Opposing Putin Is Like Pleading For Poison

Nyet, tovarisch, but an expected defense of Mother Russia.
The good news is that you are supporting Russia as an anti-American foreigner, not a former US military officer like Earl.
so you dont understand NATO expansion,,not surprising from a bottom feeder like yourself

Newly Declassified Documents: Gorbachev Told NATO Wouldn't Move Past East German Border
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/t...d-documents-gorbachev-told-nato-wouldnt-23629
Russian leaders often complain that the NATO extended an invitation to Hungary, Poland and what was then Czechoslovakia to joint the alliance in 1997 at the Madrid Summit in contravention of assurances offered to the Soviet Union before its 1991 collapse. The alliance has dismissed the notion that such assurances were offered, however, scholars have continued to debate the issue for years. Now, however, newly declassified documents show that Gorbachev did in fact receive assurances that NATO would not expand past East Germany.

“The documents show that multiple national leaders were considering and rejecting Central and Eastern European membership in NATO as of early 1990 and through 1991,” George Washington University National Security Archives researchers Svetlana Savranskaya and Tom Blanton wrote.
“That discussions of NATO in the context of German unification negotiations in 1990 were not at all narrowly limited to the status of East German territory, and that subsequent Soviet and Russian complaints about being misled about NATO expansion were founded in written contemporaneous memcons and telcons at the highest levels.”
 
so you dont understand NATO expansion,,not surprising from a bottom feeder like yourself

Newly Declassified Documents: Gorbachev Told NATO Wouldn't Move Past East German Border
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/t...d-documents-gorbachev-told-nato-wouldnt-23629
Russian leaders often complain that the NATO extended an invitation to Hungary, Poland and what was then Czechoslovakia to joint the alliance in 1997 at the Madrid Summit in contravention of assurances offered to the Soviet Union before its 1991 collapse. The alliance has dismissed the notion that such assurances were offered, however, scholars have continued to debate the issue for years. Now, however, newly declassified documents show that Gorbachev did in fact receive assurances that NATO would not expand past East Germany.

“The documents show that multiple national leaders were considering and rejecting Central and Eastern European membership in NATO as of early 1990 and through 1991,” George Washington University National Security Archives researchers Svetlana Savranskaya and Tom Blanton wrote.
“That discussions of NATO in the context of German unification negotiations in 1990 were not at all narrowly limited to the status of East German territory, and that subsequent Soviet and Russian complaints about being misled about NATO expansion were founded in written contemporaneous memcons and telcons at the highest levels.”

Da, comrade. I understand. How does that change your defense of Mother Russia and repeated attacks on the US?
 
Da, comrade. I understand. How does that change your defense of Mother Russia and repeated attacks on the US?
why cant you stay on point of a discussion?
what attacks? FB bots?? ROFL.
Crowdstrike could not even prove da Russian hacked the DNC ( Crowdstrike testimony)
 
Hello Dutch Uncle,

True. Too bad Russia doesn't have more brave citizens. Maybe one day a Russia patriot will do to Putin what he's done to so many Russians and liberate their nation.

https://apnews.com/cfbe9fb70d4943e1881be5157b221cca
Dozens of Russian journalists have been killed or brutally beaten in recent years, in clear retribution for their work. In most cases, their attackers walked free.

Here’s a look at some of the high-profile cases:

That's why it is so important to protect our democracy and the balance of power.
 
except Trump has been "tough on Putin" as American like to simply say

everybody want to kick Russia, except China, then we wonder WhyTF Russia and china
have economic AND military alliances?
Dummies like Dutch here dumb it down to "murderous dictators" but it's just another facet of realpolitik

I never understood the point of the thread.

‘Dictator poisons political adversary’. In foreign policy that’s a dog bites man story lol. Putin is a dictator, thug, murderous thug or whatever nasty adjectives you want to use. They all apply. He’s a dictator. Well ok, the sky is blue. Lions eat Zebras. I don’t get the significance of it.

I can hit the JPP daily limit of threads on murderous thugs on the world stage in about 20 minutes. If anything, Putin is sort of milquetoast for a dictator. Little Kim probably thinks he’s a pussy for poisoning an adversary. Little Kim has his adversaries eaten alive by dogs.

How’s that for some murderous dictator? There’s crap that goes on in Saudi Arabia—our ally, that would probably make Putin blush. Plenty of thuggery in Iran. We haven’t even got to China yet.

Take home point: the world is very largely an ugly place. And there are dictators.
 
Hello Dutch Uncle,

Dude, this thread is about a murderous dictator. Is there any doubt he's ordered the deaths of thousands, if not tens of thousands, by invading former satellite nations along with supporting murderous dictators like Assad. If Russian citizens didn't approve, why do they keep electing Putin to lead their nation?

Same reason Trump was able to gain power. Propaganda.
 
Hello Cypress,

Your question, as I interpreted it, was whether Putin orders anyone to be poisoned.

I do not think he orders it. Not directly.

Suppression of political opposition is probably being carried out by a range of factions in Russia....Russian domestic security services, the criminal underworld, corrupt oligarchs associated with Putin and the Kremlin. They all benefit from Putin's regime.

It is occurring with a nod and wink from Putin. That is my two cents.

Putin is ex-KGB. They disappear people.
 
Hello Cypress,

I am sure there are high level meetings in the Kremlin where they speak to a policy desire to keep opposition groups and democratic activists from having a voice or access to the political process, by using all viable means available.

Wink wink.

I am sure this policy guidance is filtered down through the dark corners of FSB, Ministry of Justice, with tentacles even reaching into the criminal oligarchy and criminal underworld.

A corrupt regime like Putin's has a lot of criminal allies both in and outside of government in Russia.

Putin does not literally have to get directly involved in the dirty work himself

A wink and a nod, nuff said, deed is done, no questions.
 
Hello Darth,

Abject subservience lol.

Does anyone else on the planet, besides Trump, bitch about Russia making 10 billion a year selling gas to a NATO member?

Doesn’t that kind of defeat our sanctions?

And what the frick is that all about? Why are we still funding NATO when Europe is so ‘threatened’ by Russia they would allow themselves to be dependent on them for such a critical commodity? Makes zero sense.

Like I told someone else—the left has Russia on the brain. Start talking about China or Turkey and people will start taking you more seriously on foreign policy.

Nutshell version: Russia is the one doing the most election meddling, helping Trump.
 
why cant you stay on point of a discussion?
what attacks? FB bots?? ROFL.
Crowdstrike could not even prove da Russian hacked the DNC ( Crowdstrike testimony)

Yes, there are people who really-actually call that an ‘attack’ by Russia lol.

Worse, there’s no shortage of them. And it’s a big reason why we could easily slip into actual socialism if we’re not careful.
 
Hello Dutch Uncle,

That's why it is so important to protect our democracy and the balance of power.

Agreed. In a world of limited resources and economies based on growth, there will always be competition. Hostility toward opponents is expected. Some will back off in the competition and some will push it as far they can.

For the most part, Americans are doing the job of our global opponents for them by dividing other Americans and seeking to impose authority over them.
 
Hello Darth,

Nutshell version: Russia is the one doing the most election meddling, helping Trump.

To be clear; the Russians are doing what's best for Russia...specifically Putin. If he thought Hillary would kneel down and blow him for a sweet, sweet business deal, she'd be getting all of his support.
 
Da, comrade. I understand. How does that change your defense of Mother Russia and your repeated attacks on the US?
why cant you stay on point of a discussion?
what attacks? FB bots?? ROFL.
Crowdstrike could not even prove da Russian hacked the DNC ( Crowdstrike testimony)

I was on point, especially about your loyalties, but agree my post was unclear. The correction is bolded above. As for your whining, go tell your babushka you made dookie in your pants.

It's unsurprising you accept the Russian version and that you ignore the DNI report, tovarisch. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ICA_2017_01.pdf

Russia’s effort to influence the 2016 US presidential
election represented a significant escalation in
directness, level of activity, and scope of effort
compared to previous operations aimed at US
elections. We assess the 2016 influence campaign
reflected the Kremlin’s recognition of the
worldwide effects that mass disclosures of US
Government and other private data—such as those
conducted by WikiLeaks and others—have
achieved in recent years, and their understanding
of the value of orchestrating such disclosures to
maximize the impact of compromising information.
 
I never understood the point of the thread.

‘Dictator poisons political adversary’. In foreign policy that’s a dog bites man story lol. Putin is a dictator, thug, murderous thug or whatever nasty adjectives you want to use. They all apply. He’s a dictator. Well ok, the sky is blue. Lions eat Zebras. I don’t get the significance of it.

I can hit the JPP daily limit of threads on murderous thugs on the world stage in about 20 minutes. If anything, Putin is sort of milquetoast for a dictator. Little Kim probably thinks he’s a pussy for poisoning an adversary. Little Kim has his adversaries eaten alive by dogs.

How’s that for some murderous dictator? There’s crap that goes on in Saudi Arabia—our ally, that would probably make Putin blush. Plenty of thuggery in Iran. We haven’t even got to China yet.

Take home point: the world is very largely an ugly place. And there are dictators.
absolutely
as much as we need KSA as a balance to Iran,their human rights abuses are abysmal - inclluding chopping up Kashogi

but it's always DA RUSSIANS! - which is one reason the Deep State Creeps used the Russian Hoax.
They want to believe it's all true, because its,,,,DA RUSSIANS!!
 
Another one in serious condition:

Russian opposition figure Alexei Navalny unconscious in intensive care after suspected poisoning

"Russian opposition figure Alexei Navalny is unconscious in intensive care after a suspected poisoning, his spokeswoman said Thursday.

The anti-corruption campaigner and staunch critic of President Vladimir Putin fell ill while on a flight back to Moscow from the Siberian city of Tomsk, Kira Yarmysh said on Twitter.

Yarmysh said Navalny began to feel unwell after drinking tea that appeared to have been laced with a toxin. Russia's state news agency Tass confirmed Navalny is being treated for poisoning in a hospital in Omsk, where his plane made an emergency landing. Citing the chief doctor at the hospital, Tass said he is in grave condition.

He has been placed on a ventilator.

Navalny, 44, is the effective face of political opposition to Putin and he has been in and out of jail in recent for his activism against Russia's longtime leader.

Last year, Navalny claimed he was poisoned while serving a short jail sentence. Doctors said he had a severe allergic reaction to an unknown substance. He was left partially blind in one eye after a pro-Putin activist attacked him with a chemical in 2017.

Navaly attempted to run against Putin in Russia's 2018 presidential elections but was barred from participating over a fraud conviction he alleged was politically motivated.

Many of Putin's opponents – journalists, politicians, former associates – have died in violent or suspicious circumstances, both at home and abroad."


"British authorities also concluded that Alexander Litvinenko, another former Russian spy, was poisoned to death at the Kremlin's behest in a London hotel in 2006.

Anna Politkovskaya, an investigative journalist who was a strident critic of the Kremlin and exposed Russian human rights abuses, was murdered in 2006.

Boris Berezovsky, an oligarch who was once Putin's right-hand man, was found hanged at his mansion outside London in 2013.

Russian opposition activist Vladmir Kara-Murza, a member of the pro-democracy group Open Russia, says he believes attempts were made to poison him in 2015 and 2017. A laboratory later found elevated levels of mercury, copper, manganese and zinc. "

"Earlier this year, two Russian doctors died and another was seriously injured in mysterious falls from hospital windows after they reportedly came under pressure over working conditions in the coronavirus pandemic."

IS THAT OBAMA'S EXCUSE FOR SUCKING HIS DICK FOR 8 YEARS??? NO WONDER HE HANDED RUSSIAN US YELLOWCAK URANIUM, ALLOWED THEM TO ILLEGALLY EXPORT IT; CHIDED ROMNEY FOR CALLING RUSSIA A THREAT; BACKED AWAY FROM HIS LAUGHABLE "RED LINE IN THE SAND"; RENEGED ON THE E.EUROPEAN MISSILE DEFENSE; THEN REFUSED OT ARM URKAINE; TOLD OUR INTELL TO STAND DOWN AND NOT INTERFERE WITJH RUSSIA IN 2016, AFTER GETTING CAUGHT ON A "HOT MIKE" PROMISING RUSSIA (PUTIN) "MORE FLEXIBILITY" AFTER THE 2012 ELECTION.
 
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It's unsurprising you accept the Russian version and that you ignore the DNI report, tovarisch. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ICA_2017_01.pdf
the reports are worthless if the underlying data used for assessments are false = "garbage in - garbage out"

CrowdStrike chief admits no proof that Russia exfiltrated DNC emails
https://www.itwire.com/security/cro...proof-that-russia-exfiltrated-dnc-emails.html
one typical exchange, Henry was asked, "What about the emails that everyone is so, you know, knowledgeable of?
Were there also indicators that they were prepared but not evidence that they actually were exfiltrated?"
To this Henry responded, "There's not evidence that they were actually exfiltrated. There's circumstantial evidence - but no evidence that they were actually exfiltrated."
 
Yes, there are people who really-actually call that an ‘attack’ by Russia lol.

Worse, there’s no shortage of them. And it’s a big reason why we could easily slip into actual socialism if we’re not careful.
The warmonger McCain is dead,
but then there is Rubio and a host of neocon warhawks who would war at the drop of a hat
 
Hello Cypress,



Putin is ex-KGB. They disappear people.

He is ex KGB and he is a corrupt autocrat. Between me, relatives, friends, colleagues we know thousands of people in Russia, and to my knowledge no one is disappearing

I think it is important to be clear about this: Russia today does not resemble the Russia of Stalin, Brezhnev, or even of the relatively benign Krushev.

Putin has gamed the system through cynical constitutional reform, coopting the institutions of government, law, courts. They have complete structural control over the press, elections" courts, federal agencies. It is quite easy for Putin to deny access to the election process and press to viable opposition groups.

That kind of structural control is more effective and less risky than killing people.

The need to assassinate or dissapear people is pretty minimal, especially compared to Soviet standards. It undoubtedly happens sometimes, but only after a careful risk benefit is calculated.

If the Kremlin was directly involved in this poisoning, they must have made a calculation about the risk and benefit of killing a guy who was already effectively being shut out of the Democratic process. Its possible it was a government hit

Another possibility is this Nevlny guy was just so much of pest, that elements outside the Russian government (but who benefit from an association with the Putin regime) tried to off this guy - criminal underworld, corrupt oligarchs, etc
 
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