Greed

[Cancel 2016.11]

I had the same thought Darla. Of the handful of people I know who started businesses none of them were wealthy and those that did have money had it all tied up in their business so if it went under they would be left with almost nothing.

You can be ruined. A business does not fail in one day. You can have put every penny you have in it trying to keep it going. I'm 100% pro-union and fully understand the destruction of unions is tied directly to the destruction of the middle class. And yes, very large corporations play the game and always win.

However, I have to laugh when I see some people posting about business owners. Fucking clueless doesn't even begin to cover it. If it's so easy go out and start your own business and stop bitching. The fact is, unless you are over 50 (and we are in our current economy, because it's not always like that), and your company goes under, you are fine. Let's say you are 30, your company goes under. You go on unemployment and you get another job. And I speak as someone who has been there. I got another, in fact, better, job. I didn't even break stride. Some of these posts make me laugh. You can tell the authors have never ever had to meet a payroll. But they never forgot to put their hand out come Friday. And bitch. They are really good at bitching.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

A) Because they assume the risk that their product or service will be priced too high and they will lose money.

B) Who says it's not OK for you to charge what the market will bear? Can you give me more to chew on?

Threedee did. You know....the guy who works for the government.

 

[wanderingbear]

You conservatives will never understand. You greedy selfish stupid pigs.Trying to enplane to you why greed and selfishness is bad to you is a waste of time.Your to stupid to understand. All Ive got to say to you is go fucking die someplace so the rest of the world can live in peace.Death to all conservatives!!!!!

 

[Steelplate]

You can be ruined. A business does not fail in one day. You can have put every penny you have in it trying to keep it going. I'm 100% pro-union and fully understand the destruction of unions is tied directly to the destruction of the middle class. And yes, very large corporations play the game and always win.

However, I have to laugh when I see some people posting about business owners. Fucking clueless doesn't even begin to cover it. If it's so easy go out and start your own business and stop bitching. The fact is, unless you are over 50 (and we are in our current economy, because it's not always like that), and your company goes under, you are fine. Let's say you are 30, your company goes under. You go on unemployment and you get another job. And I speak as someone who has been there. I got another, in fact, better, job. I didn't even break stride. Some of these posts make me laugh. You can tell the authors have never ever had to meet a payroll. But they never forgot to put their hand out come Friday. And bitch. They are really good at bitching.

That's just it Darla. For the most part, when people bitch....they aren't speaking of the salt of the earth small business owners. They are addressing the major corporations that kill real competition ( if someone has the guts to try anymore), subsidize their meager wages and benefits through our tax dollars, and hide all their profits in tax havens....they are vampires sucking the wealth from this country.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

That's their problem. Why should I be limited because of a handful of slackers?

You're not, unless you are part of a SOCIALIST system where everyone gets the same rate of pay. In a free market capitalist system, you are free to go out there and market yourself to other capitalists who are free to realize the value in paying you more based on what you bring to the table. Your freedom to do this in a free market capitalist system, is unlimited.

It is the SOCIALIST system which you and most liberals promote, which will END your ability to compete for a better wage.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

It's astonishing to me how the left has been able to advance a totally European philosophy and ideology (socialism) by establishing points that simply do not apply in a free market, free enterprise, capitalist system, like we have here in America. The continued meme about "greedy capitalists" is part of this. In a free market capitalist system, the consumer is protected from excess greed because of free market competition. If some capitalist is being greedy, making much more profit than they deserve or are entitled to, then another less greedy capitalist comes along, offers the same product or service for less, and puts the greedy capitalist out of business. This can happen because we have a free market system, unlike many European dynasties.

You see, to "sell" socialism, you need rulers and kings, and a system which recognizes class and status. Socialism is preferable over Aristocracy, it's easy to sell to the people, because it promises opportunity, where none exists. But in a Free Market Capitalist system, opportunity is open to all, regardless of class or status. If you believe someone is being "greedy" and "profiteering" on others, you are FREE to go out there and compete for the business of the consumer with less "greed" and better prices. There are countless examples where this very thing happened in our free market system.

 

[Billy the Great Khan]

You conservatives will never understand. You greedy selfish stupid pigs.Trying to enplane to you why greed and selfishness is bad to you is a waste of time.Your to stupid to understand. All Ive got to say to you is go fucking die someplace so the rest of the world can live in peace.Death to all conservatives!!!!!

Man, pot must be a really violent drug.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

You conservatives will never understand. You greedy selfish stupid pigs.Trying to enplane to you why greed and selfishness is bad to you is a waste of time.Your to stupid to understand. All Ive got to say to you is go fucking die someplace so the rest of the world can live in peace.Death to all conservatives!!!!!

How's that basement living?
Are they going to take a vote and let you back into the commune?

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

That's just it Darla. For the most part, when people bitch....they aren't speaking of the salt of the earth small business owners. They are addressing the major corporations that kill real competition ( if someone has the guts to try anymore), subsidize their meager wages and benefits through our tax dollars, and hide all their profits in tax havens....they are vampires sucking the wealth from this country.

Yes, but that's the corporatocracy and consists of a very small number of multi-national corporations. Most business owners are people who own small to medium sized businesses, started from their home in many cases, and these people gave up the security of a paycheck in order to take on enormous risk.

 

[Cancel 2016.11]

It's astonishing to me how the left has been able to advance a totally European philosophy and ideology (socialism) by establishing points that simply do not apply in a free market, free enterprise, capitalist system, like we have here in America. The continued meme about "greedy capitalists" is part of this. In a free market capitalist system, the consumer is protected from excess greed because of free market competition. If some capitalist is being greedy, making much more profit than they deserve or are entitled to, then another less greedy capitalist comes along, offers the same product or service for less, and puts the greedy capitalist out of business. This can happen because we have a free market system, unlike many European dynasties.

You see, to "sell" socialism, you need rulers and kings, and a system which recognizes class and status. Socialism is preferable over Aristocracy, it's easy to sell to the people, because it promises opportunity, where none exists. But in a Free Market Capitalist system, opportunity is open to all, regardless of class or status. If you believe someone is being "greedy" and "profiteering" on others, you are FREE to go out there and compete for the business of the consumer with less "greed" and better prices. There are countless examples where this very thing happened in our free market system.

DIxie this is the biggest bunch of bullshit I ever read.

 

[charver]

DIxie this is the biggest bunch of bullshit I ever read.

Don't be so hasty, Darla.

Just this morning i was making the very same points to the German Kaiser, the Emperor of France and the King of Italy.

 

[Steelplate]

It's astonishing to me how the left has been able to advance a totally European philosophy and ideology (socialism) by establishing points that simply do not apply in a free market, free enterprise, capitalist system, like we have here in America. The continued meme about "greedy capitalists" is part of this. In a free market capitalist system, the consumer is protected from excess greed because of free market competition. If some capitalist is being greedy, making much more profit than they deserve or are entitled to, then another less greedy capitalist comes along, offers the same product or service for less, and puts the greedy capitalist out of business. This can happen because we have a free market system, unlike many European dynasties.

You see, to "sell" socialism, you need rulers and kings, and a system which recognizes class and status. Socialism is preferable over Aristocracy, it's easy to sell to the people, because it promises opportunity, where none exists. But in a Free Market Capitalist system, opportunity is open to all, regardless of class or status. If you believe someone is being "greedy" and "profiteering" on others, you are FREE to go out there and compete for the business of the consumer with less "greed" and better prices. There are countless examples where this very thing happened in our free market system.

You don't know history. John D Rockefeller took control of almost the entire Domestic oil production and refining industry...by what he called "sweating" the competition. In the beginning, he would use corporate espionage to find out which of his competitors were in some financial distress. Then he would offer to buy...if they refused...he would raise production and drop his prices till they couldn't make a go of it...they'd come to him and the second offer would be a shitty deal...a fraction of the first. After he got big enough, he didn't even have to go to such troubles. He'd just drop prices in the area he was targeting and raise them somewhere else to make up the difference. Finally...he worked out a deal with the railroad that made it impossible for any other company than Standard Oil to ship their supply. When it was all said and done? Standard Oil owned more than 90% of the industry.

Of course, Standard oil was broken up.

Interesting to note...in the beginning of the breakup...the names of the subsidiaries were "Standard Oil East" and so on. But publicity got so bad that they changed their names to distance themselves from the Standard Oil brand....they became Esso, Mobil, Exxon, Gulf....12 in all IIRC.

The shitty thing is? While they broke up the company....the shares remained the same....to this day...it really doesn't matter where you go for gas....your money is going to one place....standard oil...and if course, they pay OPEC....who use the same tactics Rockefeller did. We say we gotta bump up domestic production... they raise their production to undercut us and make the competition go away.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

DIxie this is the biggest bunch of bullshit I ever read.

I'm sorry you think it's bullshit, it's certainly not. If there is specific details you would like to discuss or debate, I will be happy to go over them, but it's rather childish and immature to just proclaim it bullshit because you didn't like it.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

You don't know history. John D Rockefeller took control of almost the entire Domestic oil production and refining industry...by what he called "sweating" the competition. In the beginning, he would use corporate espionage to find out which of his competitors were in some financial distress. Then he would offer to buy...if they refused...he would raise production and drop his prices till they couldn't make a go of it...they'd come to him and the second offer would be a shitty deal...a fraction of the first. After he got big enough, he didn't even have to go to such troubles. He'd just drop prices in the area he was targeting and raise them somewhere else to make up the difference. Finally...he worked out a deal with the railroad that made it impossible for any other company than Standard Oil to ship their supply. When it was all said and done? Standard Oil owned more than 90% of the industry.

Of course, Standard oil was broken up.

Interesting to note...in the beginning of the breakup...the names of the subsidiaries were "Standard Oil East" and so on. But publicity got so bad that they changed their names to distance themselves from the Standard Oil brand....they became Esso, Mobil, Exxon, Gulf....12 in all IIRC.

The shitty thing is? While they broke up the company....the shares remained the same....to this day...it really doesn't matter where you go for gas....your money is going to one place....standard oil...and if course, they pay OPEC....who use the same tactics Rockefeller did. We say we gotta bump up domestic production... they raise their production to undercut us and make the competition go away.

So, something in the capitalist free market system was being exploited to form a monopoly, and it was fixed. I've never argued that government can't regulate capitalism, I fully believe there are things the government should do to regulate capitalism, and they have.

 

[Howey]

Don't be so hasty, Darla.

Just this morning i was making the very same points to the German Kaiser, the Emperor of France and the King of Italy.

Dixie has a hot line to the German Kaiser. Just yesterday he loaned him 1m in monopoly money.

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

You don't know history.

I'm not a history scholar, my field was psychology, but I have abundant resources of research, and can find out about whatever I want to. I would venture to say, I am as knowledgeable as the typical poster on history.

John D Rockefeller took control of almost the entire Domestic oil production and refining industry...by what he called "sweating" the competition.

No he didn't, and you're about to explain it. "Sweating" the competition came after he already controlled most of the oil industry, he didn't get there by using this capitalistic tactic.

In the beginning, he would use corporate espionage to find out which of his competitors were in some financial distress.

Corporate espionage is illegal. People do sometimes break the law, even capitalists. This is why it's important to have government regulate capitalism. It's why we formed agencies like the SEC and FTC.

Then he would offer to buy...if they refused...he would raise production and drop his prices till they couldn't make a go of it...they'd come to him and the second offer would be a shitty deal...a fraction of the first. After he got big enough, he didn't even have to go to such troubles. He'd just drop prices in the area he was targeting and raise them somewhere else to make up the difference.

Capitalists do this all the time. I shopped at a certain supermarket this week, because they were selling hot dogs for .99 cents. Now this was cheaper than their competition could even BUY hot dogs for, and they certainly didn't profit from this... it's called a "loss leader" and supermarkets do it everyday. Still.... your complaint is quite interesting.... apparently you think it's a "bad thing" for capitalists to give consumers an outrageous bargain. That's odd.

Finally...he worked out a deal with the railroad that made it impossible for any other company than Standard Oil to ship their supply. When it was all said and done? Standard Oil owned more than 90% of the industry.

Of course, Standard oil was broken up.

What the fuck are you talking about? Standard oil doesn't ship supplies, they produce oil. Capitalists make deals with other capitalists all the time. We've established regulatory laws which prohibit monopolies, again... government regulating capitalism. So you are now complaining about a problem that was addressed and solved. It doesn't happen anymore.

Interesting to note...in the beginning of the breakup...the names of the subsidiaries were "Standard Oil East" and so on. But publicity got so bad that they changed their names to distance themselves from the Standard Oil brand....they became Esso, Mobil, Exxon, Gulf....12 in all IIRC.

The shitty thing is? While they broke up the company....the shares remained the same....to this day...it really doesn't matter where you go for gas....your money is going to one place....standard oil...and if course, they pay OPEC....who use the same tactics Rockefeller did.

So, in spite of the fact that we broke up the monopoly, you want to keep the problem alive by claiming the smaller companies are just really the large company incognito. Well--- there's no way to fix that unless you want government to step in and TAKE the goddamn company from the person who owns it! Can't do that because of the 4th Amendment.

We say we gotta bump up domestic production... they raise their production to undercut us and make the competition go away.

When they raise their production, that means supply is increased. If supply is increased and demand is the same, it means the prices will be lower. Again, you are posing an argument against free market capitalism which produces lower prices for the consumer. Talk about IRONIC!

 

[Steelplate]

So, something in the capitalist free market system was being exploited to form a monopoly, and it was fixed. I've never argued that government can't regulate capitalism, I fully believe there are things the government should do to regulate capitalism, and they have.

Have they?