Business and Jobs Flee Democrats New High-tax, High-Regulation America

[KingCondanomation]

Hilarious. Of course, you could just admit that you were wrong. Again.

HAHAHA, no answer again so resorting to the old hilarious dismissal.
Pathetic.

 

[Bonestorm]

HAHAHA, no answer again so resorting to the old hilarious dismissal.
Pathetic.

Pathetic? Really? I thought it pathetic when you resorted to the tired old "college lawyer kid" schtick, particularly when you don't know me from Adam.

By the way, let me know when you hear about an actual US corporation domesticating in Switzerland as opposed to corporations moving from one tax haven to another. Maybe then we could discuss the impact on US jobs.

 

[uscitizen]

not sure if this comment is just partisan stuff or you really don't see anything wrong with this 'tiny' move, but like rats fleeing the ship, once one starts, they all head out.

And since consumer spending is 2/3 of our economy why would the corps that make stuff to sell want to be sure the consumers can't afford to buy their product?


Of course if the corpies want to keep shooting themselves in the feet due to their myopic planning.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Pathetic? Really? I thought it pathetic when you resorted to the tired old "college lawyer kid" schtick, particularly when you don't know me from Adam.

By the way, let me know when you hear about an actual US corporation domesticating in Switzerland as opposed to corporations moving from one tax haven to another. Maybe then we could discuss the impact on US jobs.

Why did those US companies move to ANY tax haven? It's interesting you found that but it doesn't take away from the argument that corporations move to where tax conditions are more favorable.

As for the rest, you just use your dismissal or faked sensitivity to avoid responding to any of the points, that's why it's pathetic.

 

[KingCondanomation]

And since consumer spending is 2/3 of our economy why would the corps that make stuff to sell want to be sure the consumers can't afford to buy their product?


Of course if the corpies want to keep shooting themselves in the feet due to their myopic planning.

One interest doesn't come close to outweighing the other. We heard this same argument in the 80's when US clothing manfacturing companies were leaving and thus the theory was that people would have to take jobs that paid less and would be able to buy less clothing.
Of course neither ended up happening.

 

[Bonestorm]

Why did those US companies move to ANY tax haven? It's interesting you found that but it doesn't take away from the argument that corporations move to where tax conditions are more favorable.

As for the rest, you just use your dismissal or faked sensitivity to avoid responding to any of the points, that's why it's pathetic.

The corporations moved in an attempt to pay less in corporate taxes, but what the fuck does that have to do with jobs? Nothing.

The jobs aren't going anywhere regardless of where the corporations file their articles of organization. If they move to the Caymans, Bermuda or Switzerland, the jobs don't follow.

That is all.

 

[uscitizen]

One interest doesn't come close to outweighing the other. We heard this same argument in the 80's when US clothing manfacturing companies were leaving and thus the theory was that people would have to take jobs that paid less and would be able to buy less clothing.
Of course neither ended up happening.

Ummm how about this crash? You call that nothhing?

 

[KingCondanomation]

The corporations moved in an attempt to pay less in corporate taxes, but what the fuck does that have to do with jobs? Nothing.

The jobs aren't going anywhere regardless of where the corporations file their articles of organization. If they move to the Caymans, Bermuda or Switzerland, the jobs don't follow.

That is all.

No that is not all. Fucking close to half the Cayman Islands work force is expatriate workers, mostly professionals, who went there for job opportunities and less taxes.

Read up:

"The total labour force in the Cayman Islands is approximately 38,000, of whom about 18,000 are expatriate workers on work permits.
There is still a significant demand in Cayman for Executive PA's, Legal Secretaries, Part Qualified Accountants, and Financial Services staff."
http://www.baraud.com/about-caymanW.php

And Switzerland which is much larger and hence more affordable for housing is even more attractive to the middle class. Hell now that I think on it I know someone personally (son's friends parents) who moved to Switzerland, where they are now working.

THAT is all.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Ummm how about this crash? You call that nothhing?

Not at all, but that is not because of less purchasing power but because of overease of getting a mortgage.

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Dano, what you are praising is a race to the bottom. If every nation drug themselves to the level of the regulation or tax havens, as you'd like, none of the nation would see any of the benefit that the Caymans and the Swiss are currently seeing, and in fact we'd all just be much, much worse off. That's why it's called the race to the bottom; when countries compete for corporations, the only one the wins is our corporate oppressors.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Dano, what you are praising is a race to the bottom. If every nation drug themselves to the level of the regulation or tax havens, as you'd like, none of the nation would see any of the benefit that the Caymans and the Swiss are currently seeing, and in fact we'd all just be much, much worse off. That's why it's called the race to the bottom; when countries compete for corporations, the only one the wins is our corporate oppressors.

Water, you know I group up hearing that. That with all the business leaving for Mexico we would be in a race for the bottom, with globalization we would be in a race for the bottom, it never happened.
Ironically that was the strongest argument against free trade, which is I hope your last remaining link to not being a 100% dyed in the wool Liberal.

You have to remember that wealth is not static, as those countries with lower taxes get wealthier, what are they going to do with their dollars? Eat them?
People from the Cayman Islands and the Swiss buy other countries goods and as the labor market gets richer that puts pressure on companies to provide more, including in benefits.
As an example, the Cayman Islands has no minimum wage regulations, yet manual laborers still make around 10$ an hour.

 

[Bonestorm]

No that is not all. Fucking close to half the Cayman Islands work force is expatriate workers, mostly professionals, who went there for job opportunities and less taxes.

Read up:

"The total labour force in the Cayman Islands is approximately 38,000, of whom about 18,000 are expatriate workers on work permits.
There is still a significant demand in Cayman for Executive PA's, Legal Secretaries, Part Qualified Accountants, and Financial Services staff."
http://www.baraud.com/about-caymanW.php

And Switzerland which is much larger and hence more affordable for housing is even more attractive to the middle class. Hell now that I think on it I know someone personally (son's friends parents) who moved to Switzerland, where they are now working.

THAT is all.

Your way of thinking is so terribly fucked up and you lashing out like a little child isn't amusing anymore.

1) Yes, there are lots of expats in the Caymans (not necessarily all Americans).

2) But they are not "mostly professionals." You just made that up. And you have no idea why expats go the Caymans. You made that up too. It is important to note, however, that expats that renounce their American citizenship still have to pay American income taxes. But we are talking about corporate taxes in this thread and whether corporations that file papers in tax havens like the Caymans take jobs there with them. You've shown exactly zero evidence to support this claim.

3) That there is demand in the Caymans for those particular jobs doesn't mean much of anything at all and is entirely irrelevant to whether corporations that file papers in the Caymans also take their jobs to the Caymans.

4) Ooooh, a Danecdote. I've been missing those. While your lashing out gets old, the Danecdote never does.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Your way of thinking is so terribly fucked up and you lashing out like a little child isn't amusing anymore.

1) Yes, there are lots of expats in the Caymans (not necessarily all Americans).

I never said all, but almost all are there because of job opportunities and lower taxes.

2) But they are not "mostly professionals." You just made that up. And you have no idea why expats go the Caymans. You made that up too. It is important to note, however, that expats that renounce their American citizenship still have to pay American income taxes. But we are talking about corporate taxes in this thread and whether corporations that file papers in tax havens like the Caymans take jobs there with them. You've shown exactly zero evidence to support this claim.

I didn't make it up, do you really think that the place is attracting blue collar workers or manufacturing jobs? Of course it is white collar professionals that are there.
And yes as I've explained to you before, legally they do have to pay taxes for 10 years BUT people cheat on their taxes inside their country, they are way more likely to do so out of their country where the chance of getting caught is near non-existent.

3) That there is demand in the Caymans for those particular jobs doesn't mean much of anything at all and is entirely irrelevant to whether corporations that file papers in the Caymans also take their jobs to the Caymans.

Corporations have to hire people somewhat familiar with the laws of the nation they move to, and they are also going to pay less in payroll taxes, SS, etc... for hiring them. That equals big incentive to move or hirer there if they can.

The problem with you is you are interested in absolutes, I never argued all of them are American or every corporation that moves there is looking to hire complete replacements. I am saying higher taxes, more regulation and a worse business climate DO increase all of the above.

4) Ooooh, a Danecdote. I've been missing those. While your lashing out gets old, the Danecdote never does.

Actually this was the response I expected and wasn't disappointed. Do you go after other people who offer far more anecdotes like Darla or Jarod?
Of course not, maybe you do it with me because you have very little life experience, which is the prime reason why I think of you as knowledgeable but young and inexperienced.

 

[Canceled2]

Obama and Dems high tax and high regulation far left Liberal government policies are chasing out businesses and the jobs that come with them.

"Companies seek Swiss domiciles despite tax row

* U.S. political climate may be helping

* Appeal as corporate location may outlast offshore dispute

By Sam Cage

ZUG, Switzerland, March 12 (Reuters) - The tidy towns and mountain vistas of Switzerland are an unlikely setting for an oil boom.

Yet a wave of energy companies has in the last few months announced plans to move to Switzerland -- mainly for its appeal as a low-tax corporate domicile that looks relatively likely to stay out of reach of Barack Obama's tax-seeking administration.

In a country with scant crude oil production of its own, the virtual energy boom has changed the canton or state of Zug, about 30 minutes' drive from Zurich, beyond all recognition. Its economy was based on farming until it slashed tax rates to attract commerce after World War Two."
http://www.reuters.com/article/rbss...2?feedType=RSS&feedName=rbssEnergyNews&rpc=22

The idiocy of this progressive attitude of Obama's "wealth redistribution" is evidenced by this move. Of course corporations and private business's are going to make a profit, the biggest and best profits that they can! (why else be in business?) If the president is going to make the business environment unfriendly, business's are going to go where they are liked. It's not rocket science.

 

[Canceled2]

Why did those US companies move to ANY tax haven? It's interesting you found that but it doesn't take away from the argument that corporations move to where tax conditions are more favorable.

As for the rest, you just use your dismissal or faked sensitivity to avoid responding to any of the points, that's why it's pathetic.

Exactly! They and individuals will continue to find tax havens so long as US tax laws target them! So, instead of having a reasonable fair tax policy where those who most support our economy feel they can actually get as rich as they want without being overtly penalized, we instead try and gouge them. All that does is drive them and ALL of their taxable dollars away! Until they are encouraged to keep their money here through a fair tax policy, they'll leave and with them their tax revenues.

 

[Bonestorm]

I never said all, but almost all are there because of job opportunities and lower taxes.

Bullshit. Prove it.

I didn't make it up, do you really think that the place is attracting blue collar workers or manufacturing jobs? Of course it is white collar professionals that are there.
And yes as I've explained to you before, legally they do have to pay taxes for 10 years BUT people cheat on their taxes inside their country, they are way more likely to do so out of their country where the chance of getting caught is near non-existent.

Bullshit. Prove it.

By the way, the labor statistics for the Cayman Islands are readily available online and they break down employment percentages both by industry and by Caymanian and non-Caymanian persons. The industry that employs the highest percentage of non-Caymanians is the construction industry, which, last time I checked, was generally regarded as "blue collar." Second is private household employees, followed by restaurants, bars and hotels, followed by real estate, followed by wholesale and retail sales.

Jackass.

Corporations have to hire people somewhat familiar with the laws of the nation they move to, and they are also going to pay less in payroll taxes, SS, etc... for hiring them. That equals big incentive to move or hirer there if they can.

The problem with you is you are interested in absolutes, I never argued all of them are American or every corporation that moves there is looking to hire complete replacements. I am saying higher taxes, more regulation and a worse business climate DO increase all of the above.

You said jobs were fleeing to Switzerland. Prove it.

Actually this was the response I expected and wasn't disappointed. Do you go after other people who offer far more anecdotes like Darla or Jarod?
Of course not, maybe you do it with me because you have very little life experience, which is the prime reason why I think of you as knowledgeable but young and inexperienced.

No, it's just you. You are the absolute worst. You logic is completely fucked and it bothers the shit out of me and when called on it you always resort to the Danecdote as if it lends credence to anything you ridiculous claims.

You're old and bitter.

 

[uscitizen]

Not at all, but that is not because of less purchasing power but because of overease of getting a mortgage.

So this crash is all about mortgages?

Btw are the oil companies moving because of taxes or possible criminal actions against them in the USA?

 

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Water, you know I group up hearing that. That with all the business leaving for Mexico we would be in a race for the bottom, with globalization we would be in a race for the bottom, it never happened.
Ironically that was the strongest argument against free trade, which is I hope your last remaining link to not being a 100% dyed in the wool Liberal.

Mexico doesn't have low taxes and low regulations.

I'm talking about tax shelters, which flagrantly abuse the free trade system. It's by far the biggest weak link in free trade, and IMHO they should be penalized in trade for exploiting the rest of the nations like that.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Bullshit. Prove it.

Ok, ok, why don't you tell me why they are there then?
Dude they have no income taxes, no estate taxes, no capital gains taxes, you are only asking me to prove something incredibly universally accepted.

You are just wasting my time because you are too damn stubborn to admit the obvious.

Bullshit. Prove it.

By the way, the labor statistics for the Cayman Islands are readily available online and they break down employment percentages both by industry and by Caymanian and non-Caymanian persons. The industry that employs the highest percentage of non-Caymanians is the construction industry, which, last time I checked, was generally regarded as "blue collar." Second is private household employees, followed by restaurants, bars and hotels, followed by real estate, followed by wholesale and retail sales.
Jackass.

ROFL! Um hello, we are talking about employees who MOVED there for a job, which I said were professionals. I don't think anyone from America decided to head out to the Cayman Islands to start their new life as a retail cashier or bricklayer.
Once AGAIN your reliance on nothing but theory without the experience in tempering it with reality and common sense is exposed.

You said jobs were fleeing to Switzerland. Prove it.

Sure. SOME of the accountants and lawyers they will need will have to be familiar with the taxes and laws of the country of registration.
I don't know the exact numbers and neither do you, but it is some.

No, it's just you. You are the absolute worst. You logic is completely fucked and it bothers the shit out of me and when called on it you always resort to the Danecdote as if it lends credence to anything you ridiculous claims.
You're old and bitter.

Anecdotal evidence ADDS to the point I am trying to make, only really dense or more likely dshonest Liberals try and pretend it's what I rely on.
I'm probably younger than most on here, and I am not at all bitter for toying with your silliness in pretending that higher taxes don't chase out business and jobs.

 

[KingCondanomation]

Mexico doesn't have low taxes and low regulations.

I'm talking about tax shelters, which flagrantly abuse the free trade system. It's by far the biggest weak link in free trade, and IMHO they should be penalized in trade for exploiting the rest of the nations like that.

Why should they be penalized? They are being competitive and have done no harm against anyone.

This is the sort of thinking that reminds me of why most authoritarian leftwing countries ended up restricting freedom of movement.
People and their possessions do not belong to you or liberals or your government.