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The Almighty
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aTVb7FUwSaX4

While there was a decline this month, after factoring in the removal of census workers there was actually an increase in the private sector. That is a positive to take away from this report. The negative is that 83k jobs is no where near the pace we need to see a sustained economic recovery.

That said, to all the 'economists' (the unidentified ones in this article) that think we should only look at the private sector numbers going forward I ask....when the census HIRING was occurring and distorting the jobs numbers... why weren't you suggesting the same thing? I don't care if you want to change it... just be consistent.
 
A pretty gloomy report. There is a cautiousness in hiring right now that seems to feed on itself, and was born during the crisis. It's like people need to be 100% sure we're recovering before they hire at any meaningful level.

Give me some of that good ol' fashioned risk-taking in American business. The stimulus is basically done & I don't see the gov't doing anything meaningful going forward; this thing is in the hands of the private sector now.
 
Superfreak said:
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aTVb7FUwSaX4

While there was a decline this month, after factoring in the removal of census workers there was actually an increase in the private sector. That is a positive to take away from this report. The negative is that 83k jobs is no where near the pace we need to see a sustained economic recovery.

That said, to all the 'economists' (the unidentified ones in this article) that think we should only look at the private sector numbers going forward I ask....when the census HIRING was occurring and distorting the jobs numbers... why weren't you suggesting the same thing? I don't care if you want to change it... just be consistent.
Click to expand...

is the increase greater than the losses
 
Funny how when the numbers were great, the conservatives simply ignored them and focused on the oil spill.
 
Onceler said:
A pretty gloomy report. There is a cautiousness in hiring right now that seems to feed on itself, and was born during the crisis. It's like people need to be 100% sure we're recovering before they hire at any meaningful level.

Give me some of that good ol' fashioned risk-taking in American business. The stimulus is basically done & I don't see the gov't doing anything meaningful going forward; this thing is in the hands of the private sector now.
Click to expand...

That is due to the expense of hiring/firing people. They don't want to go to the trouble to train someone only to have to let them go (and pay unemployment again) six months later. Because odds are, those people they trained are not going to be the ones they bring back 1-2 years down the road.

That is why employment numbers are such a lagging indicator. The market and economy will be rallying for months before employment gets better. We will max out capacity of the existing work force before adding to it.

There will be no good old fashion risk taking (or little of it) with the credit markets the way they are. As we discussed yesterday, the pendulum has swung way to far to the other extreme. Small businesses are hurting and that is where you typically find that risk taking.
 
Jarod said:
Funny how when the numbers were great, the conservatives simply ignored them and focused on the oil spill.
Click to expand...

Funny how your stupidity also carries with it amnesia. We had entire threads discussing the employment numbers. But I would love for you to tell us when the numbers 'looked great'
 
Jarod said:
Funny how when the numbers were great, the conservatives simply ignored them and focused on the oil spill.
Click to expand...

The #'s were never really that great; the census made them look that way. They were, however, more solid overall; things looked better a few months ago.

There is some sort of pause for breath going on; we're right on the fence at the moment. One piece of big news could tip us either way right now....
 
Superfreak said:
That is due to the expense of hiring/firing people. They don't want to go to the trouble to train someone only to have to let them go (and pay unemployment again) six months later. Because odds are, those people they trained are not going to be the ones they bring back 1-2 years down the road.

That is why employment numbers are such a lagging indicator. The market and economy will be rallying for months before employment gets better. We will max out capacity of the existing work force before adding to it.

There will be no good old fashion risk taking (or little of it) with the credit markets the way they are. As we discussed yesterday, the pendulum has swung way to far to the other extreme. Small businesses are hurting and that is where you typically find that risk taking.
Click to expand...

Yeah; it's almost like we're being forced to re-evaluate the way business is done in America. Unfortunately, the "new" model will probably not be as fun; I'm sure we'll have good economic periods in our lifetimes, but I don't think anything like the '90's will be possible again. I hope I'm wrong.

I agree about small businesses; they're really setting the tone right now.
 
Onceler said:
Yeah; it's almost like we're being forced to re-evaluate the way business is done in America. Unfortunately, the "new" model will probably not be as fun; I'm sure we'll have good economic periods in our lifetimes, but I don't think anything like the '90's will be possible again. I hope I'm wrong.

I agree about small businesses; they're really setting the tone right now.
Click to expand...

I am for a new way for business to be done in America, I am for the rise of the small business. This will be very healthy for the average American. I hope we never go back to the 90's. I am for slow sustainable growth and more and stronger small businesses.
 
Superfreak said:
Could you clarify? Are you referring to this month?
Click to expand...

sure

month or overall...you said there was an increase in the private sector, is that increase greater than the losses...iirc....the admin has tried to pass of gains while ignoring the reality the losses are greater than the gains

iow...saying we gained 80,000 new jobs, while 90,000 people lost their jobs, isn't really a net gain
 
Onceler said:
The #'s were never really that great; the census made them look that way. They were, however, more solid overall; things looked better a few months ago.

There is some sort of pause for breath going on; we're right on the fence at the moment. One piece of big news could tip us either way right now....
Click to expand...

Agreed. The problem is the potential big news is lining up for the wrong direction. There are about ten shoes that could drop on the negative and none on the positive that I can see.

Unfortunately the big news on the positive side is going to have to come from DC. The private sector is not going to move on its own in this environment. I do not blame Obama for everything going on, but we do need to see him step up and lead.

Kerry had another piece out discussing alt/clean energy push today. In it he stated we must have a carbon penalty as a part of any plan. That sort of idiocy is why the private sector will not move on its own.

Kerry does bring up some good points on the economic benefits of reducing oil consumption and thus dependency on foreign oil. But as usual, his 'solutions' are more of the same stupid bullshit that won't get us where we need to go.

How hard is it to understand.... TRANSPORTATION consumes about 70% of our daily oil needs. The technology exists TODAY to convert our vehicles (at least those on the road) to Nat Gas. Everyone write to your Senators and Rep and point out this simple little FACT.

You want the big breaker on the positive side... here is my suggestion....

1) Announce plans to build out the Nat Gas infrastructure in the US (creates jobs HERE)

2) Announce plans to drill our nat gas reserves (creates jobs HERE)

3) Announce regulations that require all autos/buses/trucks to switch to Nat Gas within 3 years (for all new cars produced) and 7 years for all used cars. The 3 years for new cars gives the auto makers time to retool as needed and provides time for the gas distributors to get all stations capable of distributing nat gas.

4) Announce regulations that state all gas stations must have nat gas pumps available (not solely) within 3 years.

Not only would this plan create jobs, it would also create a drastic reduction in oil consumption and reduce our dependency on foreign oil.

It would also give CONFIDENCE to the American public that the idiots in DC were finally learning how to effectively help the economy while at the same time help the environment.

Will this solve all pollution concerns... of course not... but it is a great start and provides more time for us to tweak other alt energy sources and get them to economically viable production.
 
Yurt said:
sure

month or overall...you said there was an increase in the private sector, is that increase greater than the losses...iirc....the admin has tried to pass of gains while ignoring the reality the losses are greater than the gains

iow...saying we gained 80,000 new jobs, while 90,000 people lost their jobs, isn't really a net gain
Click to expand...

thanks.... the NET jobs number was a loss for the month of about 125k, which was reported on every site that I have read this morning. I was the one that pulled out the private side (just as I did when all the census hiring was distorting the numbers to the positive a few months ago). The economist quoted in the story are correct to discount the census jobs as we all knew they were temporary going in.
 
Onceler said:
A pretty gloomy report. There is a cautiousness in hiring right now that seems to feed on itself, and was born during the crisis. It's like people need to be 100% sure we're recovering before they hire at any meaningful level.

Give me some of that good ol' fashioned risk-taking in American business. The stimulus is basically done & I don't see the gov't doing anything meaningful going forward; this thing is in the hands of the private sector now.
Click to expand...
I wish they'd do something other than try to pass legislation based on the "Crisis in the Gulf" to restrict the private sector.
 
Onceler said:
Yeah; it's almost like we're being forced to re-evaluate the way business is done in America. Unfortunately, the "new" model will probably not be as fun; I'm sure we'll have good economic periods in our lifetimes, but I don't think anything like the '90's will be possible again. I hope I'm wrong.

I agree about small businesses; they're really setting the tone right now.
Click to expand...

I would imagine that you are wrong... so I hope that provides you with... hope.

Something like the tech revolution (internet, telecom, biotech) don't come around very often. But we have been building toward the next explosion for the last ten years. Depending on leadership, we could be anywhere from 1-10 years off from the next wave.

Alt/clean energy will be the next big boom as we convert over.
 
Damocles said:
I wish they'd do something other than try to pass legislation based on the "Crisis in the Gulf" to restrict the private sector.
Click to expand...

I agree, I wish they would launch a "going to the moon" type innititative aimed at alternative fuel.
 
Superfreak said:
I would imagine that you are wrong... so I hope that provides you with... hope.

Something like the tech revolution (internet, telecom, biotech) don't come around very often. But we have been building toward the next explosion for the last ten years. Depending on leadership, we could be anywhere from 1-10 years off from the next wave.

Alt/clean energy will be the next big boom as we convert over.
Click to expand...

Yes. The fascism buy, markets dictated top down, based on lies to justify the direction. nice.

go business.

Do you still consider this free trade?
 
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