Did Biden really blow up NORDSTREAM? - Russia set to MOTHBALL damaged pipelines

anatta said:
dont bring up the past issues that have nothing to do with today.
( like telling me how Libya would grow out of the Qadaffi area) -not germane
I wont argue the white hats

Besides it's not just the pipes, its the permitting and getting the money together for a new one
The entire energy sector is a mess Russia only selling to non-Euro countries /Ukraine used to bitch over not getting transit fees because of Nordstream
...I guess Ukraine doesnt get any now...not that they need them -the USA is now Ukraine's piggy bank

as usual the morons in charge of the USA disavantaged their own country because of stupid ideas like blowing up the pipeline
Click to expand...

You've decided that the Seymour Hersh narrative is correct but you don't know that for sure. You also wouldn't believe Putin tried to poison people with Novichok, still can't say why you believed that!!
 
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serendipity said:
You've decided that the Seymour Hersh narrative is correct but you don't know that for sure. You also wouldn't believe Putin tried to poison people with Novichok, can't say why you believed that!!
Click to expand...
I admit it's not perfect. BD did a nice job of pointing out the inconsistencies, and I read thru the link you provided... both helpful..But I know Bidens ability to fuck things up is unbounded, and I know our intel agencies give out such crappy advice on a regular basis like "blackmailing Germany" so it cant buy Russian LNG
we will probably never know for sure - but I trust my gut on these things, the alternative scenarios are kinna vague
Bidens statement is typical of him letting the cat out of the bag as well
( the war really is about Putin/ degrading Russia) -then they walk it back
 
anatta said:
I admit it's not perfect. BD did a nice job of pointing out the inconsistencies, and I read thru the link you provided... both helpful..But I know Bidens ability to fuck things up is unbounded, and I know our intel agencies give out such crappy advice on a regular basis like "blackmailing Germany" so it cant buy Russian LNG
we will probably never know for sure - but I trust my gut on these things, the alternative scenarios are kinna vague
Bidens statement is typical of him letting the cat out of the bag as well
( the war really is about Putin/ degrading Russia) -then they walk it back
Click to expand...

I can't believe that Biden and his minions would sanction an act of war like that.
 
serendipity said:
We don't know when those remotely triggered explosives were laid, it's perfectly possible that the Russians did themselves after all they already have have form for these kind of operations.
...
European leaders have already decided this was sabotage. Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki described the presumed attack as the “next step of escalation of the situation in Ukraine” while the Danish Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen called them “deliberate acts.” European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen promised “the strongest possible response to attacks on European energy infrastructure.” Norway responded by deploying its armed forces to guard pipelines from any further “accidents.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/arielc...ne-mark-a-point-of-no-return/?sh=70ff2ee5dba8
Click to expand...

Speaking from a Risk vs. Reward perspective ...

Ukraine and Russian had near zero risk if they were caught. If Europeans were freezing to death, Putin could claim its NOT his fault, ... a PR win.

Any other nation, especially Norway and the U.S., risked Total War for very little reward, ... damaging a closed pipeline.
 
anatta said:
I admit it's not perfect. BD did a nice job of pointing out the inconsistencies, and I read thru the link you provided... both helpful..But I know Bidens ability to fuck things up is unbounded, and I know our intel agencies give out such crappy advice on a regular basis like "blackmailing Germany" so it cant buy Russian LNG
we will probably never know for sure - but I trust my gut on these things, the alternative scenarios are kinna vague
Bidens statement is typical of him letting the cat out of the bag as well
( the war really is about Putin/ degrading Russia) -then they walk it back
Click to expand...

Thank you, my friend.

If I was Norway, Denmark or Sweden ... I would have immediately reneged on any covert ops deal after that public statement.

Biden can not be trusted as military CIC. I think our allies know that.
 
anatta said:
dont bring up the past issues that have nothing to do with today.
( like telling me how Libya would grow out of the Qadaffi area) -not germane
I wont argue the white hats

Besides it's not just the pipes, its the permitting and getting the money together for a new one
The entire energy sector is a mess Russia only selling to non-Euro countries /Ukraine used to bitch over not getting transit fees because of Nordstream
...I guess Ukraine doesnt get any now...not that they need them -the USA is now Ukraine's piggy bank

as usual the morons in charge of the USA disavantaged their own country because of stupid ideas like blowing up the pipeline
Click to expand...

NG is still flowing from Russia thru the Ukraine pipeline. UK does get their transit fees. IIRC, it's over a billion dollars per year. Though I believe there was a payment issue recently.

I have read that Ukraine is still dependent on Russian NG. The reported figures range from 30% up to 80% dependence.
 
Bigdog said:
NG is still flowing from Russia thru the Ukraine pipeline. UK does get their transit fees. IIRC, it's over a billion dollars per year. Though I believe there was a payment issue recently.

I have read that Ukraine is still dependent on Russian NG. The reported figures range from 30% up to 80% dependence.
Click to expand...

It's hilarious Europe is still getting gas thru Ukraine, and paying russia and Ukraine is getting transit fees from Russia
It cant last though- new long term contracts cannot be possibly written
The US must have figured out Nordstream was still a reliable delivery method, and blew it up
so Russian exports to the EU would phase out
 
Bigdog said:
Speaking from a Risk vs. Reward perspective ...

Ukraine and Russian had near zero risk if they were caught. If Europeans were freezing to death, Putin could claim its NOT his fault, ... a PR win.

Any other nation, especially Norway and the U.S., risked Total War for very little reward, ... damaging a closed pipeline.
Click to expand...

was the attack on the Kerch Strait Bridge even more dangerous (total war)
that is critical Russian infrastructure to supply Crimea.
Seem they dont care about risk and reward..it's funny how all these covert ops
are always blamed on some nebulous non-state actor instead
 
anatta said:
was the attack on the Kerch Strait Bridge even more dangerous (total war)
that is critical Russian infrastructure to supply Crimea.
Seem they dont care about risk and reward..it's funny how all these covert ops
are always blamed on some nebulous non-state actor instead
Click to expand...

The attack on the Kerch Bridge was by Ukrainians who were already at war. Not the same as a NATO nation like the US, UK, Poland or Norway.
 
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serendipity said:
The attack in the Kerch Bridge was by Ukrainians who were already at war. Not the same as a NATO nation like the US, UK, Poland or Norway.
Click to expand...

but an attack on "Russia proper" is still capable of causing a nuke response.
On Ukraine, but not NATO,,I wonder who planned it?

FYI just saw this ..Zelensky seems bound and determined to get that tac nuke response
It's all beyond risk and reward,it's playing with nuclear war. Another reason for the US to ge t out of it
Europe can blow itself up if they insist
~~
Ukrainian officials planned 'mass strikes' on Moscow and other cities 'with everything' they had, but they stood down after US intervention: report
https://www.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-officials-planned-mass-strikes-164227358.html


The Washington Post reports Ukrainian officials had plans for "mass strikes" on Russian cities on the first anniversary's of the war.

Ukraine's military intelligence chief directed an officer to hit "with everything" available, but the plan wasn't carried out.

Officials in Kyiv have disputed the Post report based on leaked documents, calling it "strange media" and "sensation."

Officials in Kyiv were planning strikes on Moscow, among other targets, on the first anniversary of Russian President Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine, but US intervention led them to stand down, The Washington Post reported Monday, citing classified documents.

The Post reported that Maj. Gen. Kyrylo Budanov, who leads Ukraine's military intelligence operations, known as the HUR, instructed an officer to "get ready for mass strikes on 24 February,"
https://www.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-officials-planned-mass-strikes-164227358.html
 
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