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Taft2016 said:
That's true too. And while dad was slaving away in the factory seven days a week, mom and the kids were back in the squalid tenement doing piece work, or taking in laundry.
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In the cotton mills, certainly up to the late 19th century men, women and children all worked in the mill. No, they weren't bonded slaves they were literally wage slaves. They were only a week's wage away from the workhouse where they were slaves in any meaningful sense of the word.
 
I wonder what Patrick Henry would have said when being kicked out of a hospital missing one or two limbs, out the door into a NYC winter.
 
Blazing Saddles, Hell on Wheels, two off the top of my head shows or movies depicting black cowboys.

Those of us you are addressing on this thread are not as ignorant as you believe us to be about our history.

Wrong crowd.
 
Sardonic said:
Blazing Saddles, Hell on Wheels, two off the top of my head shows or movies depicting black cowboys.

Those of us you are addressing on this thread are not as ignorant as you believe us to be about our history.

Wrong crowd.
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Is that how they teach history to kids now? Just show them Blazing Saddles?
 
Taft2016 said:
Here are some historical anecdotes of Robert E. Lee to show the depth of complexity in the issue.

He himself had no slaves, but his wife brought some along with her in their marriage. One slave ran away, who Lee had savagely whipped for the very reason I cited earlier. Such behavior demonstrated that a man could not control his household. Which would be especially damaging for a man whose job was controlling other men as a military officer.

On the other hand, Lee was always looking to free the slaves his wife brought with her. One he apprenticed to blacksmith in Pennsylvania. Before he left, the man asked is he could bring along his simple-minded brother. Lee told the freed slave to establish himself as a blacksmith and then they could talk about his brother.

The blacksmith returned a few years later seeking to buy his brother's freedom. Lee informed him (paraphrased), "I will not sell you your brother. You may take him with you. It was my responsibility to ensure that you would be able to establish yourself and financially take care of your brother. I see now that you can and are free to take him with you."

So like I said earlier, both stories (good and bad) were true in the south. Here, they were both true in a single man.
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Your anecdote only proves the point that the practice of holding slaves was depraved and corrupt. Lee is presented as some sort of enlightened master who never the less had a man beaten savagely.
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
Where did you get that from? Atlas Shrugged.
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From my mind. It's nice to think you believe I sound like a professional writer. The reality was that because they were free men over time they were able to change that reality, a slave could not.

Given the choice between "benevolent" slavery and hardship I'll take hardship every time. And believe me, I know hardship.
 
Taft2016 said:
I don't how to quantify it.

Let me ask you a question in response; if you were an immigrant factory worker who had your arm ripped off in a machinery accident, would you rather return to your master's home and know you'd have a home and will be taken care of for the rest of your life? Or be turned out of the hospital to a life on the streets?

Do you have an easy answer? I sure don't.
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Yes, because disabled slaves were well taken care of just like a lame horse. I bet all your dogs are on a farm upstate too.
 
Taft2016 said:
Or in the American industrial north either.

If a German immigrant father was disfigured or permanently disabled in a factory accident, what happened to him and his family? Who took care of them? The answer was simple; no one did.

Not that slavery was a day at the beach either, but at least they didn't have to worry about starvation or homelessness. A disabled father could generally count on being cared for until he died along with his family.
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Link on the no starvation?

No?

Didn't think so.
 
Damocles said:
From my mind. It's nice to think you believe I sound like a professional writer. The reality was that because they were free men over time they were able to change that reality, a slave could not.

Given the choice between "benevolent" slavery and hardship I'll take hardship every time. And believe me, I know hardship.
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Yes I am sure that your parents sent you up chimneys to clean them when you were a sprog. I don't think our modern society has the slightest clue what it was really like to be in either situation frankly.
 
Hasa Diga Eebowai said:
Your anecdote only proves the point that the practice of holding slaves was depraved and corrupt. Lee is presented as some sort of enlightened master who never the less had a man beaten savagely.
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*THAT'S* what you came away from the stories with?

I'll never unravel liberal logic.
 
Watermark's Ghost said:
lmao it completely blows tom away that people wouldn't want to be slaves.

I would kill myself before being a slave.
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For an intelligent man you do talk some shit at times. There is a word, which I can't remember right now, that describes people trying to interpret historical situations with contemporary morals and mores.
 
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