"I like the people who weren't captured"

ExpressLane said:
McCain has my utmost respect as a soldier but he was not a good politician.
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As a Navy officer, McCain was somewhat problematic seeing as how he had three aircraft crashes, all determined to be his fault (and I'll add that the only reason his wings weren't taken was he was the son of an Admiral), and by all accounts a mediocre administrator. I still respect his bravery and service, there's no doubting either. As a politician, he continued a career of mediocrity and mostly got where he was on the basis of heredity not personal performance.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
As a Navy officer, McCain was somewhat problematic seeing as how he had three aircraft crashes, all determined to be his fault (and I'll add that the only reason his wings weren't taken was he was the son of an Admiral), and by all accounts a mediocre administrator. I still respect his bravery and service, there's no doubting either. As a politician, he continued a career of mediocrity and mostly got where he was on the basis of heredity not personal performance.
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I had real respect for him refusing to be released before his men were.
 
ExpressLane said:
I think it is honorable much like dying for the country is a thing that deserves our honor.
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The vast majority of POW's are not taken as individuals, but as part of a larger group that surrenders under terms. Individuals taken prisoner more often than not end up dead in the process. That's a fact. I don't think the fact someone was a POW should be rewarded. Acknowledged, yes. Held against them, no. But you don't reward it. You don't give them a medal for being captured.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
The vast majority of POW's are not taken as individuals, but as part of a larger group that surrenders under terms. Individuals taken prisoner more often than not end up dead in the process. That's a fact. I don't think the fact someone was a POW should be rewarded. Acknowledged, yes. Held against them, no. But you don't reward it. You don't give them a medal for being captured.
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I took care of a P 38 pilot that was shot down in WWII in Italy and was a prisoner and was later shot down as a pilot in Vietnam. I had to start a central line on him. He was tough as nails.
 
ExpressLane said:
I had real respect for him refusing to be released before his men were.
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I agree. Though I believe there is no hard evidence that ANY of the Hanoi POWs collaborated with the enemy. McCain is just the most widely advertised.

The real actual hero of the Hanoi Hilton was James Stockdale, who created the "tap code", used special invisible ink and paper to send messages back home, and bashed his own face in so his image could not be used in an upcoming propaganda film, etc..
 
And if I were one of the less interesting in the republican field I "might" (might, mind you) say something like, "I like candidates who haven't lost elections..."
 
I identify with their positions and success



Other parties have been either evil or massive failures to produce
 
evince said:
They voted for Trump because he TRASHED GOLD STAR FAMILIES
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They voted for trump because trump brought trolling people, no matter how noble into being acceptable. Their only crime - disagreeing with their methods and views.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Yes. Absolutely. It is rare in warfare for individual soldiers to surrender to the other side successfully. They usually end up dead instead. Most POW's are created by a mass surrender of one side to the other. Whether that comes from a failure of leadership, planning, or execution of plans, it happens. One exception to this in modern warfare is found in aerial combat. This often takes place over enemy territory, and when the aircraft being piloted is shot down (eg., fails to complete its mission) the pilot (and crew) often survives and is captured.

In every case, it is failure at the heart of how POW's come to be. You don't become a POW because you won the battle or the war.

If you pin a medal on a POW for becoming one, you are rewarding failure. That doesn't mean you should penalize those that became POW's not through their own volition either. They were just unfortunate enough to end up captured. That happens in war.
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Surviving his plane being shot down is not failure. It's easy for people who have never risked their lives to keep this nation free to sit in judgement - like trump and now you.
 
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