Immigration

cawacko

Well-known member
So there is a big (illegal) immigration protest going on in downtown San Francisco right now. Not exactly sure why they are protesting today but whatever. Sounds like it is next on Obama's and Congress's agenda.

I agree with the need for immigration reform. I think we need better work visa's and to let more of the highly educated/skilled foreign workers come into this country. I am not for amnesty which didn't work in the past and is I'm sure what's going to happen.

But hey it's not going to cost any more for healthcare even though we are now insuring 30 million previously uninsured what's adding another 15 million illegals going to do?
 
Insuring the (now) illegals would cost a lot more than insuring average Americans because their income is so low and they'd get HC almost completely off of subsidies.
 
Insuring the (now) illegals would cost a lot more than insuring average Americans because their income is so low and they'd get HC almost completely off of subsidies.
Aside from this, legalizing them has intangible costs. It costs us our borders and national sovereignty. It costs us the respect for law (granted I have little of that but I'm speaking about society as a whole). It costs far more then dollars could ever show.
 
Aside from this, legalizing them has intangible costs. It costs us our borders and national sovereignty. It costs us the respect for law (granted I have little of that but I'm speaking about society as a whole). It costs far more then dollars could ever show.

I'm glad that you said that. Imagine how it feels for someone like me who came here legally with a lot to offer, did everything by the book, paid all my taxes and SS, and went through all the proper channels to become a permanent resident. Now I see these hordes of people who thumbed their noses at the law, being given greater opportunities than those of us who toed the line every minute. It's very discouraging to say the least.
 
I'm glad that you said that. Imagine how it feels for someone like me who came here legally with a lot to offer, did everything by the book, paid all my taxes and SS, and went through all the proper channels to become a permanent resident. Now I see these hordes of people who thumbed their noses at the law, being given greater opportunities than those of us who toed the line every minute. It's very discouraging to say the least.
Yeah I know. I can't blame them entirely though, we do need immigration reforms. But still, you want to be part of America, you need to be a part legally.
 
I'm glad that you said that. Imagine how it feels for someone like me who came here legally with a lot to offer, did everything by the book, paid all my taxes and SS, and went through all the proper channels to become a permanent resident. Now I see these hordes of people who thumbed their noses at the law, being given greater opportunities than those of us who toed the line every minute. It's very discouraging to say the least.

No, you're just a goody-goody. ;)


:clink:
 
Aside from this, legalizing them has intangible costs. It costs us our borders and national sovereignty. It costs us the respect for law (granted I have little of that but I'm speaking about society as a whole). It costs far more then dollars could ever show.

Fuck borders. Fuck national sovereignty. They're evil.
 
I'm glad that you said that. Imagine how it feels for someone like me who came here legally with a lot to offer, did everything by the book, paid all my taxes and SS, and went through all the proper channels to become a permanent resident. Now I see these hordes of people who thumbed their noses at the law, being given greater opportunities than those of us who toed the line every minute. It's very discouraging to say the least.
I think I agree with you more than I agree with Billy. The notion that these desperately poor illegal immigrants being attracted to the US by jobs and being exploited by US companies as cheap labor are somehow a threat to our national sovereignty and our geographical borders is a laughable notion usually supported by people who really just want to machine gun poor Mexicans.

I mean I understand completely how you feel Thorn. When my wife was waiting for her permanent residency to be approved she couldn't work and it took nearly a year for her to get her permanent residency approved. In the meantime there was a construction crew of mostly illegals building a house across the street. Seeing them thumb there noses at the law was truly frustrating. Particularly considering we really needed the money that my wife, who did it the right way, could have brought in if she could have worked.

But let's look at this realistically and humanely. These illegal immigrants are human beings. They are not our enemies! They are not a military threat as the right wing rhetoric of propagandist would have us believe. They are desperately poor people, for the most part, who just want an oppurtunity to take care of their families.

Then consider your situation and my wifes. Both middle class, both from middle class families with good educations (in your case an excellent one) and marketable skills. Neither one of you is either a strong back or cheap labor type. Neither one of you faced a situation as difficult or as bleak as the typical illegal. You could have stayed in Canada and my wife in the Philippines and you both would of still had meaningful middle class lives and the affluence to meet more than just basic needs.

So let's put the blame where it squarely belongs. On those who would create the conditions that would cause these people to leave their homes to come here in order to find jobs. Let's blame it on the corrupt cabal of cleptocracies in latin America that oppresses so many of it's citizens forcing them to live in hopeless poverty and let's blame it on the business interest here who are more interested in a source of cheap labor then our laws or national interest.

The immigration problem is an easy one to solve. If the government throws your ass n jail for 2 years and fines you $50,000 per violation, (read per illegal immigrant employed) then this shit would come to a screeching halt. The jobs would dry up. The illegals would go home.

Until that happens then all the talk about immigration reform is just that, talk and those who talk militantly are just wannabe Kluxers with their white robes hidden in a closet who really just want a good reason to kill poor brown people.What we have to be is careful that these poor people are not painted up to be some sort of threat that requires violence to resolve. That would be insane and immoral. There just poor people looking for work.
 
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Angry at the government in Mexico City, Texans fought and won the Texas Revolution in 1835-36. Texas now became an independent nation, the Republic of Texas.As a result of the Mexican-American War, Mexico ceded California to the United States.
 
Immigration reform is just big business manipulating the labor market to get cheaper labor.

Americans deserve the labor market protections of a functioning border. Citizenship must mean something. Our ancestors died to make it mean something. We can't just give it all away based on idiotic globalization rhetoric, which is merely the propaganda of internationalist fascists.

Destroy the BrotherHood of The Snake.
 
Immigration reform is just big business manipulating the labor market to get cheaper labor.

Americans deserve the labor market protections of a functioning border. Citizenship must mean something. Our ancestors died to make it mean something. We can't just give it all away based on idiotic globalization rhetoric, which is merely the propaganda of internationalist fascists.

Destroy the BrotherHood of The Snake.
Drop the insane paranoid rhetoric and I would agree with you. Enforce the laws. Prosecute those people who employ illegals and this problem will come to a screeching halt.

You're right. Immigration reform is just a bull shit term for how to make it legal to exploit poor Mexicans for cheap labor. Fuck that!
 
Drop the insane paranoid rhetoric and I would agree with you. Enforce the laws. Prosecute those people who employ illegals and this problem will come to a screeching halt.

You're right. Immigration reform is just a bull shit term for how to make it legal to exploit poor Mexicans for cheap labor. Fuck that!

There's no insane paranoid rhetoric. You do agree with me though.
 
I think I agree with you more than I agree with Billy. The notion that these desperately poor illegal immigrants being attracted to the US by jobs and being exploited by US companies as cheap labor are somehow a threat to our national sovereignty and our geographical borders is a laughable notion usually supported by people who really just want to machine gun poor Mexicans.

I mean I understand completely how you feel Thorn. When my wife was waiting for her permanent residency to be approved she couldn't work and it took nearly a year for her to get her permanent residency approved. In the meantime there was a construction crew of mostly illegals building a house across the street. Seeing them thumb there noses at the law was truly frustrating. Particularly considering we really needed the money that my wife, who did it the right way, could have brought in if she could have worked.

But let's look at this realistically and humanely. These illegal immigrants are human beings. They are not our enemies! They are not a military threat as the right wing rhetoric of propagandist would have us believe. They are desperately poor people, for the most part, who just want an oppurtunity to take care of their families.

Then consider your situation and my wifes. Both middle class, both from middle class families with good educations (in your case an excellent one) and marketable skills. Neither one of you is either a strong back or cheap labor type. Neither one of you faced a situation as difficult or as bleak as the typical illegal. You could have stayed in Canada and my wife in the Philippines and you both would of still had meaningful middle class lives and the affluence to meet more than just basic needs.

So let's put the blame where it squarely belongs. On those who would create the conditions that would cause these people to leave their homes to come here in order to find jobs. Let's blame it on the corrupt cabal of cleptocracies in latin America that oppresses so many of it's citizens forcing them to live in hopeless poverty and let's blame it on the business interest here who are more interested in a source of cheap labor then our laws or national interest.

The immigration problem is an easy one to solve. If the government throws your ass n jail for 2 years and fines you $50,000 per violation, (read per illegal immigrant employed) then this shit would come to a screeching halt. The jobs would dry up. The illegals would go home.

Until that happens then all the talk about immigration reform is just that, talk and those who talk militantly are just wannabe Kluxers with their white robes hidden in a closet who really just want a good reason to kill poor brown people.What we have to be is careful that these poor people are not painted up to be some sort of threat that requires violence to resolve. That would be insane and immoral. There just poor people looking for work.

My man it's the President you voted for who is talking immigration reform. It's the leaders of Congress, your party, who is talking immigration reform. It's illegal immigrants themselves who want amnesty that are talking immigration reform so this talk only people on the right who just want to kill Mexicans sounds like some Watermark trolling.

Now I love Ohio but there's no freaking brain drain in Ohio. There is in the Silicon Valley. We (the U.S.) are turning away some of the world's brightest people by not giving them work visas which is harming U.S. companies and the U.S. as a whole by not letting them come here. And that has nothing to do with 'let's make me look good by accusing others of wanting to kill brown people'.
 
My man it's the President you voted for who is talking immigration reform. It's the leaders of Congress, your party, who is talking immigration reform. It's illegal immigrants themselves who want amnesty that are talking immigration reform so this talk only people on the right who just want to kill Mexicans sounds like some Watermark trolling.

Now I love Ohio but there's no freaking brain drain in Ohio. There is in the Silicon Valley. We (the U.S.) are turning away some of the world's brightest people by not giving them work visas which is harming U.S. companies and the U.S. as a whole by not letting them come here. And that has nothing to do with 'let's make me look good by accusing others of wanting to kill brown people'.

There's no brain drain. The ceo's just like compliant people from poor nations who have no american notions of being respected or well treated.
 
Legalize them all. We stole Cali and Texas from them.

wouldn't it be amazingly ironic......we got the land from the Spanish grandee's by lending them money they couldn't pay back.....then we lose it by borrowing money to pay for health care that we can't pay back......
 
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