Indiana GOP Rep Thinks Women Will Fake Rape Or Incest To Get An Abortion

[Bfgrn]

No cognitive problem at all. You are claiming that an expectant mother cannot be forced to take care of her unborn child. By that same logic, we cannot force parents to take care of their children once they are born.

And who will pay for it? There are medical facilities and programs that will provide free medical care and free food for expectant mothers.





Bfgrn, let me ask you again to simply state your views on what should be legal and what should not. In previous threads you refused to do so, and then pitched a fit when I made assumptions about your beliefs. State them clearly so we can continue to have this discussion.

WOW, you have a gross cognitive problem, a twisted form of logic and a penchant for false equivalencies. Let's start with a key word...parent. Is it a choice or a dictum?

I believe the law is fair. It should be a woman's personal choice what she does with her uterus.

 

[Rationalist]

I believe the law is fair. It should be a woman's personal choice what she does with her uterus.

Your statement is rather ambiguous. I am pro-choice, but I believe that choice should be made within the first trimester. Is this also your view?

 

[WinterBorn]

WOW, you have a gross cognitive problem, a twisted form of logic and a penchant for false equivalencies. Let's start with a key word...parent. Is it a choice or a dictum?

I believe the law is fair. It should be a woman's personal choice what she does with her uterus.

What have I twisted?

So you believe a woman should be able to get an abortion any time during the pregnancy and for any reason?

 

[Bfgrn]

Your statement is rather ambiguous. I am pro-choice, but I believe that choice should be made within the first trimester. Is this also your view?

That is the law.

 

[Bfgrn]

What have I twisted?

So you believe a woman should be able to get an abortion any time during the pregnancy and for any reason?

What have you twisted? A woman forced to be a 'parent' is not equal to a woman who makes the choice and commitment to be a parent. I said the law is fair. The law only allows late term abortions if the mother's life is endangered.

 

[WinterBorn]

That is the law.

I have some issues with that arbitrary time span. The first trimester sees the fetus develop into an almost functioning human being.

http://www.ncrtl.org/LifeLine.htm

 

[WinterBorn]

What have you twisted? A woman forced to be a 'parent' is not equal to a woman who makes the choice and commitment to be a parent. I said the law is fair. The law only allows late term abortions if the mother's life is endangered.

The woman made a choice to have unprotected sex. Using abortion as late birth control is disgusting. If she waits until late in the first trimester, she is killing a living person.

 

[Rationalist]

I have some issues with that arbitrary time span. The first trimester sees the fetus develop into an almost functioning human being.

http://www.ncrtl.org/LifeLine.htm

I agree the law is in need of revision. A good start would be overturning Roe v Wade, and allowing the States to determine their own abortion laws. I suspect most States would establish somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 - 8 weeks as limit. Of course, any amount of time is arbitrary. This is why many take an "all or nothing" approach.

 

[Phantasmal]

I agree the law is in need of revision. A good start would be overturning Roe v Wade, and allowing the States to determine their own abortion laws. I suspect most States would establish somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 - 8 weeks as limit. Of course, any amount of time is arbitrary. This is why many take an "all or nothing" approach.

Most states already have their laws in place and the only thing that is outlawed is late term abortions and I believe that is the way it will stay.

 

[Canceled2]

http://www.sfuhl.org/b_unborn_child_develops.htm

 

[Rationalist]

Most states already have their laws in place and the only thing that is outlawed is late term abortions and I believe that is the way it will stay.

Most of those laws were enacted 40 - 50 years ago. I suspect the States would review the laws they have on the books if Roe is overturned.

 

[Minister of Truth]

Most states already have their laws in place and the only thing that is outlawed is late term abortions and I believe that is the way it will stay.

Here's where Obama stands on abortion, from when he was a senator in IL:

Opposed legislation protecting born-alive failed abortions

Obama has consistently refused to support legislation that would define an infant who survives a late-term induced-labor abortion as a human being with the right to live. He insists that no restriction must ever be placed on the right of a mother to decide to abort her child.

On March 30, 2001, Obama was the only Illinois senator who rose to speak against a bill that would have protected babies who survived late term labor-induced abortion. Obama rose to object that if the bill passed, and a nine-month-old fetus survived a late-term labor-induced abortion was deemed to be a person who had a right to live, then the law would "forbid abortions to take place." Obama further explained the equal protection clause of the Fourteenth Amendment does not allow somebody to kill a child, so if the law deemed a child who survived a late-term labor-induced abortion had a right to live, "then this would be an anti-abortion statute."

http://www.ontheissues.org/social/barack_obama_abortion.htm

 

[Bfgrn]

Here's where Obama stands on abortion, from when he was a senator in IL:



http://www.ontheissues.org/social/barack_obama_abortion.htm

That is bullshit.

Illinois law has long stated that if an abortion is performed when the fetus is deemed to be viable, the doctor must:

Choose the method of abortion least likely to harm the fetus.

Have in attendance a second doctor who can immediately take over care of the child if it's born alive.

Use every available means to keep any born-alive child living and healthy.

To do otherwise constitutes a Class 3 felony, which carries a sentence of two to five years in prison. That's been the law in Illinois since 1975. What Obama voted against was legislation that would have extended the law's protection to any aborted fetus that shows any sign of life, even if doctors are certain that it cannot survive.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_alive_baloney.html

 

[Bfgrn]

I agree the law is in need of revision. A good start would be overturning Roe v Wade, and allowing the States to determine their own abortion laws. I suspect most States would establish somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 - 8 weeks as limit. Of course, any amount of time is arbitrary. This is why many take an "all or nothing" approach.

You right wing fascists have almost completely undermined the law already.

Legal abortion is not widely accessible to women in the U.S.

The Supreme Court confirmed women's right to choose abortion in 1973, and the courts have upheld that finding in subsequent cases. But access to abortion has been severely eroded. The most recent survey found that 88% of all U.S. counties have no identifiable abortion provider. In non-metropolitan areas, the figure rises to 97%. As a result, many women must travel long distances to reach the nearest abortion provider.

But distance is not the only barrier women face. Many other factors have contributed to the current crisis in abortion access, including a shortage of trained abortion providers; state laws that make getting an abortion more complicated than is medically necessary; continued threats of violence and harassment at abortion clinics; state and federal Medicaid restrictions; and fewer hospitals providing abortion services.

http://www.prochoice.org/about_abortion/facts/access_abortion.html

 

[Bfgrn]

The woman made a choice to have unprotected sex. Using abortion as late birth control is disgusting. If she waits until late in the first trimester, she is killing a living person.

NOW the truth comes out. It's not about the fetus, it's about controlling a woman's vagina. The fucking vagina police. You really are right wing slime.

 

[WinterBorn]

NOW the truth comes out. It's not about the fetus, it's about controlling a woman's vagina. The fucking vagina police. You really are right wing slime.

WTF? You really are floundering around and losing, aren't you.

The truth is that I stated a simple fact. And I stated that in response to your "A woman forced to be a 'parent' is not equal to a woman who makes the choice and commitment to be a parent.". You are trying to make it look like the pregnant woman had no choice in getting that way. Which is obviously false.

Rather than calling names and trying to sound self righteous, how about sticking with the topic.



I am not trying to control a woman's body. But I am requiring that people be responsible for their actions. That lack of responsibility is part of the problem in our society today. I also want the father of the child held responsible.

 

[Bfgrn]

WTF? You really are floundering around and losing, aren't you.

The truth is that I stated a simple fact. And I stated that in response to your "A woman forced to be a 'parent' is not equal to a woman who makes the choice and commitment to be a parent.". You are trying to make it look like the pregnant woman had no choice in getting that way. Which is obviously false.

Rather than calling names and trying to sound self righteous, how about sticking with the topic.



I am not trying to control a woman's body. But I am requiring that people be responsible for their actions. That lack of responsibility is part of the problem in our society today. I also want the father of the child held responsible.

No, of course not...you are merely 'willing to tell the majority of people that they are incapable of managing their own lives without interference from the gov't'

 

[WinterBorn]

No, of course not...you are merely 'willing to tell the majority of people that they are incapable of managing their own lives without interference from the gov't'

I would love for you to show me where I said anything of the kind.

All I am doing is recognizing that, even in the first trimester, the fetus is a living human being. I am not saying abortions should be outlawed. But I am saying that killing that developing human for the sake of convenience and lack of personal responsibility is wrong.

 

[Bfgrn]

I would love for you to show me where I said anything of the kind.

All I am doing is recognizing that, even in the first trimester, the fetus is a living human being. I am not saying abortions should be outlawed. But I am saying that killing that developing human for the sake of convenience and lack of personal responsibility is wrong.

You can't connect the dots can you? HOW would you 'require that people be responsible for their actions'?

 

[WinterBorn]

You can't connect the dots can you? HOW would you 'require that people be responsible for their actions'?

I am not the one having trouble connecting the dots.

How do I require that people be responsible for their actions? You are not that daft. Anyone old enough to have sex knows that pregnancy is a possible result. If they take that risk then they should not use abortion to avoid the consequences. I am not trying to control anyone's sex life. But there ARE ways to avoid pregnancy.

You are ignoring the facts of the living being inside the woman, even in the first trimester.