Superfreak
Verified User
I know. We are beginning to face similar issues in Denver. Despite all the land we have to build on, no one wants anything with height built to the west of them due to mountain views. Its nuts.
"Intergenerational Injustice"
- Thread starter cawacko
- Start date
I know. We are beginning to face similar issues in Denver. Despite all the land we have to build on, no one wants anything with height built to the west of them due to mountain views. Its nuts.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Yes it is what it's about and no it's not a strawman.
I've been dealing with NIMBY's and the associated problems for almost 30 years. When you're dealing with NIMBY's you have to accept several things and work within those parameters or your just blowing smoke.
They have property rights. Just like freedom of speech, religion, the right to bear arms, etc., those are sacred constitutionally protected rights and in a free market, capitalist economy they should be.
When you're working on a development project, and I don't care if it's real estate, a hazardous waste landfill, a petroleum refinery, an animal rendering plant, a waste water treatment plant, a Part B Hazardous Waste TSDF, a strip joint, a waste incinerator, etc., near any residential community you will be dealing with zoning restrictions and political coalitions from those affected communities and those people and communities have specific rights. You can demonize them all you want with inane divisive non sense like "intergenerational whatever" and your just blowing smoke.
If you don't recognize those rights and work with those affected communities in regards to their concerns your likely hood of prevailing are slim to none. That leaves you with little choice but to either go do business elsewhere or build a political coalition strong enough to trump their rights.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
or they'll be demolished to build more high rises...but what if they don't want to sell?
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Good points on mass transit.That would be a very interesting experiment if even possible. But then, the answer would come in the form of those companies and the politicians finding a way to get cheap transportation out to those areas to accomplish the same.
Chicago is a great example; they have a system that can get you from over 30 miles away into the city in far less time than it would take to drive there and a hell of a lot cheaper.
Toronto; my girlfriend travels the thirty or so miles from Barrie by Train in order to work in the city center.
I guess Californians are so far ahead of everyone else, we can't figure it out yet.
Wacko....your retort?
So the citizens prefer old decrepit auto shops to new multi story multi use buildings??? I don't get that.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Don't you need public transportation first?
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Oh and by the way if you really, really, really want to see some bizzare and crazy shit (think of a whole conference room full of lunatics who make Desh look tame by comparison) attend any public open comment event for any of these types of projects. It will open your eyes and the loonies will be out in force! LOL
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
cawacko
Well-known member
LA has crappy public transportation. But SF, Portland, Seattle, NY and D.C. all have it
cawacko
Well-known member
Trust me I've been. I've spoken in front of the SF Planning Commission and the SF Board of Supervisors when we were funding a high rise condo development. I tell people the same thing, if you really want to SF go to one of those meetings.
cawacko
Well-known member
there is no Kelo case involved here. We're talking about people who own buildings and/or land that want to build and can't because of the government and NIMBY's.
cawacko
Well-known member
That's not every case but it definitely occurs. In this case San Francisco is growing and those who have been here a long time don't like it. They don't like all the people and the traffic etc.
It's not that they are wrong to feel that way but reality is City's are dynamic places and they change. So even examples of what I offered here they fight against because if you build one there's just going to be more of them later. That's the mindset.
So why won't they change the zoning and regulation in Orange County, Del Mar, La Jolla where rich white republicans run those cities?
Shouldn't they make housing affordable for Blacks to live near them? Or do you only talk about SF?
Superfreak
Verified User
Then, you idiot, they don't have to sell. Your straw man (yes, that is what it is) of talking about putting a waste disposal plant etc... is nonsense. We are talking about not letting OTHER people build out THEIR properties (they have property rights too) to maximize the ability of a city to hold people. you think poor people should just get fucked over because you want your views.
cawacko
Well-known member
It's pointless responding to you because either you have no idea what's going in the world and how it works, or you are just a troll. I've stated multiple times in this thread the housing crisis is in the major coastal cities. LA, SF, Portland, Seattle, NY and D.C.
It is absolutely amazing you claim to live in California and claim to be a homeowner yet have no clue about this.
Superfreak
Verified User
He is referencing SF because that is where he lives. But the rezoning needs to take place in the above as well.
cawacko
Well-known member
Rezoning needs to happen all over California but the crisis is greatest in large cities because that's where the jobs are and that's where young people want to go. Young single people aren't flocking to the suburbs. She has no clue what she is talking about, clearly.
Finally gets it.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Well by US standards they may be adequate or good but how about compared to the mass transit in first world European and Asian countries? I have a friend in Chicago and he spends little over an hour a day commuting by rail from around 20 miles from city center. That's not bad when you're not the one doing the driving. Saves a lot on car too.