Crazy car nutter kills again...

[Mott the Hoople]

I was correcting a misstatement of fact. And, yes, I do think that more gun laws would mean fewer suicides. If you have otherwise fleeting suicidal thoughts and access to a gun, the odds that you will successfully kill yourself are pertty high.

....and what if SF is one of those gun owners who is fleetingly suicidal?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

The majority of gun deaths are suicides.

Sorry I wasn't clear for you... I was referring to homicides. If someone is intent upon taking their own life, they are going to find a way. Gun or no gun.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

If that's an attempt at humor, I don't find it funny. But no sweat, not all jokes are good ones.

I'll spare you my retroactive abortion joke then.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Hmmm let me ask you a question mister wise ass. If you were walking on the sidewalk which would you rather see coming down the street, Adam Lanza with an assult rifle or Adam Lanza in a Pontiac GTO?

A lunatic is a lunatic. Had Adam Lanza been in that car and deliberately trying to take out people... what would have happened?

If I am on the sidewalk and the lunatic had either with an intent to kill me, I would likely be just as dead either way.

So tell me... why do you not advocate banning alcohol? or Cars?

 

[SmarterthanYou]

I was correcting a misstatement of fact. And, yes, I do think that more gun laws would mean fewer suicides. If you have otherwise fleeting suicidal thoughts and access to a gun, the odds that you will successfully kill yourself are pertty high.

this is why we laugh at you concerning gun laws and their so called ability to prevent bad things from happening.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

A lunatic is a lunatic. Had Adam Lanza been in that car and deliberately trying to take out people... what would have happened?

If I am on the sidewalk and the lunatic had either with an intent to kill me, I would likely be just as dead either way.

So tell me... why do you not advocate banning alcohol? or Cars?

That's a strawman argument. I don't advocate baning guns. I do support 2nd ammendment rights.

I also advocate preventing nut jobs like Adam Lanza from either getting a drivers license or being permitted to own an assault rifle. I also advocate having adult discussions on how to prevent tragedies like Sunny Hook and not knee jerk responses opposing any such dialogue.

 

[Bonestorm]

Sorry I wasn't clear for you... I was referring to homicides. If someone is intent upon taking their own life, they are going to find a way. Gun or no gun.

The bold is true and I don't think retricting gun ownership will stop someone who has fully thought through their decision to commit suicide, but I don't think most people who commit suicide fall into that category. The vast majority of people who try to commit suicide and fail do not succeed later.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Hmmm let me ask you a question mister wise ass. If you were walking on the sidewalk which would you rather see coming down the street, Adam Lanza with an assult rifle or Adam Lanza in a Pontiac GTO?

the rifle any day of the week, and twice on sunday. that car can do a whole lot more damage than the rifle because he can still be shot at clearly.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

The bold is true and I don't think retricting gun ownership will stop someone who has fully thought through their decision to commit suicide, but I don't think most people who commit suicide fall into that category. The vast majority of people who try to commit suicide and fail do not succeed later.

My experience is that those who are determined to commit suicide and have thought out a plan on how to do so unfortunately succeed.

 

[Bonestorm]

this is why we laugh at you concerning gun laws and their so called ability to prevent bad things from happening.

Well, the literature on suicides is quite consistent on the idea that most suicide attempts are the product of short-lived crises and people who attempt but fail rarely go on to successfully kill themselves. Meanwhile, firearm suicide attempts are 85% successful. Now I'm not all that smart, but it seems to me that if you limit access to a highly successful method to people with fleeting suicidal thoughs, you will reduce suicide rates.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

the rifle any day of the week, and twice on sunday. that car can do a whole lot more damage than the rifle because he can still be shot at clearly.

That was a rhetorical question STY. The obvious answer is neither.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Well, the literature on suicides is quite consistent on the idea that most suicide attempts are the product of short-lived crises and people who attempt but fail rarely go on to successfully kill themselves. Meanwhile, firearm suicide attempts are 85% successful. Now I'm not all that smart, but it seems to me that if you limit access to a highly successful method to people with fleeting suicidal thoughs, you will reduce suicide rates.

How do you determine when and who those people are?

 

[SmarterthanYou]

That was a rhetorical question STY. The obvious answer is neither.

that's good, because I was really wanting to say i'd stay home

 

[Mott the Hoople]

that's good, because I was really wanting to say i'd stay home

LOL

Look I dont' want any more restrictions on my ability to drive or own a gun than necessary but this is a problem that "gun grabber" rhetoric is counterproductive towards finding a solution. What can we do to identify and protect the public from the violently insane? That's the real issue here.

 

[Bonestorm]

LOL

Look I dont' want any more restrictions on my ability to drive or own a gun than necessary but this is a problem that "gun grabber" rhetoric is counterproductive towards finding a solution. What do we do to identify and protect the public from the violently insane? That's the real issue here.

I'm much more concerned with daily gun violence and accidents than I am with mass murder situations.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

LOL

Look I dont' want any more restrictions on my ability to drive or own a gun than necessary but this is a problem that "gun grabber" rhetoric is counterproductive towards finding a solution. What can we do to identify and protect the public from the violently insane? That's the real issue here.

there's no simple and easy answer, in my opinion. i'm reasonably sure that when the framers wrote the constitution, they weren't allowing the government to restrict the rights of the peaceable citizens in the hopes that it would prevent the nutjobs from committing criminal acts.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

I'm much more concerned with daily gun violence and accidents than I am with mass murder situations.

and you don't prevent or limit either by infringing on the rights of those who have done nothing.

 

[Bonestorm]

and you don't prevent or limit either by infringing on the rights of those who have done nothing.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

The bold is true and I don't think retricting gun ownership will stop someone who has fully thought through their decision to commit suicide, but I don't think most people who commit suicide fall into that category. The vast majority of people who try to commit suicide and fail do not succeed later.

I would be curious to hear what you base that on... or did you mean to say that most people who think about committing suicide don't fall into that category? Many who 'attempt' suicide are not serious and thus they make attempts that are likely to be unsuccessful. These are obviously a cry for help, rather than an attempt of a determined person to kill themselves.

A knife slitting the wrist vertically along the vein while in a tub is just as effective (not to mention it has a lower probability of failure) as a gun. Obviously it is tough with regards to suicide. Which is why we attempt to keep guns out of the hands of those with mental issues. I think we can agree that more needs to be done on the front of mental help for people.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

That's a strawman argument. I don't advocate baning guns. I do support 2nd ammendment rights.

I also advocate preventing nut jobs like Adam Lanza from either getting a drivers license or being permitted to own an assault rifle. I also advocate having adult discussions on how to prevent tragedies like Sunny Hook and not knee jerk responses opposing any such dialogue.

Fair enough... why do you not advocate more restrictions on alcohol purchases? Why no background checks?