an adult. "

True, a child is a indeed considered a child. Gold star for you. Thanks Capt. Obvious. Yet you do realize that CHILD is still HUMAN.... dont you?

"While the general pattern of fetal development is documented so is the development of doctors and lawyers but no one is considered a doctor or a lawyer until they are a doctor or a lawyer. "

Again, the above is absurd. There is no CHOICE involved in whether a child develops into an adult. There is a choice as to what profession that child chooses.

"It's the "embryo is a human being" fruitcakes who pervert logic. When something is developing it means it is not what it may become."

Really??? LMAO... then do explain to us the point in time that the magic human fairy arrives to turn the child human.

"A house is not a house until it is built. Why pervert logic and the English language when discussing fetuses? "

A house is not a living entity moron. Go back and take some generic science classes. Learn a little about genetics.

"It's like holding an apple seed in ones hand and claiming it's an apple tree. If the terms and logic that people use to try and justify the "embryo is a human being" argument were used in any other circumstance the person would be considered a nut job."

Wow, you are indeed quite desperate to justify killing kids aren't you? Go read up on Hitler. He was quite adept at dehumanizing a group of people in order to justify killing them. Maybe one day you can grow up to be just like him.

 

[Whomever]

Wow, you are indeed quite desperate to justify killing kids aren't you? Go read up on Hitler. He was quite adept at dehumanizing a group of people in order to justify killing them. Maybe one day you can grow up to be just like him.

Like The right and Muslims? Just nuke em all and let god sort them out.
Don't even dare to count how many muslim women and children we killed.

 

[Sammy Jankis]

Apple is quite the dumb cunt, ain't she?

 

[apple0154]

It is a human being in embryo state. A brain which will develop into a fully functional brain is not diagnosed with brain damage, for good reason. Because it's idiotic to do so.

If you want to get into semantics, fine. Let's just say the level of brain function, vis-à-vis supporting the body, is the determining factor. Damaged. Missing. Developing. Call it what you will.