Do soldiers fight for a flag, or what it represents?

[Althea]

I don't see what your post has to do with the subject. But like it or not black people were no less patriotic during WWII than they are now. If you want to talk real injustice during WWII then we should be talking about the thousands of Japanese Americans forced leave their homes to move to internment camps simply because they were of Japanese descent. Yes racism is awful but thankfully we are making progress.

Last I checked, there were no Japanese in internment camps. Sure...we're 'making progress', but we still have unarmed black people being murdered by cops. I believe the OP asks what soldiers fight for. I want to know what black WW2 veterans fought for?

The rights of white Americans to keep them out of 'whites only' restaurants?

 

[Eagle_Eye]

Last I checked, there were no Japanese in internment camps. Sure...we're 'making progress', but we still have unarmed black people being murdered by cops. I believe the OP asks what soldiers fight for. I want to know what black WW2 veterans fought for?

The rights of white Americans to keep them out of 'whites only' restaurants?

And the last time I checked there were no "whites only restaurants, rest rooms, or drinking fountains! In case you missed it this isn't the 40, 50, 60's any longer so quit trying to live in the past! Also please spare me the racist Whitey is out to get us BS! Where are the vast majority of these shootings? If I'm not mistaken in mostly inner city areas that are rife with crime and drugs. Is that any excuse? Not really but it does put the cops on a higher state of alertness for any false moves. If people do exactly what a cop tells them to do they will not get shot.

 

[anatta]

I see. So fighting to protect a country that denies you basic human rights doesn't factor into the equation? Most of WW2 entailed pushing back against Hitler, and the Japanese who were moving to take over that part of the world. What threat was posed to these shores?

Once Europe was conquered, Germany could use the entire continent for it's totalitarianism -and they would have.

Add in the fall of the Soviet Union, and Japanese taking over China and SE asia, and eventually Australia.

That would leave the US against the entire fascist world

 

[evince]

And the last time I checked there were no "whites only restaurants, rest rooms, or drinking fountains! In case you missed it this isn't the 40, 50, 60's any longer so quit trying to live in the past! Also please spare me the racist Whitey is out to get us BS! Where are the vast majority of these shootings? If I'm not mistaken in mostly inner city areas that are rife with crime and drugs. Is that any excuse? Not really but it does put the cops on a higher state of alertness for any false moves. If people do exactly what a cop tells them to do they will not get shot.

I wish you were smart enough to comprehend how racist this shit is.


you are not


You have obviously NOT independently studied these cases.

you take rushalexhannity shots all day long and check out the new babes fixed I mean Fox news has on.

 

[Superfreak]

I wish you were smart enough to comprehend how racist this shit is.


you are not


You have obviously NOT independently studied these cases.

you take rushalexhannity shots all day long and check out the new babes fixed I mean Fox news has on.

You really should never question another person's intelligence. You are the dumbest person on the board. By far.

 

[Русский агент]

You fought for money, which is the main thing your flag stands for.

Your flag (the flag of your masters from Westminster) stands for usurpation, degradation, and exploitation.

Since the Welsh spread their collective legs to the repetitious, rapacious rapine of their English overlords, they even served as vassals in the armed forces of their conquerors, slaughtering and subjugating native peoples across the globe in the name of Perfidious Albion.

Remember Rorke's Drift, little English underling?

 

[Русский агент]

And the last time I checked there were no "whites only restaurants, rest rooms, or drinking fountains! In case you missed it this isn't the 40, 50, 60's any longer so quit trying to live in the past! Also please spare me the racist Whitey is out to get us BS! Where are the vast majority of these shootings? If I'm not mistaken in mostly inner city areas that are rife with crime and drugs. Is that any excuse? Not really but it does put the cops on a higher state of alertness for any false moves. If people do exactly what a cop tells them to do they will not get shot.

When there were whites-only restaurants, rest rooms, and drinking fountains, they were established by DEMOCRATS who couldn't accept the fact that they lost.

Kind of like today, right?

 

[Русский агент]

Odd that many that never bothered to serve are the most patriotic & often warlike..... The dirty bastard dodged the draft 5 times & these fools worship him & his phony pretentious patriotism............ He, or rather it[/B], is simply using patriotism, as have many that have come before it as a means to manipulate fools, tug/fool their emotions etc etc etc........... Sad thing is even after all these years, it still works............

Hilarious, silly Billy.

We've all heard about Rapin' Bill's loathing love for the military, his wife's courage under fire as she landed in Kosovo, and Obama's long and universally admired service in uniform, so DEMOCRATS definitely hold the moral high ground here.

 

[Русский агент]

I always got the impression from my great-Uncle, who was at the Battle of the Bulge, that he was fighting for his friends, his mates who in the foxholes with him. I believe to him, the job was to protect his friends and to defeat Hitler so they could all get back home in one piece. I don't know if they were thinking about flags or constitutions foremost in their minds. I also have a letter from a distant great uncle on my mother's side of the family from the civil war. Written to his wife, circa 1864. He was serving in a Pennsylvania regiment. You would be amazed at how articulate and thoughtful your average Union soldier could be. His writing seems to make it clear he felt their mission was to end slavery in the southern states. Both as a moral, and practical imperative. Gripping stuff, man!

My understanding is that my brother joined the Air Force to earn money for college, earn a second college degree, and further his career options. As a air force desk jockey I think he would laugh at the concept he was a warrior "fighting for our freedoms". I have a cousin who served as a junior officer in the Red Army. I'm pretty sure they had conscription at that time in the Soviet Union, so I got the impression he did it as his legal duty, not for money. My step father was conscripted into world war two, so he obviously had not choice and I don't think fighting the Japanese was high on his list of priorities, so again it was a legal obligation. I know for a fact he would have laughed at the assertion he was "fighting for the flag" or for "our freedoms".

All these alleged convenient "relations" who served. What a seat of Mars your family must occupy, abuser.

It's mighty handy that you just happened to recall them at this particular moment so you could regale the credulous with your titillating tales of martial ardor.

"Why, I remember when my grandfather's cousin's sister's uncle in-law was George Washington's personal valet"...

 

[Sailor]

I see. So fighting to protect a country that denies you basic human rights doesn't factor into the equation? Most of WW2 entailed pushing back against Hitler, and the Japanese who were moving to take over that part of the world. What threat was posed to these shores?

Althea, you might want to research WW2 a little more, specifically the intentions of the Nazi's.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

What is that suppose to mean??

well, the bottom part is soldiers and the top part is a flag.....

 

[blackascoal]

And the last time I checked there were no "whites only restaurants, rest rooms, or drinking fountains! In case you missed it this isn't the 40, 50, 60's any longer so quit trying to live in the past! Also please spare me the racist Whitey is out to get us BS! Where are the vast majority of these shootings? If I'm not mistaken in mostly inner city areas that are rife with crime and drugs. Is that any excuse? Not really but it does put the cops on a higher state of alertness for any false moves. If people do exactly what a cop tells them to do they will not get shot.

A naive perspective that you are most certainly entitled to.

But rather that quibble over which perspective is right or wrong, which leads nowhere, lets discuss which side is going to win the argument.

Will there be more independent oversight of police shootings forthcoming?

Will there be more civilian review boards with increased power to indict forthcoming?

Will there be more criminal prosecutions of rogue officers forthcoming?

Will there be more federal review of local police departments coming?

Are there modifications to police body cams .. to make them more efficient, audible, and telling under way right now? Body cams themselves are a reflection of where this is going.

Will there be legislation enacted that speaks directly to this issue?

None of this is about what you or your side of this thinks.

It's about demand and the power to do it.

 

[blackascoal]

Althea, you might want to research WW2 a little more, specifically the intentions of the Nazi's.

I think most know the intentions of the nazis, but I'm interested in your understanding of it.

 

[Getin the ring]

again, some are hijacking the flag, even in this thread.

What does the flag have to do with addressing social injustice?
It's disrespectful to kneel or sit while the flag is being celebrated, period.

And on the subject of social justice, there are mechanisms in place to address police behavior on an individual basis. That you don't like the outcomes of some of these investigations is telling that you really don't want "justice", you want it to be seen your way, end game.

 

[Sailor]

I think most know the intentions of the nazis, but I'm interested in your understanding of it.

Hitler was quite clear his plans were for German world domination. Throw into that his desire for what he considered a "pure" race among other delusions. He and the Nazi party wanted to be the dominant power in the world.

 

[Русский агент]

Iwo Jima. that memorial was a real photo before a statue

Before it was a statue:

There were two American flags raised on top of Mount Suribachi, on February 23, 1945. The photograph Joe Rosenthal took was actually of the second flag-raising, in which a larger replacement flag was raised by Marines who did not raise the first flag.

THE REAL THING

The photograph taken by Joe Rosenthal was the second flag-raising on top of Mount Suribachi.

Fun fact: the personal greed of a DEMOCRAT led to the second flag-raising.

The Secretary of the Navy, James Forrestal, had decided the previous night that he wanted to go ashore and witness the final stage of the fight for the mountain. Now, under a stern commitment to take orders from Howlin' Mad Smith, the secretary was churning ashore in the company of the blunt, earthy general. Their boat touched the beach just after the flag went up, and the mood among the high command turned jubilant. Gazing upward, at the red, white, and blue speck, Forrestal decided he wanted the Second Battalion's flag flying on Mt. Suribachi as a souvenir. This wish did not sit well with 2nd Battalion Commander Chandler Johnson. "To hell with that!" the colonel spat when the message reached him. The flag belonged to the battalion, as far as Johnson was concerned. He decided to secure it as soon as possible, and dispatched his assistant operations officer, Lieutenant Ted Tuttle, to the beach to obtain a replacement flag. As an afterthought, Johnson called after Tuttle: "And make it a bigger one."

The three surviving second flag-raisers, identified then as Bradley, Gagnon, and Hayes, met President Truman on April 20 at the White House before going on the bond tour which began on May 11 in New York City; Hayes had drinking problems during the tour and was ordered back to his former combat unit in Hawaii on May 24 before the tour ended on July 4 in Washington, D.C. The bond drive was a success, raising $26.3 billion.


So,the DEMOCRATS who ran the government misidentified the men (and covered up their error), shamelessly exploited the survivors who raised the second flag depicted in the iconic photo, and then abandoned them to obscurity, alcoholism, poverty, and death when their usefulness waned.






https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_the_Flag_on_Iwo_Jima

 

[blackascoal]

'Fighting for the flag' is a nonsensical mindfuck for colonized people .. many of whom still flag the flag of traitors on their pickup trucks.

Same set of colonized people who want to fight about knocking down the statues and memorials of traitors who flew a different flag.

Would chewing on a hot dog while talking to someone about the game in the stands be more respectful to the flag then kneeling quietly?

How about framing this for what it is .. and it damn sure it's about a flag.

This is about race and 'overpaid' black men who make up the vast majority of NFL players.

Call it what it is.

 

[blackascoal]

Hitler was quite clear his plans were for German world domination. Throw into that his desire for what he considered a "pure" race among other delusions. He and the Nazi party wanted to be the dominant power in the world.

I agree with you and I think that's the understanding that most have. But I don't see how that conflicts with what Althea said .. with the exception of 'that part of the world' which is also true.

 

[Getin the ring]

'Fighting for the flag' is a nonsensical mindful for colonized people .. many of whom still flag the flag of traitors on their pickup trucks.

Same set of colonized people who want to fight about knocking down the statues and memorials of traitors who flew a different flag.

Would chewing on a hot dog while talking to someone about the game in the stands more disrespectful to the flag then kneeling quietly.

How about framing this for what it is .. and it damn sure it's about a flag.

This is about race and 'overpaid' black men who who make up the vast majority of NFL players.

Call it what it is.

you're an idiot, always about race with you. YOU are the problem.
give it a rest. You think for one minute if it was a bunch of white players disrespecting the flag us who are against the disrespect would suddenly say it's ok they're white?
really?

you're an idiot, with no stance on this subject, so stay out of the thread. Start a thread about how whitey has held you down and talk amongst your racist friends in it.

 

[Sailor]

I agree with you and I think that's the understanding that most have. But I don't see how that conflicts with what Althea said .. with the exception of 'that part of the world' which is also true.

The U.S. was always in danger during WW2. Had Hitlers U-Boat campaign worked we would have had limited defense from an invasion. He did in fact land German spies on U.S. soil via U-Boat. To make the statement that we were never in
danger is a false one. That war could have gone either way quite a few times.