Lake Mead and Climate Change

[Dutch Uncle]

Lake Mead, the reservoir formed by the Hoover Dam, has been in the news lately, thanks to multiple bodies being found there, as dropping water levels reveal parts of the lake that have been underwater since it was originally filled after the dam was built. The sheer magnitude of the decline is amazing. We're used to seeing lakes dry up where the lake was fairly shallow at the best of times. But Lake Mead is now about 162 feet below the level it was at as recently as 2000. The West is drying out, and while we might get some intermittent relief, climatologists predict that on average it'll just get worse and worse, thanks to our failure to curb greenhouse gases.

No doubt climate change is part of the problem but the major problem is twofold, IMO:

1. Population explosion. Not just California either.*

2. California tree hugger laws that prevent building more water reservoirs to accommodate the increases in population. The water has to come from somewhere and Lake Mead is “it”.


* https://www.ppic.org/publication/californias-population/

One in eight US residents lives in California.
With over 39 million people (according to July 2021 estimates), California is the nation’s most populous state—its population is much larger than that of second-place Texas (29 million) and third-place Florida (22 million).
California’s population is projected to reach 45 million people by 2050.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

https://serc.carleton.edu/earth_analysis/image_analysis/introduction/day_5_part_1.html

as you an see, nothing new about lake levels dropping. has far more to do with excessive demand and snowfall / drought.

Agreed that population increases in the West and the drought probably have a lot more to do with it…but the drought could be a consequence of climate change.

 

[Matt Dillon]

It could be 2 PM you still wouldn't have the receipts Einstein.

https://www.ksbw.com/article/chispa-to-bring-more-affordable-housing-to-the-central-coast/39950263

https://www.orangejuiceblog.com/202...oxins-over-hb/comment-page-1/#comment-1468357

 

[Walt]

Plenty of water in Alaska. And I’d never consider living where there’s water restrictions.

Most of Alaska is a desert. It is a weird type of desert where there is lots of frozen water on the ground. Tundra often has very little rainfall, but what little water is put into the environment gets frozen and stuck there.

Global warming is going to change all that in ways we cannot conceive of yet. Alaska is one of those danger zones.

 

[anonymoose]

Most of Alaska is a desert. It is a weird type of desert where there is lots of frozen water on the ground. Tundra often has very little rainfall, but what little water is put into the environment gets frozen and stuck there.

Global warming is going to change all that in ways we cannot conceive of yet. Alaska is one of those danger zones.

Not only do we have no water restrictions but we pay one fee and use as much water as we want.
The tundra is most definitely not frozen in the summer. I work part time In Bethel and see the tundra flying in. Not only do the Kuskikwim and Yukon rivers flow through but there’s countless unnamed lakes that cover the Yukon-Kuskokwim Delta which is the size of Texas. Water is unlimited.
You know squat about Alaska.

 

[Walt]

]The tundra is most definitely not frozen in the summer.

You seem to be having trouble understanding the concept of "permafrost".

 

[cancel2 2022]

Not only do we have no water restrictions but we pay one fee and use as much water as we want.
The tundra is most definitely not frozen in the summer. I work part time In Bethel and see the tundra flying in. Not only do the Kuskikwim and Yukon rivers flow through but there’s countless unnamed lakes that cover the Yukon-Kuskokwim Delta which is the size of Texas. Water is unlimited.
You know squat about Alaska.

Salty knows squat about most things, pompous prick that be is.

 

[anonymoose]

You seem to be having trouble understanding the concept of "permafrost".

I know it quite well. All structures in Bethel are built on stilts. Permafrost is about 8 to 12 feet below the surface in July.
The tundra is squishy like a sponge to walk on. Best to wear Sorrels or your socks get wet.
Now where the fuck do you live that you’re so familiar with Alaska climate and geology?
“ Most of Alaska is a desert.”

 

[anonymoose]

Here’s a photo I took from the plane when flying in to Bethel about three to four weeks ago when the Kuskokwim River and lakes were still frozen. That looks like a dried up desert ??!!?!

 

[anonymoose]

Breakup Bash: Bethel celebrates as river ice moves on the Kuskokwim River



Ice broke free along the Kuskokwim River in Bethel on Thursday, May 5, 2022. (Emily Mesner / ADN)
https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/rur...es-as-river-ice-moves-on-the-kuskokwim-river/

 

[Phantasmal]

You seem to be having trouble understanding the concept of "permafrost".

He is exceedingly ignorant concerning Alaska, there were areas of AK that never thaw completely in the past, but now climate changes, as you stated, thaw does occur deeper than it did at one time
Permafrost temperatures at 1 m below ground in central Alaska have been warming since the 1960s and were reaching near to the melting point in the mid-1990s. There has been a retreat to colder temperatures (less than -1°C) in the last few years.

https://www.pmel.noaa.gov › detect

[h=3]Arctic Change - Land: Permafrost - NOAA/PMEL[/h]

 

[anonymoose]

He is exceedingly ignorant concerning Alaska, there were areas of AK that never thaw completely in the past, but now climate changes, as you stated, thaw does occur deeper than it did at one time
Permafrost temperatures at 1 m below ground in central Alaska have been warming since the 1960s and were reaching near to the melting point in the mid-1990s. There has been a retreat to colder temperatures (less than -1°C) in the last few years.

https://www.pmel.noaa.gov › detect

[h=3]Arctic Change - Land: Permafrost - NOAA/PMEL[/h]

Yet Walt thinks Alaska is a desert.
During a dry spell in the summer I’ll have my sprinkler on all day. The water comes from Lake Eklutna.
I pay the same fee if I used no water.

 

[anonymoose]

He is exceedingly ignorant concerning Alaska, there were areas of AK that never thaw completely in the past, but now climate changes, as you stated, thaw does occur deeper than it did at one time

Good. More water.

Most of Alaska is a desert. It is a weird type of desert where there is lots of frozen water on the ground. Tundra often has very little rainfall, but what little water is put into the environment gets frozen and stuck there.

Global warming is going to change all that in ways we cannot conceive of yet. Alaska is one of those danger zones.

And Phanny thinks Walt knows what he’s talking about.

 

[Phantasmal]

Walt seems to understand permafrost better than yourself, man who lies about Native American woman.

 

[Celticguy]

Agreed that population increases in the West and the drought probably have a lot more to do with it…but the drought could be a consequence of climate change.

it could but then again as the chart shows, sometimes it just happens (volcanoes etc).

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

What happened to the idea of towing icebergs?

I suppose they are not thirsty enough yet for that yet.

Give it time!

 

[Sailor]

He is exceedingly ignorant concerning Alaska, there were areas of AK that never thaw completely in the past, but now climate changes, as you stated, thaw does occur deeper than it did at one time
Permafrost temperatures at 1 m below ground in central Alaska have been warming since the 1960s and were reaching near to the melting point in the mid-1990s. There has been a retreat to colder temperatures (less than -1°C) in the last few years.

https://www.pmel.noaa.gov › detect

[h=3]Arctic Change - Land: Permafrost - NOAA/PMEL[/h]

You might want to read the last sentence of your own post.

 

[Mina]

Bullshit. It's a MAN-MADE lake in the middle of a damn desert. 85 years ago, there was a LOT less water there than there is now (also known as NONE). In 1976, when I lived in Clark county, you could go swimming in that lake, come out of the water, and be bone dry in about 3 minutes trunks and all. Because it was a desert, and there wasn't supposed to BE any water there. Also, the population of Clark county in 1976 was less than 500k, now it's almost 2.5 million, and Clark has almost 74% of the population of the entire state of Nevada! And here's a little snippet from cnn if you don't believe me.

"About a century ago, representatives from seven U.S. states — Nevada, California, Arizona, Utah, Wyoming, Colorado, and New Mexico — struck a deal to divvy up the Colorado River. Hydrologists warned that officials were promising more water than the river could give, according to Fleck. But in an era driven by power and politics, their warnings were largely ignored and plans moved forward."

For many decades, the rate at which the water was replenished was far greater, allowing water levels to be maintained at a relatively stable level. Now that's no longer the case. Precipitation in the upper part of the river basin has declined dramatically.

 

[Mina]

It is not climate change. It is water demand. You know, all those tree huggers that need green lawns and pools.

It's climate change, as well. It's not that it has drained because they had to increase the rate of draining to accommodate downstream water use. It's that the rate of replenishment has fallen to the point that it's no longer capable of sustaining former rates of draw down. The era is in the midst of the most severe megadrought seen there in at least 1,200 years:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smar...-into-lake-mead-because-of-drought-180980030/

Climate change is almost certainly driving or at least exacerbating that:

https://www.azcentral.com/in-depth/...am-drought-water-levels-lake-mead/5134031001/

 

[Mina]

Do you know what desertification is?

Of course. That's the kind of science that gets covered in about fifth grade. Anthropogenic greenhouse gases have become a major driver of that process:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-17710-7

Here's more information if you'd like to learn about desertification:

https://www.ipcc.ch/srccl/chapter/chapter-3/