Climate rage

Ignorance vs. rationality.


http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/08/climate-rage/

Climate rage
Digby asks why the anti-climate-change types are so angry, then approvingly links to Amanda Marcotte, who says that it’s all about annoying liberals.
I don’t agree, although that’s clearly part of it.
.......


It’s because Cons can’t admit they’re wrong. Period. I’ve never understood that. It’s like some kind of threat to their tenuous and fleeting hold on masculinity to admit they were wrong. They can’t ever admit they were wrong about Iraq; they can’t ever admit they were wrong to worship at the alter of corporate deregulation; and they can’t admit they were wrong about climate change.

Hell, some of them can’t admit they’re gay .

So just like the fairy tale about how the WMDs got moved to Syria, they’ll concoct a contrived and fantastical worldwide conspiracy of scientists. When you think about it, that kind of conspiracy theory is on a par with the 9/11 truthers, or the Obama birthers. A worldwide conspiracy of scientists? HaHaha. It’s crazy, irrational shit. Somebody could win a freaking Nobel Prize in psychology, or whatever, if they ever figure this Con denial shit out.
 
It’s because Cons can’t admit they’re wrong. Period. I’ve never understood that. It’s like some kind of threat to their tenuous and fleeting hold on masculinity to admit they were wrong. They can’t ever admit they were wrong about Iraq; they can’t ever admit they were wrong to worship at the alter of corporate deregulation; and they can’t admit they were wrong about climate change.

Hell, some of them can’t admit they’re gay .

So just like the fairy tale about how the WMDs got moved to Syria, they’ll concoct a contrived and fantastical worldwide conspiracy of scientists. When you think about it, that kind of conspiracy theory is on a par with the 9/11 truthers, or the Obama birthers. A worldwide conspiracy of scientists? HaHaha. It’s crazy, irrational shit. Somebody could win a freaking Nobel Prize in psychology, or whatever, if they ever figure this Con denial shit out.

Strawman says what?
 
You are too incompetent to understand the truth.

Oh, I think I understand the truth better than you. The globe has been warming (and cooling) since the beginning of time. Currently, it is about 1 degree warmer than it was 100 years ago. Carbon dioxide accounts for about 4% of the greenhouse gases, the other 95% is mostly water vapor. Greenhouse gases are essential for the Earth to be able to inhabit life. There has been about a 30% increase in CO2 levels in the past century, and the result has been an increase in plant growth, because plants use CO2. The 30% increase in CO2 has not caused a measurable increase in temperatures, as was erroneously reported by fraudulent 'scientists' with a political agenda. In fact, most of the 1 degree increase over the past century, came prior to 1940, before man contributed much to CO2 emissions. And while we are on the subject of CO2 emissions, it is important to note, the amount of CO2 generated by the cumulative actions of man, are virtually nil compared to nature.


That is the truth, and YOU are the one who doesn't want to accept the truth.
 
Oh, I think I understand the truth better than you. The globe has been warming (and cooling) since the beginning of time. Currently, it is about 1 degree warmer than it was 100 years ago. Carbon dioxide accounts for about 4% of the greenhouse gases, the other 95% is mostly water vapor. Greenhouse gases are essential for the Earth to be able to inhabit life. There has been about a 30% increase in CO2 levels in the past century, and the result has been an increase in plant growth, because plants use CO2. The 30% increase in CO2 has not caused a measurable increase in temperatures, as was erroneously reported by fraudulent 'scientists' with a political agenda. In fact, most of the 1 degree increase over the past century, came prior to 1940, before man contributed much to CO2 emissions. And while we are on the subject of CO2 emissions, it is important to note, the amount of CO2 generated by the cumulative actions of man, are virtually nil compared to nature.


That is the truth, and YOU are the one who doesn't want to accept the truth.

None of what you said actually has anything to do with the fact that the CO2 we are emitting will heat the Earth by over 5 C in a rapid period of time, a period of time that is unprecedented in nature. We have already made CO2 levels go up be about 100CC, and by the end of 2100 CO2 levels are going to be more than double what they were. Natural sources overwhelm EACH YEARS contribution to overall CO2, but the thing is that natural sources are IN EQUILIBRIUM. Man made sources THROW OFF this equilibrium, and BUILD UP over time. All of these figures are just meaningless obfuscations, reinvintions of old errors thrown about all over again.

All of this has already been debunked before, I feel no reason to repeat what has already been said.
 
Last edited:
None of what you said actually has anything to do with the fact that the CO2 we are emitting will heat the Earth by over 5 C in a rapid period of time, a period of time that is unprecedented in nature. We have already made CO2 levels go up be about 100CC, and by the end of 2100 CO2 levels are going to be more than double what they were. Natural sources overwhelm EACH YEARS contribution to overall CO2, but the thing is that natural sources are IN EQUILIBRIUM. Man made sources THROW OFF this equilibrium, and BUILD UP over time. All of these figures are just meaningless obfuscations, reinvintions of old errors thrown about all over again.

All of this has already been debunked before, I feel no reason to repeat what has already been said.

Over the past 150 years, CO2 levels have increased from 280 to 360 ppm... (that's PARTS per MILLION.) A 30% increase. The temperature is only 1 degree warmer, so at best, a 30% increase caused a 1% rise in temps... but that is not conclusive. We don't know how much of that rise was from other causes, such as sun spot activity. We also don't know how much man's industrialization has contributed to the rise in CO2, mankind is only responsible for 5% of the CO2 found in our atmosphere, the rest comes from nature. We also don't know how much the CO2 levels change the greenhouse effect that naturally occurs. These are all speculative at best.

What we now know for certain, and what was being suppressed in the emails, is that the Earth has not gotten measurably warmer over the last decade or so, there has been very little change. I know you liberals have bleeding hearts for the poor polar bears floating around on the tiny piece of ice in the arctic, but maybe you guys can take up a collection to move them down south, to Antarctica, where the ice shelves are growing? It would be a better use of your time than making a fool out of yourselves over this Global Warming crap!
 
Over the past 150 years, CO2 levels have increased from 280 to 360 ppm... (that's PARTS per MILLION.) A 30% increase. The temperature is only 1 degree warmer, so at best, a 30% increase caused a 1% rise in temps... but that is not conclusive. We don't know how much of that rise was from other causes, such as sun spot activity. We also don't know how much man's industrialization has contributed to the rise in CO2, mankind is only responsible for 5% of the CO2 found in our atmosphere, the rest comes from nature. We also don't know how much the CO2 levels change the greenhouse effect that naturally occurs.

Yes we do.

A 1 C increase in background temperature in less than 50 years is unprecedented in natural history.
 
Yes we do.

A 1 C increase in background temperature in less than 50 years is unprecedented in natural history.

No, it's not. The Earth has been much warmer and much colder, and it got there much faster, on several ocassions. There hasn't been a 1C increase in 50 years, it's 150 years, and we don't know how much of that is because of sun spot activity, and how much would have naturally occurred if man weren't even on the planet.
 
This is a lie.

No, it's not. That was what the climatologists who suppressed the data were trying to claim, and the data contradicted this, which is why they suppressed it. Have you read up on any of this scandal? It's pretty fucking significant, and there are several countries now launching investigations into this whole affair, no telling what kind of corruption will be uncovered. Suffice it to say, your days of alarmist paranoia about AGW are over, and we can move on to more important topics.
 
No, it's not. That was what the climatologists who suppressed the data were trying to claim, and the data contradicted this, which is why they suppressed it. Have you read up on any of this scandal? It's pretty fucking significant, and there are several countries now launching investigations into this whole affair, no telling what kind of corruption will be uncovered. Suffice it to say, your days of alarmist paranoia about AGW are over, and we can move on to more important topics.

The content of the E-Mails were banal and did not suggest anything approaching fraud fraud. Now we should move onto finding the subhuman who did this and executing him. The days of AGW denying are over; after this despicable act turned up nothing, there's no rock to hide behind.

AGW is truth. Trying to deny AGW is like denying evolution, or gravity. It is backed up by overwhelming evidence.
 
No, it's not. The Earth has been much warmer and much colder, and it got there much faster, on several ocassions. There hasn't been a 1C increase in 50 years, it's 150 years, and we don't know how much of that is because of sun spot activity, and how much would have naturally occurred if man weren't even on the planet.

Yes. We. Do.

:facepalm:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_variation#Solar_variation_theory

Stott's 2003 work mentioned in the model section above largely revised his assessment, and found a significant solar contribution to recent warming, although still smaller (between 16 and 36%) than that of the greenhouse gases.[66]
 
If AGW conspiracy theorists would do even the most basic research on the topic they would make having these convos a lot easier; I guess they just can't be bothered.
 
Excerpt from your link...

The relative significance of solar variability and other forcings of climate change during the industrial era is an area of ongoing research.

This means, as I stated, "we don't know!"
 
If AGW conspiracy theorists would do even the most basic research on the topic they would make having these convos a lot easier; I guess they just can't be bothered.

Let's get something straight, the conspiracy has not come from those who refuse to accept AGW theory, it has come from the so-called "scientists" who were supposed to be compiling the data on AGW. You have that part backwards.
 
Excerpt from your link...

The relative significance of solar variability and other forcings of climate change during the industrial era is an area of ongoing research.

This means, as I stated, "we don't know!"

All we know is that the warming isn't due to Solar variation, and that it's due to human activity. Anyway who denies this in the presence of clear and obvious evidence needs to be shot.
 
Let's get something straight, the conspiracy has not come from those who refuse to accept AGW theory, it has come from the so-called "scientists" who were supposed to be compiling the data on AGW. You have that part backwards.

Yes, you are inventing conspiracy theories. It's pathetic. You're side is like the Holocaust deniers. There was no scientific fraud in any of the data that has ever been published on the truth of AGW.
 
All we know is that the warming isn't due to Solar variation, and that it's due to human activity. Anyway who denies this in the presence of clear and obvious evidence needs to be shot.

Quite the contrary, we don't know this at all. Solar variation does contribute and is a factor, it just can't explain the unexpected rise in temp... but wait, there wasn't really an unexpected rise... that data was suppressed. There was a modest rise, consistent with normal climatic changes for the past 400,000 years or so.

We don't know that anything is due to human activity, that is what is so controversial about this. Humans do produce CO2, every time we exhale! Every mammal on the planet produces it. It's a natural element in our atmosphere, and without it, we couldn't survive on this planet. As a matter of fact, most of the plant life here, evolved in a higher concentration of CO2, and many scientists would argue that until recently, plants were starving for it.

Yes, you are inventing conspiracy theories. It's pathetic. You're side is like the Holocaust deniers. There was no scientific fraud in any of the data that has ever been published on the truth of AGW.

I've not developed any conspiracy theory, what the fuck are you talking about? I haven't denied the holocaust, but yes, there was a fraud committed by people claiming to be scientists. There was data ignored! Not included in the published data! And when someone else tried to publish it, the publication was threatened! This was a the biggest scientific fraud of the past 500 years! And Waterhead... it hasn't even STARTED to be dealt with yet! The credibility of your side on this issue is DONE... stick a fork in it!
 
Waterstain can't afford anything but a 1991 dodge, let him get a real job and see how fast he drops the false outrage climate alarmism. After all everyone of his false outrage hero's has a carbon footprint the size of Godzilla compared to us normal folk.
If they pass this turd we deserve it more than the gov controlled wealth transfer ahh I mean Healthcare bill.
 
Back
Top