NEW BOMBSHELL: Jared Kushner and Mike Flynn met with the Russians in December

Page 14 - On 6 August, RT published an English-language video called "Julian Assange Special: Do WikiLeaks Have the E-mail That'll Put Clinton in Prison?" and an exclusive interview with Assange entitled "Clinton and ISIS Funded by the Same Money." RT's most popular video on Secretary Clinton, "How 100% of the Clintons' 'Charity' Went to...Themselves," had more than 9 million views on social media platforms. RT's most popular English language video about the President-elect, called "Trump Will Not Be Permitted To Win" featured Assange and had 2.2 million views.

Russia used trolls as well as RT as part of its influence efforts to denigrate Secretary Clinton. This effort amplified stories on scandals about Secretary Clinton and the role of WikiLeaks in the election campaign.
 
christiefan915 said:
What it shows is that three tried to have a working relationship with Putin and all three failed.
Click to expand...
it shows Obama never took Putin seriously - Obama called Russia a "regional power" despite the fact Russia has the 2nd largest military in the world.
It also shows no matter how much weaponry we put up on the 'Russian front' with NATO-
Putin annexed Crimea without a shot.
There is so much potential for a full scale war, Obama/NATO let him do it rather then confront Putin militarily.

As to Bush? He's a neocon clown who managed to invade Iraq for absolutely no real reason.
So I'm not taking either Obama or Bush seriously.

There is only 1 way to deal with Putin,and that is to indeed DEAL with him.
That's Trump's idea. don't dismiss him,don't marginalize him - treat him for what he is-
and that means using our old friend realpolitik with him,

Establish a relationship and work towards common goals -and where our interests collide negotiate them out.
 
Milagro said:
Oh come on, it is bad enough Zappa using Raw Story but you must know that most of their output is bullshit.

Sent from Lenovo K5 Note:
To piss off snowflakes, bottom feeders and racists
Click to expand...

I chose Raw Story because it was the only one with the story at the time. It's certainly not the only one today.
 
NOVA said:
No lies that I can point out, not much of anything either.....

The intell. assessment is certainly an indictment against Putin and Russia in general....Russian TV, cyber espionage, their motives and methods, using DC Leaks and Wikileaks, etc. to influence the 2016 election.....

It goes on to mention Russian influence efforts during the Cold War (40 years ago), in the 2008 and 2010 elections, and in Carter's election in the 1970's....and their efforts to influence elections all across Europe. Kind of ancient history.
It details Russian Radio(RT America) efforts in 2012 ...Occupy Wall Street, etc., fracking, Syria, the Georgian-Russian conflict, etc.
=========
So, what does all this tell us...Russia has been trying to exert influence on the US for decades....half the document to tell us what we've known and don't doubt, for more than half a century ...
=========
Page 11....etc.

ie Hillary Clinton
they tell us of more Russian motives to undermine the US...The Panama Papers, Olympic doping scandal, ISIL, Syria, the Ukraine and Putin's grudge against Hillary.
ie Trump...
A possible counter terrorism coalition with Trump against ISIS ?
Putin's positive experiences with leaders that have world business interests, as Trump does, could favor a less aggressive relationship with the US ?
==========
So, more of Russia's reasons for wanting to influence the election. Simply put, a grudge against Hillary and a possible more friendly relationship with the US if Trump gets elected....
==========
Then it gets into what they are thinking happened.
Russia was involved with the DNC hacking and the leaking of those emails through Wikileaks....
Their assessments of Guccifer 2.0, the GRU and Assage detailing how the emails were disseminated....a pattern similar to how Russian intell. discloses data.
A claim that Russia accessed elements of state and local election boards as early as 2014 but not involved in vote tallying.
Internet trolling in favor of Trump or against Clinton, how ever you want to view it....More on RTV and radio, social media, etc. More on Russian
motives and avenging negative Putin reports, etc.....

An interesting document with very little new information. No actual 'evidence' because that information would be classified.
Russian attempts at espionage has been a given for decades. The motives for or against the candidates was interesting but not earth shattering.....the 'grudge' against Hillary was revealing.

A good read....but hardly a 'bombshell report'.....imo, the DNC emails didn't involve Hillary personally, one way or the other to any major extent.
Comey's testimony ( which Russia had nothing to do with) was much more devastating to her campaign and voters attitude towards her....
Click to expand...

The "bombshell" referred to Kushner, not this report.

You actually read the report. trump says it's fake news. I'm sure he read the part with the classified info added. So who am I supposed to believe after reading the report, trump and his claim of fake news or my lyin' eyes?
 
callinectes said:
I don't know how to make it any clearer. Maybe if I type slower, and in a bold, italicized, larger red font. THE RUSSIANS ATTEMPTED TO INFLUENCE OR INTERFERE WITH THE 2016 ELECTIONS. . Did that help? That was never in dispute, with virtually everybody except a certain band of idiot politicians who attempted to "reset" relations with a world leader who was and still is widely regarded as a snake. Anyone with half a brain knew this was going on, and HAS been going on probably since the communist slimeballs took over in 1917. Hell, it's probably in their DNA. My issue is the same leftists who denied that the Russians were a serious threat to security are now trying to paint every person in the Trump administration as some kind of KGB operative in cahoots with Putin. Yes, some of these people have talked to Russians! You better hope they continue to do so, because when talk at this level stops, shooting and other nastiness frequently starts. And no, I'm not reading anything from the Washington compost.
Click to expand...

Maybe you can stick to a normal-sized type and explain why trump tweeted "Russia talk is FAKE NEWS put out by the Dems, and played up by the media, in order to mask the big election defeat and the illegal leaks!"
 
anatta said:
it shows Obama never took Putin seriously - Obama called Russia a "regional power" despite the fact Russia has the 2nd largest military in the world.
It also shows no matter how much weaponry we put up on the 'Russian front' with NATO-
Putin annexed Crimea without a shot.
There is so much potential for a full scale war, Obama/NATO let him do it rather then confront Putin militarily.

As to Bush? He's a neocon clown who managed to invade Iraq for absolutely no real reason.
So I'm not taking either Obama or Bush seriously.

There is only 1 way to deal with Putin,and that is to indeed DEAL with him.
That's Trump's idea. don't dismiss him,don't marginalize him - treat him for what he is-
and that means using our old friend realpolitik with him,

Establish a relationship and work towards common goals -and where our interests collide negotiate them out.
Click to expand...

How do we "negotiate out" that Putin has journalists killed if they speak out against him?

"As US Ambassador to the United Nations Samantha Power prepares to step down from the diplomatic stage, she is offering a word of warning to President-elect Donald Trump and his team: dismiss Russian acts of aggression at your own peril.

"I would be concerned if we looked away from Russian interference in our election," Power told CNN in an interview Tuesday, days before her term ends.

"I would be concerned if a country that just lopped off part of a neighbor got to keep that," she said, referring to Trump's signals that he was open to recognizing Russia's annexation of Crimea from Ukraine, "because I think it would unleash dynamics around the globe that we can't even predict."

Power added: "I would certainly be concerned if we thought that violating human rights, murdering opposition politicians and journalists, and some of the tactics that Putin has used internally -- that that would make for a reliable partnership over time."
 
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christiefan915 said:
How do we "negotiate out" that Putin has journalists killed if they speak out against him?

"As US Ambassador to the United Nations Samantha Power prepares to step down from the diplomatic stage, she is offering a word of warning to President-elect Donald Trump and his team: dismiss Russian acts of aggression at your own peril.

"I would be concerned if we looked away from Russian interference in our election," Power told CNN in an interview Tuesday, days before her term ends.

"I would be concerned if a country that just lopped off part of a neighbor got to keep that," she said, referring to Trump's signals that he was open to recognizing Russia's annexation of Crimea from Ukraine, "because I think it would unleash dynamics around the globe that we can't even predict."

Power added: "I would certainly be concerned if we thought that violating human rights, murdering opposition politicians and journalists, and some of the tactics that Putin has used internally -- that that would make for a reliable partnership over time."
Click to expand...
Realpolitik focuses on where our interests overlap. Do we really care if Putin kills journalists
or is a "KGB thug"? No really. that's not our interests.

Our interest is co-existence without hot war, and keeping down the Cold War weaponry to a minimum-
while at the same time guaranteeing the territorial integrity of Europe.

Our other interests is in checking Russian expansionism in the middle east, although Obama really did so poorly
with that much cannot be rolled back.
We can support Saudi Arabia/Gulf States as a counter to Iran/Russia alliance
( and again what do we really care about how they govern?)
And we need to make sure Egypt knows we always have their back -no more useless sanctions like Obama did.

Start there. there are other matters but these are the most pressing
 
anatta said:
Realpolitik focuses on where our interests overlap. Do we really care if Putin kills journalists
or is a "KGB thug"? No really. that's not our interests.

Our interest is co-existence without hot war, and keeping down the Cold War weaponry to a minimum-
while at the same time guaranteeing the territorial integrity of Europe.

Our other interests is in checking Russian expansionism in the middle east, although Obama really did so poorly
with that much cannot be rolled back.
We can support Saudi Arabia/Gulf States as a counter to Iran/Russia alliance
( and again what do we really care about how they govern?)
And we need to make sure Egypt knows we always have their back -no more useless sanctions like Obama did.

Start there. there are other matters but these are the most pressing
Click to expand...

Then I guess I'm not a fan of realpolitik because killing people matters to me. And if people like Putin have no compunction about killing those who speak out against him, no moral compass, then he could turn on the US just as fast as he turns on his own and others.

I care about human rights above all so I do care that Saudi Arabia and the Gulf State are horribly repressive, especially to women. Egypt is no prize in that regard either.
 
christiefan915 said:
Maybe you can stick to a normal-sized type and explain why trump tweeted "Russia talk is FAKE NEWS put out by the Dems, and played up by the media, in order to mask the big election defeat and the illegal leaks!"
Click to expand...
Be happy to. Remember when you said, "People better get used to the idea that anyone in trump's team who was in contact with Russia is going to be under suspicion."? This is what he's talking about. What you claim to be of paramount importance(Russian interference in the election)is just a thinly disguised witch hunt for GOP heads, that's the FAKE NEWS you guys vomit to the media and it's all part of the new democrat platform, resist and erect obstacles.
 
christiefan915 said:
Maybe you can stick to a normal-sized type and explain why trump tweeted "Russia talk is FAKE NEWS put out by the Dems, and played up by the media, in order to mask the big election defeat and the illegal leaks!"
Click to expand...
Be happy to. Remember when you said, "People better get used to the idea that anyone in trump's team who was in contact with Russia is going to be under suspicion."? This is what he's talking about. What you claim to be of paramount importance(Russian interference in the election)is just a thinly disguised witch hunt for GOP heads, that's the FAKE NEWS you guys vomit to the media and it's all part of the new democrat platform, resist and erect obstacles.
 
callinectes said:
Be happy to. Remember when you said, "People better get used to the idea that anyone in trump's team who was in contact with Russia is going to be under suspicion."? This is what he's talking about. What you claim to be of paramount importance(Russian interference in the election)is just a thinly disguised witch hunt for GOP heads, that's the FAKE NEWS you guys vomit to the media and it's all part of the new democrat platform, resist and erect obstacles.
Click to expand...

Posts 114, 117, 118, 121. The IC laid out facts. If trump calls this fake news then he distrusts the IC. Are we really supposed to think the entire IC colluded to trash trump with false intelligence?

If this report spells out how deep Russia is in our business then there should be an investigation. And IMO trump should welcome it and deal with the results. The country is made up of more than just his cult members who swallow without protest everything that crosses his lips.
 
callinectes said:
Be happy to. Remember when you said, "People better get used to the idea that anyone in trump's team who was in contact with Russia is going to be under suspicion."? This is what he's talking about. What you claim to be of paramount importance(Russian interference in the election)is just a thinly disguised witch hunt for GOP heads, that's the FAKE NEWS you guys vomit to the media and it's all part of the new democrat platform, resist and erect obstacles.
Click to expand...

Simply superb!
 
christiefan915 said:
Then I guess I'm not a fan of realpolitik because killing people matters to me. And if people like Putin have no compunction about killing those who speak out against him, no moral compass, then he could turn on the US just as fast as he turns on his own and others.

I care about human rights above all so I do care that Saudi Arabia and the Gulf State are horribly repressive, especially to women. Egypt is no prize in that regard either.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying do not care about human rights -it's a noble endeavor. But it cannot be how foreign policy is driven.

Whatever Putin does to journalists pales in comparison to US/west/Russian relations.
We have armies and naval forces and AF with nuclear and non-nuclear missiles and tank brigades and every weapon system possible pointed at each other.
Obviously managing that situation is of paramount importance - more then any concerns for internal human right.

That's what realpolitik is. management of intra-country alliances . Think of it as prioritization.
These are issues that effect the world. they have to be given more weight then anything else.
and getting the big things in order allows focus afterwards on he smaller,but still important issues
 
christiefan915 said:
Posts 114, 117, 118, 121. The IC laid out facts. If trump calls this fake news then he distrusts the IC. Are we really supposed to think the entire IC colluded to trash trump with false intelligence?

If this report spells out how deep Russia is in our business then there should be an investigation. And IMO trump should welcome it and deal with the results. The country is made up of more than just his cult members who swallow without protest everything that crosses his lips.
Click to expand...
The IC has it's own biases. one thing that always struck me about this was the briefing of the "fake news"
so called Golden Showers dossier.
Why would the IC brief Trump on fake reports, and then leak it? -the only explanation is to damage Trump
 
christiefan915 said:
If this is the report trump got, with the classified part included, why does he keep insisting anything about Russia is fake news?

"Russia talk is FAKE NEWS put out by the Dems, and played up by the media, in order to mask the big election defeat and the illegal leaks!" Trump tweeted.

Page 6 - We did not make an assessment of the impact that Russian activities had on the outcome of the 2016 election. The US intelligence community is charged with monitoring and assessing the intentions, capabilities, and actions of foreign actors; it does not analyze us political processes or US public opinion.

Page 12 - By their nature Russian influence campaigns are multifaceted and designed to be deniable because they use a mix of agents of influence, cutouts, front organizations, and false-flag operations. Moscow demonstrated this during the Ukraine crisis in 2014 when Russia deployed forces and advisers to eastern Ukraine and denied it publicly.

The Kremlin's campaign aimed at the us election featured disclosures of data obtained through Russian cyber operations; intrusions into US state and local electoral boards; and overt propaganda. Russian intelligence collection both informed and enabled the influence campaign.
Click to expand...

christiefan915 said:
No, we didn't forget those two. And we didn't forget bush's failed relationship with Putin, either. Right from the horse's mouth:

Former President George W. Bush warns that Russian leader Vladimir Putin will “push and push and push until someone stands up to him.”

Bush made the comments on “Ellen,” in response to President Donald Trump’s suggestions that the U.S. could pursue warmer relations with Russia. Last year, intelligence officials concluded that Russia interfered in the presidential election with the goal of helping Trump get elected. Many in Washington, D.C., have pushed for a probe into Trump administration’s ties to Russia.

Bush warned that it’s dangerous to appease the Russian president.

“I had a contentious relationship with him and I think whoever the president is, is going to find out that Putin will push and push and push until someone stands up to him,” Bush told Ellen DeGeneres on the show broadcast Thursday.

\http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/george-w-bush-putin_us_58b82616e4b01fc1bde63b6d
Click to expand...

christiefan915 said:
Page 13 - In early September, Putin said publicly it was important the DNC data was exposed to Wikileaks, calling the search for the source of the leaks a distraction and denying Russian "state-level" involvement.

The Kremlin's principal international propaganda outlet RT (formerly Russia Today) has actively collaborated with WikiLeaks. RT's editor-in-chief visited WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange at the Ecuadorian Embassy in London in August 2013, where they discussed renewing his broadcast contract with RT, according to Russian and Western media. Russian media subsequently announced that RT had become "the only Russia media company" to partner with WikiLeaks and had received access to "new leaks of secret information." RT routinely gives Assange sympathetic coverage and provides him a platform to denounce the United States.
Click to expand...

christiefan915 said:
Page 14 - Russian media hailed President-elect Trump's victory as a vindication of Putin's advocacy of global populist movements - the theme of Putin's annual conference for Western academics in October 2016 - and the latest example of Western liberalism's collapse.

Putin's chief propagandist Dmitriy Kiselev used his flagship weekly newsmagazine program this fall to cast President-elect Trump as an outsider victimized by a corrupt political establishment and faulty democratic election process that aimed to prevent his election because of his desire to work with Moscow.

Pro-Kremlin proxy Vladimir Zhirinovskiy, leader of the nationalist Liberal Democratic Party of Russia, proclaimed just before the election that if President-elect Trump won, Russia would "drink champagne" in anticipation of being able to advance its positions on Syria and Ukraine.
Click to expand...

christiefan915 said:
Page 14 - On 6 August, RT published an English-language video called "Julian Assange Special: Do WikiLeaks Have the E-mail That'll Put Clinton in Prison?" and an exclusive interview with Assange entitled "Clinton and ISIS Funded by the Same Money." RT's most popular video on Secretary Clinton, "How 100% of the Clintons' 'Charity' Went to...Themselves," had more than 9 million views on social media platforms. RT's most popular English language video about the President-elect, called "Trump Will Not Be Permitted To Win" featured Assange and had 2.2 million views.

Russia used trolls as well as RT as part of its influence efforts to denigrate Secretary Clinton. This effort amplified stories on scandals about Secretary Clinton and the role of WikiLeaks in the election campaign.
Click to expand...

christiefan915 said:
So far you haven't contributed anything worthwhile or even relevant to the topic. Try harder.
Click to expand...

We read it once so there is no need to post it all over again piece by piece.
So we know Russia has been trying to flood the US with propaganda and influence US attitudes since WWII....other than that which we already know, WHATS YOUR POINT ?
 
anatta said:
I'm not saying do not care about human rights -it's a noble endeavor. But it cannot be how foreign policy is driven.

Whatever Putin does to journalists pales in comparison to US/west/Russian relations.
We have armies and naval forces and AF with nuclear and non-nuclear missiles and tank brigades and every weapon system possible pointed at each other.
Obviously managing that situation is of paramount importance - more then any concerns for internal human right.

That's what realpolitik is. management of intra-country alliances . Think of it as prioritization.
These are issues that effect the world. they have to be given more weight then anything else.
and getting the big things in order allows focus afterwards on he smaller,but still important issues
Click to expand...

Great job, Anatta!
 
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