CA Prop. 8 shot down

  • Thread starter Thread starter WinterBorn
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WinterBorn said:
Those opposing gay marriage, please take note. These could have just as easily been written by Rana, Darla or Oncelor. If you look thru the thread you see both liberals and conservatives arguing FOR gay marriage.

Well said, USF.
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Thank you.

Men and women should be judged on who they are, not what they are.
I thought that was the underlying message that Dr. King was promoting.
 
dixon76710 said:
Interracial couples procreate, just like same race couples. Children of interracial couples benefit, just as much from the advantage of having both their mother and father together in the home to provide and care for them. Government has, or should have just as much interest in the wellbeing of interracial children as they do single race children.

Purifying the white race isnt a legitimate governmental interest. Improving the well being of children is such an interest.
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And gay couples raise children just as well as straight couples do.

Unless you are willing to ban couples from getting married on the basis of their fertility, this "children" argument has no merit.
 
Alias said:
Because we want to preserve our heritage and our culture. That's why.
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Your heritage is the constitution which allows others to live up to their own beliefs, our culture is based on that. There is no "Protect the Traditions" clause in the Constitution. Not even one.

Protect your heritage through how you act, marry a woman, stay with her without divorcing, don't cheat, show you have the ability to respect your own beliefs rather than try to force others to respect your heritage and beliefs without an iota of respect for theirs.

There is nothing, not even one thing, that a gay person can do to devalue your marriage, only you and your wife can do that.
 
Alias said:
That's okay. They don't have to believe it. I'm just giving you where the definition of marriage comes from in our Christian culture.

Is Jesus a "HATER" because he stated marriage is between a man and a woman?
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I doubt Jesus would have opposed gay marriage. He might have opposed the religious aspects of it, but a civil marriage is not based on religion.
 
Damocles said:
Your heritage is the constitution which allows others to live up to their own beliefs, our culture is based on that. There is no "Protect the Traditions" clause in the Constitution. Not even one.

Protect your heritage through how you act, marry a woman, stay with her without divorcing, don't cheat, show you have the ability to respect your own beliefs rather than try to force others to respect your heritage and beliefs without an iota of respect for theirs.

There is nothing, not even one thing, that a gay person can do to devalue your marriage, only you and your wife can do that.
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I disagree. No respect for queers. No one should be mistreated, but no respect for sexual deviants. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Show respect for Christians. Call it whatever you want to call it, but don't call it marriage.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
That's because you don't know shit about biology. Heterosexual and Homosexualality are socioligical designations and are not biological ones. All humans are born as sexual beings and from a biological perspective all sexual behavior is inborn and inate. Sexual preference might be learned behavior but sexuality, of any stripe, is something we are all born with. To even argue that people aren't born homosexual is the height of ignorance!
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Soooooo people are born wth a "socioligical designation"?????? Doesnt make sense.
 
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Alias said:
When you have some evidence that people are born homosexual then be sure to present it. So, yes I don't believe people are born queer. Looks like your surprise at that is limited to only your opinion and not based on scientific fact. Thanks, I already knew that.
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I have been told by numerous gays that they were born that way. My sister swears she has never been attracted to men, and even thought women were what she wanted to "marry" before she knew what sex was.

I never made a choice to be straight. I am attracted to women, and I always have been. So why is it straights never choose to be straight, but gays always choose to be gay?
 
Alias said:
I love personal stories on the internet. They're all factual and really happened.
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I have posted numerous links to studies that found no difference between children raised by gay couples and those raised by straight couples. Those studies are factual and really happened.
 
Alias said:
Nope. Companionship AND children....."God said to Adam and Eve, Be fruitful and multiply". God didn't say to Adam and Steve..."Be Fruity and a gadfly".
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That wasn't the original plan. If it was God would have created Adam and Eve at the same time. The Bible says God created Eve when He saw Adam was lonely.

Maybe if Adam was into bestiality there would never have been an Eve. Who knows?
 
Alias said:
Not for Christians.
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And that is fine. I have no problem with a religion refusing to recognize gay marriage. But that is not what we are discussing here. All the straight couples that were married by a Justice of the Peace still get the gov't benefits.

The government cannot deny gays the right to marry based solely on your faith or mine.
 
Alias said:
I disagree. No respect for queers. No one should be mistreated, but no respect for sexual deviants. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Show respect for Christians. Call it whatever you want to call it, but don't call it marriage.
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"No respect for"...

The Constitution, your Heritage as it were, doesn't give you the power to put your disrespect into law based on your beliefs. It isn't up to you. Either believe in and fight for what we were given, personal freedoms (including a right to be "deviant" in the mind of Alias), personal rights...

You simply want to be given respect you didn't earn, you devalue yourself and your religion when you demand respect rather than earn respect through right action. You take away from all Christians when you throw childish tantrums disrespecting others and demanding that they be forced to follow your specific version of religion through legislation to protect your "Traditions".

Your traditions have only the value you give them.

You can "disagree" all you want, and be vocal about it, but it only makes you smaller, your "traditions" less valuable, and your action less impressive each time you demand others who have different beliefs and traditions to follow yours while you refuse to let them live by their own.
 
dixon76710 said:
??? Witholding the benefits of marriage from gay couples, or any couple made up of two people of the same sex doesnt improve the well being of children. It is in extending them to heterosexual couples, the only couples who procreate.



Any two people could do that. Sticking their dicks in each others butts doesnt endow them with superior child raising skills. Biological parents arent prefered because they are sexual, they are preferred because they are the biological parents. A male lion will fight to the death to protect his offspring. He will likely kill the offspring of another male lion.

Anyway, more single mothers and grandmothers raising children together right now, than have ever been raised by gay couples. No justification for such discriminatory treatment, favoring gay couples, over ANY TWO PEOPLE who find themselve raising a child together.
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And I am raising a stepdaughter. I would kill to protect her. This is not about biological parents. Gays can raise children just as well as straights.
 
WinterBorn said:
I have been told by numerous gays that they were born that way. My sister swears she has never been attracted to men, and even thought women were what she wanted to "marry" before she knew what sex was.

I never made a choice to be straight. I am attracted to women, and I always have been. So why is it straights never choose to be straight, but gays always choose to be gay?
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I am not rigid on the term "Choose". It can be developed through environmental or upbringing or any number of factors. Sometimes people get confused. The reason people are more accepting of queers today is through societal pressure. We have been bombarded with pressure to accept homosexuality as normal, rather than being persuaded through intelligent research and science. It's basically been a media brainwashing in the last 40 years. Nothing more.
 
Damocles said:
"No respect for"...

The Constitution, you Heritage as it were, doesn't give you the power to put your disrespect into law based on your beliefs. It isn't up to you. Either believe in and fight for what we were given, personal freedoms (including a right to be "deviant" in the mind of Alias), personal rights...

You simply want to be given respect you didn't earn, you devalue yourself and your religion when you demand respect rather than earn respect through right action. You take away from all Christians when you throw childish tantrums disrespecting others and demanding that they be forced to follow your specific version of religion through legislation to protect your "Traditions".

Your traditions have only the value you give them.

You can "disagree" all you want, and be vocal about it, but it only makes you smaller, your "traditions" less valuable, and your action less impressive each time you demand others who have different beliefs and traditions to follow yours while you refuse to let them live by their own.
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I'm not the weirdo. Millions of Americans do not accept homosexuality as normal behavior. We also do not want them teaching our children. Didn't you know that?
 
Alias said:
Yes.
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So Christian women are not allowed to divorce.
1 Corinthians, Chapter 7:10
But unto the married I give charge, [yea] not I, but the Lord, That the wife depart not from her husband

And Christian men are not allowed to divorce.
Mark, Chapter 10:11
And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her:

Is the following adhered to, by Christians:
The New Testament associates remarriage after divorce and adultery. Marriage is a lifelong covenant between a man and a woman. Divorce does not break the bond, so remarriage is viewed as adultery except in cases where unfaithfulness was the reason for the divorce (Matt. 5:32; Mark 10:11-12). The marriage bond is broken by death (Rom. 7:3; 1 Cor. 7:39).


The Old Testament support pologamy; because the New Testament upheld it also.
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished. (Matthew 5:17-18)"


Now unless if you've got something to show that Christians still follow all the teachings of the New Testament, regarding marriage, then your presentation is false.
 
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Alias said:
I'm not the weirdo. Millions of Americans do not accept homosexuality as normal behavior. We also do not want them teaching our children. Didn't you know that?
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Again, the right to be weird is pretty much guaranteed. Your right to be unoffended does not exist, however. If you don't "want them to teach" your children then send your kid to a parochial school where the Priests will teach them instead.
 
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