Pathetic Pelosi... just PATHETIC....

Dungheap said:
SF - If I tell you that I robbed a bank and you are obligated by law to not disclose whatever it is that I tell you, you are not "complicit." It doesn't work that way.

Also, the FBI knew what was going on. Hell, the DoJ green-lighted it so I don't know that going to the FBI was a realistic option. Do you think this stuff through at all? In fact, when Jane Harman did object to the CIA general counsel after that 2003 briefing here was the response:



So, again, I'm not sure what it is you wanted her to do.
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Also... to answer your quote on the CIA response..... that is quite pathetic... the institution who is violating the law says 'well Bush lawyers said we could' and that should end it? Writing a letter to the CIA was the right first step by harman.... but to do nothing after getting that response is simply pathetic.

but i know... they were powerless to act or some such nonsense will be your continued excuse. They had to go along with it.

Then they had to lie about knowing about the waterboarding etc... and pretend they didn't know... until they were busted for that lie... then they were required to try to spin out of it with deception.... isnt that right hack?
 
Superfreak said:
As I understand it, you cannot force someone to go along and remain silent when the law is being broken. It does not apply to when the Constitution is being violated and the law is being broken.

Again, you pretend that she is fucking powerless, that nothing could be done.

What am I thinking, of course nothing could be done. If you sign the secrecy documents that means they can do anything they want and there is not a damn thing you can do about it. Not a thing....

What a load of shit. You are the biggest fucking hack I have ever seen... and that includes Dixie.
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As I understand what you wrote up there in bold, you don't understand much. Classified information obtained from classified briefings must remain classified and those members of Congress that receive the information must keep it classified. There is no caveat for things that the individual member of Congress feels violate the law. It's classified and must remain that way.

But I'm not saying that nothing could have been done. And I'm not saying she was powerless. I have already given my opinion as to what she and others should have done notwithstanding the fact that they are required by law to keep confidential national security information secret.

I'm just asking what would in your mind make her not complicit. You don't seem to want to directly answer the question. And that's fine, but forgive me if I dismiss your opinion out of hand.
 
Superfreak said:
Also... to answer your quote on the CIA response..... that is quite pathetic... the institution who is violating the law says 'well Bush lawyers said we could' and that should end it? Writing a letter to the CIA was the right first step by harman.... but to do nothing after getting that response is simply pathetic.

but i know... they were powerless to act or some such nonsense will be your continued excuse. They had to go along with it.

Then they had to lie about knowing about the waterboarding etc... and pretend they didn't know... until they were busted for that lie... then they were required to try to spin out of it with deception.... isnt that right hack?
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I'm asking you very simple questions. You said that they should tell the FBI. Well, the FBI knew about it. What purpose would it serve to tell the FBI what it already knew about activities that the Department of Justice already approved?

What specifically should Pelosi have done?

Edit: and by my reckoning no one has lied about knowing about waterboarding. Pelosi has already admitted that she learned that waterboarding was used in 2003. Where's the lie there?
 
Dungheap said:
I'm asking you very simple questions. You said that they should tell the FBI. Well, the FBI knew about it. What purpose would it serve to tell the FBI what it already knew about activities that the Department of Justice already approved?

What specifically should Pelosi have done?

Edit: and by my reckoning no one has lied about knowing about waterboarding. Pelosi has already admitted that she learned that waterboarding was used in 2003. Where's the lie there?
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Like I said... she was obviously powerless... just powerless... Nothing can be done when a politician knows the US Constitution is being violated... not a damn thing. Law being broken..... 'sorry someone I know sent a letter to the perpetrator and the perpetrator said it was legal... so I just ignored it... but that doesn't make me complicit... no no no no i am not complicit... not me'

The specific answer dipshit is WHATEVER it took to make sure it stopped. WHATEVER IT TOOK. Otherwise, she is COMPLICIT in the act. PERIOD.

The LIE was in that Pelosi has been pretending that she did not know about it. Then it was discovered that she did. But I don't know why I try to explain that to you.... you will simply ignore it again.
 
Superfreak said:
Like I said... she was obviously powerless... just powerless... Nothing can be done when a politician knows the US Constitution is being violated... not a damn thing. Law being broken..... 'sorry someone I know sent a letter to the perpetrator and the perpetrator said it was legal... so I just ignored it... but that doesn't make me complicit... no no no no i am not complicit... not me'

The specific answer dipshit is WHATEVER it took to make sure it stopped. WHATEVER IT TOOK. Otherwise, she is COMPLICIT in the act. PERIOD.

The LIE was in that Pelosi has been pretending that she did not know about it. Then it was discovered that she did. But I don't know why I try to explain that to you.... you will simply ignore it again.
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Don't go getting all specific on me. Whatever it takes. That's priceless.
 
Damocles said:
Who was it that said they'd rather speak the truth because it is easier to memorize?

I love the way she had to shuffle back through her papers because she couldn't remember what she had just read let alone speak on it with any authority.
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PELOSI IS NOT THE ISSUE.... it is BUSH and CHENEY and the CIA....

Poor pelosi....

'Where the hell did that PANDEMIC go? That was supposed to keep people looking elsewhere.... son of a bitch.... stop looking at me... I did not KNOW... even though I did... I am not complicit... no no no no ... wait, what was that I read again, was I? *reads quickly after ten minutes of shuffling papers looking for the answer* NO NO NO I am innocent, I am not complicit... no no no ... Bush!!! WMDs!!! CHENEY Shotgun! ... what do you MEAN you will not be distracted? Stop asking me if I knew about the waterboarding.... Because I am not sure which answer I should give this week'
 
Dungheap said:
Don't go getting all specific on me. Whatever it takes. That's priceless.
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Just answer this demwit.... are you actually suggesting that she could do nothing? That there is no action that the Minority Leader of the House of Representatives could do when made aware that the US Constitution was being violated? is that truly what you are suggesting?

Fucking hack... defend her no matter what....
 
Superfreak said:
Just answer this demwit.... are you actually suggesting that she could do nothing? That there is no action that the Minority Leader of the House of Representatives could do when made aware that the US Constitution was being violated? is that truly what you are suggesting?

Fucking hack... defend her no matter what....
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No, and I've said before what she should have done: taken to the floor of the House and raised her objections to the practices. It would have been a violation of the law, but I believe such an act would have been protected by the speech and debate clause of the constitution. And she's weak and spineless for not doing that.

Aside from doing that I'm not sure there was much of anything that she or anyone else so inclined from the minority party could have done that would have been afforded speech and debate protection.

But, as I said, I'm happy that we can agree that the administration violated the law. What do you think should happen now?

And by the way, I still don't see why you think Pelosi lied. Can you help me out? Here is Pelosi's statement from December 2007 as to what she knew and when she knew it. I don't see it being very much different from what you keep harping on:

"On one occasion, in the fall of 2002, I was briefed on interrogation techniques the Administration was considering using in the future. The Administration advised that legal counsel for the both the CIA and the Department of Justice had concluded that the techniques were legal.

"I had no further briefings on the techniques. Several months later, my successor as Ranking Member of the House Intelligence Committee, Jane Harman, was briefed more extensively and advised the techniques had in fact been employed. It was my understanding at that time that Congresswoman Harman filed a letter in early 2003 to the CIA to protest the use of such techniques, a protest with which I concurred."
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http://speaker.house.gov/newsroom/pressreleases?id=0439
 
Superfreak said:
PELOSI IS NOT THE ISSUE.... it is BUSH and CHENEY and the CIA....

Poor pelosi....

'Where the hell did that PANDEMIC go? That was supposed to keep people looking elsewhere.... son of a bitch.... stop looking at me... I did not KNOW... even though I did... I am not complicit... no no no no ... wait, what was that I read again, was I? *reads quickly after ten minutes of shuffling papers looking for the answer* NO NO NO I am innocent, I am not complicit... no no no ... Bush!!! WMDs!!! CHENEY Shotgun! ... what do you MEAN you will not be distracted? Stop asking me if I knew about the waterboarding.... Because I am not sure which answer I should give this week'
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I guess I can understand why you are upset at Pelosi, but I don't understand why, if you believe that these activities were a violation of the law, you poo-poo the fact that high level officials are accusing the Bush Administration of torturing people to obtain false evidence to support an unnecessary attack on Iraq.

That's just fucked.

And if you think that this isn't about Bush, Cheney, Iraq, WMD and the CIA, I've got a bridge to sell you.

I also don't quite understand why you ignore Pelosi's call for a commission to sort all of this shit out, particularly where you claim she is lying about something.
 
I wish she had the courage to stand up against it, but not having the courage to stand up against something horrable is a whole lot better than doing it yourself.
 
This is why the conservatives are in such trouble... the best argument they have is that this tourture is the Democrats fault because they did not stop them from doing it!
 
http://www.politicsdaily.com/2009/05/14/no-sale-nancy/

"Her frenemy Jane Harman, who replaced her on the House Intelligence Committee, did write to the CIA's counsel to express her concern about waterboarding. But because Harman was the ranking member on that committee, she was the person to write such a letter, Pelosi argued today. Only, Pelosi was minority leader at the time, and as such would certainly have had the standing to pick up paper and pen, too, had she wanted to. Her argument that writing a letter would not have changed anything is kind of shocking if you think about it; does that mean that every constituent who writes in to disagree with her is wasting his time?
Generally speaking, "I was misled," is a tricky position for any government or company official to take, because it's an admission that you were distracted, gullible, or incompetent. Either that, or you're just not telling the truth."

Well said Melinda... well said... though I imagine we are about to be told what an uber rightwing nut you are for saying so....
 
Jarod said:
This is why the conservatives are in such trouble... the best argument they have is that this tourture is the Democrats fault because they did not stop them from doing it!
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Please provide us with an example where ANYONE, conservative or not, has said any such thing. Just one example to support your feeble strawman....
 
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