SmarterthanYou
rebel
here's the fine line. any cop can ask you for ID just by passing you on the street. You do not have to give it to them.
got your papers?
- Thread starter Don Quixote
- Start date
here's the fine line. any cop can ask you for ID just by passing you on the street. You do not have to give it to them.
Mister Wonderful
Banned
This is a bad law IMO and will probably be struck down.
USFREEDOM911
MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN
Why is it a bad law??
TuTu Monroe
A Realist
How do you know? Have your read it?
Socrtease
Verified User
So tell me genius, how can you just look at a person and have a reasonable and articulible suspicion that someone is in the US illegally?
Socrtease
Verified User
And Dixie is wrong, a cop cannot just institute a stop for no reason to ask for ID. See Terry v. Ohio and it's progeny. Road blocks for DUI, license, insurance, registration and for Seat belts are perfectly reasonable so long as they stop EVERYONE. Any roadblock that stops ONLY people of one race are not constitutional so stopping Hispanics to check citizenship is going to be unconstitutional and blanket stops to check for citizenship are also going to be suspect. DUI, license registration etc roadblocks are reasonably related to legitimate state safety issues and do not interfere with liberty in any serious manner, at least that is what the courts have said.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Have you read the new AZ law? Does it specifically authorize law enforcement agents to "profile" individuals? I have read it, and I don't find that provision, so it's a false allegation. I did find this...
This act shall be implemented in a manner consistent with federal
laws regulating immigration, protecting the civil rights of all persons and
respecting the privileges and immunities of United States citizens.
Most of the bill is dealing with procedures to be followed in the event someone is detained for "reasonable suspicion" of a crime, which is well within the rights of law enforcement already. It addresses specific details regarding the hiring of undocumented workers, and other criminal offenses. Nothing I can find in the bill, circumvents the civil liberties under federal law, in fact, it strictly forbids that. So, it doesn't authorize "profiling" or allow law enforcement to detain people without some reasonable suspicion.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
But now.... You pinhead liberals please... do run with this! By all means, make this your November campaign issue! Put it right out there in front of everything else, and appeal to the voters with it! I'm quite sure you are going to get overwhelming support for tying the hands of law enforcement in dealing with the problems of illegal immigration! It's a civil liberties issue and everyone should be lining up to vote for you protecting the Constitutional rights of illegal immigrants in the US! Especially in the border states!
Mister Wonderful
Banned
I am not liberal or Dem, and I have read it.
TuTu Monroe
A Realist
For many, many years, we have had helicopters flying over our home with searchlights turned on. They are looking for illegals. Does that happen in Arizona.
Mister Wonderful
Banned
Note, please that I did not say I want illegals. I said the law is bad IMO and will certainly be challenged.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Why is the law bad? All it does is reinforce the Federal law. Why don't you stop sounding like the perverted teacher on South Park (Drugs are bad, mmk?) and articulate why you think the law is bad and can be challenged?
The only basis for any challenge, would be the definition of "probable cause" and I think that has been challenged before, and it always comes down to whether the officer actually has a valid reason to suspect an illegality has occurred.
If you read the bill, you understand it does not authorize profiling or indiscriminate detention based solely on race or ethnicity. That is what is being claimed, but not what the law actually says, in fact, it specifically states the opposite and prohibits this. But I'll let you explain your complaint.
Minister of Truth
Practically Perfect
Mister Wonderful
Banned
I based my opinion on my reading of the law.
The ACLU and other orgs plan to sue.
The ACLU and other orgs plan to sue.
Dixie - In Memoriam
New member
Wow, what a coincidence, I did too! Except, I actually posted the relevant part of the law which supports my opinion, and you didn't.
No doubt the ACLU plans to sue, they always do! They will lose.
Socrtease
Verified User
There are already some people here in NM planning on buying ad space on AZ TV and in Papers encouraging hispanics to move to NM where our constitution protects people who do not speak english and has since 1917. It actually says that the state cannot discriminate against non-english and non-spanish speakers. We are required to provide interpreters in all our courts regardless of your language. Albuquerque actually had to hire a mandarin speaker for a chinese defendant in a criminal case.
Mister Wonderful
Banned
Taichiliberal
Shaken, not stirred!
Ahhh, but until now in Arizona as in all the other States in the Union, showing your drivers license or non-drivers ID would be sufficient....providing that the officer had PROBABLE CAUSE (loitering, exhibiting public drunkeness, public nusiance, etc.). Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this new stipulation in Arizona give the officer the power to demand seeing a birth certificate?
So since the Arizona governor signed off on this thing, essentially we're seeing their police become a version of the gestapo, or the Stasi or the KGB asking for your papers JUST BECAUSE THEY CAN.....only for now it applies to people who MIGHT BE Mexicans or LOOK like they might be Mexicans. Scary stuff.