Judge Rules Jury Can Consider Manslaughter Charge In Zimmerman Trial

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A judge said Thursday that jurors in the George Zimmerman case can consider the lesser charge of manslaughter, but she delayed ruling on whether they may also consider third-degree murder after defense attorneys called the proposal “outrageous.”

Prosecutor Richard Mantei argued that instructions for third-degree murder should be included on the premise that Zimmerman committed child abuse when he fatally shot 17-year-old Trayvon Martin because Martin was underage.


But defense attorney Don West called the proposed instruction “a trick,” and he accused the prosecutor of springing it on the defense at the last minute.


“Just when I didn’t think this case could get any more bizarre, the state is alleging child abuse?” West said. “This is outrageous. It’s outrageous the state would seek to do this at this time.”


West questioned how Zimmerman could be charged with child abuse while Martin was on top of Zimmerman “pummeling him.”


Judge Debra Nelson says she will rule on the proposal later. The judge, however, agreed with the prosecution that jurors could consider manslaughter as a lesser charge.


West said he wanted the six jurors to only consider the second-degree murder charge or not guilty.


“The state has charged him with second degree murder. They should be required to prove it,” West said. “If they had wanted to charge him with manslaughter … they could do that.”


Jurors could begin deliberating as early as Friday. Prosecutors were expected to give closing arguments Thursday afternoon, followed by the defense closing on Friday morning.

http://tampa.cbslocal.com/2013/07/1...sider-manslaughter-charge-in-zimmerman-trial/

:whoa:
By any means necessary to get a conviction. Surprised they did not tack on littering and jay walking as well.
 
Maybe she sees the prosecution's 2nd degree murder case slipping away and wants to give the jury the option of convicting him of something. I really haven't been following the case other than reading the posts on this site so my knowledge is extremely limited and definitely partisan from on post to the next. :)
 
It is clear the Prosecution does not feel as good about their case as the defense does.
 
Jarod said:
It is clear the Prosecution does not feel as good about their case as the defense does.
Click to expand...

Child abuse ?....Its fucking rediculous.
Its a desperation move by the prosecution...and should not have been allowed...its akin to double jeopardy because it was obvious that the murder2 charge was
not proven and his acquittal was almost assured, I'm beginning to pity Zimmerman and his perdicament...
 
NOVA said:
Its a desperation move by the prosecution...and should not have been allowed...its akin to double jeopardy because it was obvious that the murder2 charge was
not proven, I'm beginning to pity Zimmerman and his perdicament...
Click to expand...

1) Its not a desperate move, it happens all the time.
2) It was the correct decision by the Judge according to Florida case law.
 
NOVA said:
Child abuse ?....Its fucking rediculous.
Its a desperation move by the prosecution...and should not have been allowed...its akin to double jeopardy because it was obvious that the murder2 charge was
not proven and his acquittal was almost assured, I'm beginning to pity Zimmerman and his perdicament...
Click to expand...

Every time you open your mouth you leave no doubt of your stupidity.
 
Jarod said:
1) Its not a desperate move, it happens all the time.
2) It was the correct decision by the Judge according to Florida case law.
Click to expand...

How often if happens is irrelevant....its a decision made when the state knows they have not proven the original charge.
and the judge admonishing the defense about complaining about her rulings is bullshit....its their DUTY to get on record any disagreements they have
with her rulings.....its their job for the public record.
 
NOVA said:
How often if happens is irrelevant....its a decision made when the state knows they have not proven the original charge.
and the judge admonishing the defense about complaining about her rulings is bullshit....its their DUTY to get on record any disagreements they have
with her rulings.....its their job for the public record.
Click to expand...

Sometimes its the defense asking for the lesser to be included, its not always the State. The side with the weaker case is often the one making the argument. The judge was patient and polite, the guy simply objected too many times to the same situation. One objection is enough, once its overruled you have made your record.
 
Rana said:
Yeah, that's why they didn't let George testify.
Click to expand...

The case against murder 2 was won by the defense, they didn't need Z to testify....its very unusual that any defendant ever testifies....
His entire story of the events was told by several other witnesses....what more could he offer except to open himself up to ridicule by the prosecution...
 
Jarod said:
1) Its not a desperate move, it happens all the time.
2) It was the correct decision by the Judge according to Florida case law.
Click to expand...

Yeah, manslaughter is, undoubtedly, a lesser included offense. The third degree murder thing based on child abuse might be a bit of a stretch. This judge has shown no reason to doubt she will make the right ruling.
 
Jarod said:
Sometimes its the defense asking for the lesser to be included, its not always the State. The side with the weaker case is often the one making the argument. The judge was patient and polite, the guy simply objected too many times to the same situation. One objection is enough, once its overruled you have made your record.
Click to expand...

Well, the case in question is THIS case and for obvious reasons...I watched the judge's questioning of Z....it bordered on badgering him and those
particular questions should have been addressed to his lawyers at least until the the trial was concluded....

It was the same thing with the toxicology reports about Martins being under the influence that night....it was part of the autopsy report and she had
no right to exclude any portion of that report in the first place in my view....shes now allowing it in for the jurors to see.

This judge is showing a tiny bit of bias from what I've seen.
 
NOVA said:
Well, the case in question is THIS case and for obvious reasons...I watched the judge's questioning of Z....it bordered on badgering him and those
particular questions should have been addressed to his lawyers at least until the the trial was concluded....

It was the same thing with the toxicology reports about Martins being under the influence that night....it was part of the autopsy report and she had
no right to exclude any portion of that report in the first place in my view....shes now allowing it in for the jurors to see.

This judge is showing a tiny bit of bias from what I've seen.
Click to expand...

I watched it also, I've seen much worse, and not only is the judge entitled to ask those questions, she is required to do so, or any conviction would be easily thrown out on appeal.
 
NOVA said:
This judge is showing a tiny bit of bias from what I've seen.
Click to expand...

Sure...the republican judge appointed by a republican governor is showing bias. I'm not surprised.


btw...anyone else notice West is acting like Yurt? He's about to be censored and tossed in jail if he doesn't quit the incessant whining.
 
NOVA said:
Child abuse ?....Its fucking rediculous.
Its a desperation move by the prosecution...and should not have been allowed...its akin to double jeopardy because it was obvious that the murder2 charge wa
not proven and his acquittal was almost assured, I'm beginning to pity Zimmerman and his perdicament...
Click to expand...

Why? Martin had barely turned 17 when he was gunned down. In Florida, and I suspect most states, you lay a hand on a kid and it's abuse.

But you tiny brain only processes the phrase in the most extreme circumstances. Hell, if you touch an adult without their permission you can be charged with assault.
 
Howey said:
Why? Martin had barely turned 17 when he was gunned down. In Florida, and I suspect most states, you lay a hand on a kid and it's abuse.

But you tiny brain only processes the phrase in the most extreme circumstances. Hell, if you touch an adult without their permission you can be charged with assault.
Click to expand...

There is no valid evidence that Zimmerman was engaged in child abuse and then killed Martin. That is the intent of including it there and so I agree with the judge.
 
Professor Baxter said:
There is no valid evidence that Zimmerman was engaged in child abuse and then killed Martin. That is the intent of including it there and so I agree with the judge.
Click to expand...

The act of shooting TM was child abuse, IF it was not self defense.
 
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