The greenback

[wiseones2cents]

Yet they do, and still could. The assumption that "greenbacks" would solve everything magically is simply a sign that you have no idea what you are talking about when talking about monetary policy.

Not if you made it law they cant they couldn't. Before fiat money came about? There was only a certain amount of jewels and wealth(gold, silver). You could not just create more wealth out of thin air. You needed to find more wealth to increase your wealth. Until the money changers(who lent out money)realized they could exaggerate their total assets. Once the people caught on, they would issue out notes, but always have the gold in the vault if anyone came looking for it. They just keep changing the rules so the rich remain rich.

Its a scam.

What the debt is backed by is not a deposit in any reserve, it is literally debt. The Federal Reserve literally creates a "loan" and deposits an amount (it's not even printed) into an account creating more currency literally out of thin air.

Yawn... I've done this debate a thousand times. OK! Answer me this. Why cant all economies just rack up a 14 trillion dollar debt? Heck even a 30 trillion dollar debt? Heck why is Greece having problems? They can just make money out of thin air too! Who cares how much debt you accumulate! The sky is the limit(note sarcasm). It is clear something else is backing the currency.

The Fed Res wasn't even created in its current state until 1913.

The people that control the fed(The Rothschild cabal) have been in business much longer then the actual fed.

The slippery slope fallacy. It simply isn't true. The reality is a centralized bank is nothing like what we currently have with the Federal Reserve, which is privately owned banks creating currency from thin air then loaning it to our government. Seriously, it isn't the same thing and it is nothing that "Freemasons" wanted. That's simply distraction from the real problem.

First you stated the free masons were against centralized banking. I showed that it was in fact a freemason that signed it into law. Therefore proving you wrong. Two? Same thing. It was basically foreign wealth consolidating American credit. They gave them a monopoly on credit by design. Later it was able to exaggerate its wealth and create huge amounts of capital!

The numbers dont lie. Do you have any idea how much 45 billion was in 1945? If they could make money out of thin air heck their money would be much more then that! Can you imagine how many trillions of dollars they have now? And that is just the American branch of their operations!

"...the increase in the assets of the Federal Reserve banks from 143 million dollars in 1913 to
45 billion dollars in 1949 went directly to the private stockholders of the [federal reserve] banks." — Eustace Mullins

Which would be much the same reaction when somebody spoke negatively about the Black Panthers, La Raza, or any other negative entity from the same position. It's inane to ignore what happens with other ethnic groups so you can pretend that Jewish people have super powers.

Follow the money trail. It never lies. The facts are that the Jews have been in finance from the very beginning. Heck some say they invented taxation(I did a study on that awhile ago). Since they controlled money via a money changing system, they also controlled trade and since they know the financial system so well, they know how to exploit it. That is why even Roman Emperors had Jewish accountants. Not to mention they are very organized and they all work for the one cause. To control the gentiles.....

They were subdued for awhile(1000 years) but as soon as the Roman Emperor made charging interest illegal? The jews started an underground loan shark operation and made a killing. They started to climb up the wealth ladder and next thing you know they were lending money to kings, and kings allowed them attain high places of authority that they were previously denied.

Again, they gain it through debt, the money is quite literally monetized debt, not something backed by actual wealth.

Can you tell me what is preventing every country from having a 14 trillion dollar deficit? If you cant answer that? Then your beliefs do not hold water.

Seriously, I don't need to "do some research" I fully understand the negative consequences of the federal reserve. My only points are:

The Greenbacks, also not backed by real wealth, are not a solution to inflation. Backing a new currency with actual gold reserves would be. However the "Keynesian" economic policy followed by nearly every government in existence cannot work without the ability to control inflation.

Freemasons didn't create the current Federal Reserve. It was created in 1913 under Woodrow Wilson who was not a Freemason. At that time Freemasons had little to no influence in American government due to the anti-masonic party and movement.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Masonic_Party

Anyway, Freemasons long had lost their influence in politics in the US by the time this mess was created, you are an arrow aimed at a distraction and will miss the real target. You should aim yourself at the Federal Reserve without losing your focus and going after "Jews and Freemasons"... If you get the entire Fed, if the "Jews and Freemasons" are the cause of that FED you will still get them, if they are only a "small part" and you are aimed at just that part you will wind up getting those "dirty Jews and Freemasons" and the FED will still control you.

Basically, what I am saying is: If this 'conspiracy' is true Freemasonry and 'Zionists' (the current "excuse" of racists that hate Jews is to say you only hate the 'Zionists' not 'All Jews', and to speak about Noahidism as a secondary target and a reason to fear Jews) are only a tiny part, the sacrificial lamb so to speak.

They present a convenient target, one that will allow them to continue in their power positions and perpetuate control as you get the "Freemasons and Jews"...

My targets come from years of research. The free masons still have control in government. They never lost it. Look at the bush's and John Kerry and other key figures in Obama's economic team. They are from the skull and bones. A organization that was started by Alphonso taft a free mason, after the Freemasons had to go underground due to public outrage. They are still vary much alive and have many wealthy organizations under their wing.

 

[Damocles]

No, our ruling class is descended from the European Royal Family, and they are descended from the Egyptian rulers

So your answer is "yes" you think the people in the Fed Reserve are descendants of the Pharaohs. Got it.

 

[Damocles]

Not if you made it law they cant they couldn't. Before fiat money came about? There was only a certain amount of jewels and wealth(gold, silver). You could not just create more wealth out of thin air. You needed to find more wealth to increase your wealth. Until the money changers(who lent out money)realized they could exaggerate their total assets. Once the people caught on, they would issue out notes, but always have the gold in the vault if anyone came looking for it. They just keep changing the rules so the rich remain rich.

*sigh*

Do you in fact realize that Greenbacks were fiat currency? It is by definition fiat currency. It is inane to say that it would fix stuff then say "not if you made it illegal to actually be Greenbacks"

Again, this only underlines your complete ignorance of monetary policy. Educate yourself from some sites that don't mention Freemasons, learn about the policy instead of the "conspiracy", it will really make you look less like a fool.

Its a scam.

Duh.

Yawn... I've done this debate a thousand times. OK! Answer me this. Why cant all economies just rack up a 14 trillion dollar debt? Heck even a 30 trillion dollar debt? Heck why is Greece having problems? They can just make money out of thin air too! Who cares how much debt you accumulate! The sky is the limit(note sarcasm). It is clear something else is backing the currency.

Please look up the Weimar republic, it is exactly what they did.

The people that control the fed(The Rothschild cabal) have been in business much longer then the actual fed.

However, fiat currency has not been around "longer" than that. Reality: What you have an issue with didn't exist until after 1913, and actually it didn't exist fully until the 1970s when the last vestige of the gold standard was legislated away. When your note was no longer capable of being traded in for any amount of gold secured in our treasury...

First you stated the free masons were against centralized banking. I showed that it was in fact a freemason that signed it into law. Therefore proving you wrong. Two? Same thing. It was basically foreign wealth consolidating American credit. They gave them a monopoly on credit by design. Later it was able to exaggerate its wealth and create huge amounts of capital!

You are confusing types of centralized banking. The Freemasons built a system where fiat currency was non-existent.

The numbers dont lie. Do you have any idea how much 45 billion was in 1945? If they could make money out of thin air heck their money would be much more then that! Can you imagine how many trillions of dollars they have now? And that is just the American branch of their operations!

"...the increase in the assets of the Federal Reserve banks from 143 million dollars in 1913 to
45 billion dollars in 1949 went directly to the private stockholders of the [federal reserve] banks." — Eustace Mullins

Again, one can only create inflation if the money is no longer backed by something of actual worth. One has to decouple the money from the item of value before they can print more fiat currency and create inflation. This is still more evidence that you don't understand monetary policy even to the most basic of the terms, let alone economics at any level whatsoever.

Follow the money trail. It never lies. The facts are that the Jews have been in finance from the very beginning. Heck some say they invented taxation(I did a study on that awhile ago). Since they controlled money via a money changing system, they also controlled trade and since they know the financial system so well, they know how to exploit it. That is why even Roman Emperors had Jewish accountants. Not to mention they are very organized and they all work for the one cause. To control the gentiles.....

The fact is that people who are persecuted often can only participate in a service economy, that they aim for the top of a service economy doesn't make them evil. In a place and time where Christians were not allowed to charge interest, only Jews could be the bankers.

They were subdued for awhile(1000 years) but as soon as the Roman Emperor made charging interest illegal? The jews started an underground loan shark operation and made a killing. They started to climb up the wealth ladder and next thing you know they were lending money to kings, and kings allowed them attain high places of authority that they were previously denied.

More racism code. No other people participated in a black market than Jews? Total garbage.

Can you tell me what is preventing every country from having a 14 trillion dollar deficit? If you cant answer that? Then your beliefs do not hold water.

I've answered it previously in this post. They can. See the Weimar republic to find out how it turns out when you artificially inflate and it gets out of control. Now, if your currency is the international reserve currency you have a bit more room, but the downfall will begin when they choose a different reserve currency. For an example of this see Britain, right around the 1970s...

My targets come from years of research. The free masons still have control in government. They never lost it. Look at the bush's and John Kerry and other key figures in Obama's economic team. They are from the skull and bones. A organization that was started by Alphonso taft a free mason, after the Freemasons had to go underground due to public outrage. They are still vary much alive and have many wealthy organizations under their wing.

I wish we did. John Kerry is not a Freemason. Nor is George Bush. While Bill Clinton was a DeMolay he also was not a Freemason (and before you say they are the same thing, it is like saying the Cub Scouts are the "same thing" as a Soldier.)

The last person that I know of who ran for President that was a Freemason was Bob Dole, and he wasn't there because he was a Freemason, he was there in spite of it.

Reality: the anti mason movement in the US pretty much stripped all political influence from the Freemasons. They become an altruistic society that donates money to education and charity. Pretty much like the Knights of Columbus, just not Catholic.

 

[Rune]

So your answer is "yes" you think the people in the Fed Reserve are descendants of the Pharaohs. Got it.

Not what I said, for the second time.

 

[Damocles]

Not what I said, for the second time.

Right, because Egyptian monarchies had nothing to do with Pharaohs... We believe you, man. Everybody at the top are descendants of Egyptian monarchies... I got it. No worries.

 

[wiseones2cents]

*sigh*

Do you in fact realize that Greenbacks were fiat currency? It is by definition fiat currency. It is inane to say that it would fix stuff then say "not if you made it illegal to actually be Greenbacks"

Again, this only underlines your complete ignorance of monetary policy. Educate yourself from some sites that don't mention Freemasons, learn about the policy instead of the "conspiracy", it will really make you look less like a fool.

ummmm your reply does not address what I stated. Secondly, I know that the greenback is fiat money(Though I'm assuming it is backed by wealth(GOLD/GDP).

Also you seem to be raising a stink over the greenback. Are you for or against America having the power to make their own currency, interest free?

Duh.

At least we agree on something.lol

Please look up the Weimar republic, it is exactly what they did.

From what I read? The weimer republic was in debt to the US(and couldn't pay making money out of thin air.lol) Therefore they increased amount of paper money in circulation, which caused hyperinflation. Therefore it was real wealth via hyperinflation payed by the people that was paying off the debt.

However, fiat currency has not been around "longer" than that. Reality: What you have an issue with didn't exist until after 1913, and actually it didn't exist fully until the 1970s when the last vestige of the gold standard was legislated away. When your note was no longer capable of being traded in for any amount of gold secured in our treasury...

The point is that they have been making money or exaggerating their wealth for much longer then the FR.

You are confusing types of centralized banking. The Freemasons built a system where fiat currency was non-existent.

I'm not confusing anything. You said free masons were against centralized banking and I proved you wrong. Look at Roosevelt(a free mason)? As soon as he was elected the Feds poured tons of capital into the economy. Sorry their relationship is evident.

Yes the initial constitution has the currency being backed by gold. And today it is not(at least not directly, but still is indirectly, VIA the Federal Reserve) The European banks did actually have GOLD that they lent to the USA.

The USA borrows from the FEDS with 50% interest. For every dollar borrowed they pay back TWO. This is why the wealth of the Federal reserve is enormous(in the trillions of real wealth). When their was no more gold to give, they set up a payment via GDP.

It all makes perfect sense, as opposed to you people believing money is made out of thin air. Though they can easily exaggerate their holdings and thus collect interest on wealth they do not have.

Here check this out.

Comparison to Federal Reserve Notes

Both United States Notes and Federal Reserve Notes are parts of the national currency of the United States, and both have been legal tender since the gold recall of 1933. Both have been used in circulation as money in the same way. However, the issuing authority for them came from different statutes.[24] United States Notes were created as fiat currency, in that the government has never categorically guaranteed to redeem them for precious metal - even though at times, such as after the specie resumption of 1879, federal officials were authorized to do so if requested. The difference between a United States Note and a Federal Reserve Note is that a United States Note represented a "bill of credit" and was inserted by the Treasury directly into circulation free of interest. Federal Reserve Notes are backed by debt purchased by the Federal Reserve, and thus generate seigniorage, or interest, for the Federal Reserve System, which serves as a lending intermediary between the Treasury and the public.

Here are some key notes. What was the GOLD recall? Roosevelt your mason buddy made it illegal for anyone to have any gold(Did anyone notify John Paulson?lol) Giving them a gold monopoly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

Also the federal reserve notes according to the paragraph PURCHASE American debt. Are they purchased with real wealth or worthless paper money? Are you saying they pay worthless debt, derived from worthless money with more worthless money?lol

Again, one can only create inflation if the money is no longer backed by something of actual worth. One has to decouple the money from the item of value before they can print more fiat currency and create inflation. This is still more evidence that you don't understand monetary policy even to the most basic of the terms, let alone economics at any level whatsoever.

Maybe YOU don't understand. I am saying you should not be able to cannot create more money unless you create more real wealth(GDP) simple as that! Therefore eliminating inflation. Inflation is a scam, where the bills/expenses of the rich are passed down to the consumers. To keep the rich in power.

The fact is that people who are persecuted often can only participate in a service economy, that they aim for the top of a service economy doesn't make them evil. In a place and time where Christians were not allowed to charge interest, only Jews could be the bankers.

That's not the reason. As long as they had the Temple they had money(donations) coming in from all over the world. And those who controlled that wealth had fiscal influence. You can say the Temple was like the first bank and the first to collect taxes.

Its what they do at the top that makes them evil. Their beliefs are that the outcome justifies the means and that is not kosher so to speak. Still don't know what part the Catholic Church plays in all this....

Actually no one in the empire was allowed to charge interests, so if the jews were doing it, they were doing it illegally. And if they were doing it illegally, they must have hired thugs to collect. Starting the first organized crime ring.

More racism code. No other people participated in a black market than Jews? Total garbage.

From what I read from history books, not as much as the jews. This is where the jews rose up out of the ashes again and started waging economic warfare on kings with their newly acquired wealth.

Some can see this as a cycle of persecution and its basically persecute or be persecuted but this cycle must end.....The jews persecuted the Christians, the Christians persecuted the jews, now the jews are back on top waging war against Christianity.

I've answered it previously in this post. They can. See the Weimar republic to find out how it turns out when you artificially inflate and it gets out of control. Now, if your currency is the international reserve currency you have a bit more room, but the downfall will begin when they choose a different reserve currency. For an example of this see Britain, right around the 1970s...

The downfall for whom? America. That is about it.

From what I understand? The amount of money in circulation in the weimer republic was backed by WEALTH, not by debt. Though they had alot of debt to America. What they did was they increase the number of notes(THAT were backed by wealth), which made the notes depreciate in value, and thus you needed more notes to pay for stuff(especially imports), causing super inflation. To say that the money was backed by nothing means YOU are clueless of monetary policy. How can they evaluate the value of the currency if it were not backed by actual wealth? Why do you think Britain's pound is worth more then most currencies? Because it is backed by the most wealth made out of thin air?lol

Germany and England were the riches countries, but when the Germany's Rothchild's son(who had just acquired money via Wilhelm IX wealth) moved to England with all his wealth and married the richest person's daughter in England(Hannah Barent-Cohen) who was also a jew. And together they were the most powerful union on the earth.....

Even though kings and bankers were known for exaggerating their holdings(So they can lend out more money), most was still backed by gold.(real wealth).

Therefore your belief that the weimer public was making money out of thin air is illogical. Heck American banks were financing Germany. If they could make money out of thin air, they wouldn't need American loans! Or they could have paid them off in full.

I wish we did. John Kerry is not a Freemason. Nor is George Bush. While Bill Clinton was a DeMolay he also was not a Freemason (and before you say they are the same thing, it is like saying the Cub Scouts are the "same thing" as a Soldier.)

The last person that I know of who ran for President that was a Freemason was Bob Dole, and he wasn't there because he was a Freemason, he was there in spite of it.

Reality: the anti mason movement in the US pretty much stripped all political influence from the Freemasons. They become an altruistic society that donates money to education and charity. Pretty much like the Knights of Columbus, just not Catholic.

Actual they were ALL freemasons from Bush to Clinton. The devil may disguise himself but he is always the devil.

The Skull and bones was started by Alphonso taft a 33 degree free mason as an extension of freemasonry after they had to go underground because of public backlash for assassinating a member that gave out freemason secrets. That when they offshoots started springing up all over the globe.

The regular freemasons are just pawns, though are given opportunity to work their way up, as long as they pay their dues. The real power now lies in their offshoot organizations, consisting of the wealthy elites. Like Skull and Bones.

 

[wiseones2cents]

It also allows them to make you look like a nutjob.

If I say, "The Federal Reserve is bad because: <insert list of how it effects inflation and your specific wealth>," I may be effective.

If I say, "The Freemasons are bad, and so are 'Zionists' and Noahides, and they created the Fed and therefore the FED is bad because of: List the same effects here as above," nobody is listening any more, people have already tuned out because I sound like an idiot conspiracy theorist racist...

Even if it is true, it serves to get people to ignore you when you start off with Freemasons are teh Eviiiilll.... They created this government and nation, but they are teh Eeeevilll anyway! it makes you sound like a nutjob.

If this nutjob were to take the Fed to court, they would be stripped of all their wealth.

Freemasons(of old) were agents of European banks. That is where they draw their power from. Almost every wealthy elite in America can trace their fortunes to bank elites.

 

[Rune]

Damn, you are fucked up.
Nevermind the paranoid Freemason bullshit, you have no idea how the Fed works, and you contradict yourself in sentence after sentence.

You truly have no idea what the fuck you are talking about at all, in fact, you seem to suffer from some form of mental illness as well.

Let me give you an example of your insanity.

You claim the Weimar Repulic's money is backed by real wealth, yet was subject to hyper-inflation when they printed more notes.

You can't have it both ways, as much as you need to to benefit your paranoia.

Now, repeat after me.

The Fed is a private central bank.

It prints fiat currency, which is backed by nothing but debt.

That is a fact, plain and simple. NONE of your aguments prove this untrue, they just prove your lack of reasoning ability.

 

[wiseones2cents]

Well not exactly. The fed can create money, and they continually inflate the money supply. That is how they transfer wealth to themselves and their banker buddies. However, they can't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. If they inflate to the point where people begin to lose confidence, then people will begin to dump dollars to acquire goods before the dollars continue to lose value. Classic inflationary spiral.

As long as they have money and say that it is valuable and accepted by all? They can buy anything. Your land is worth 5,000? Heck I'll give you $20,000(of worthless money).And to those who don't want to sell? Well they can buy all the muscle and military they like and conquer them. How do you compete with a nation that can make money out of thin air? It doesn't add up.

WHy would they care about transfering the people wealth when they already have limited wealth at their disposal? Sorry makes no sense.

Again, federal reserve notes are not notes in the sense that they are redeemable in anything but other federal reserve notes. They are not "backed" by anything. However, this does not mean they are worthless. They have value, because they can be used to buy things, and they can be used to buy things because they are valuable. They ARE money; they are not backed by money.

However, as mentioned before, the FED walks a tightrope. They cannot produce too many or their value will drop. Once people perceive the value to drop, they will become less valuable, and the cycle will wind down. Possibly terminally for the FRN.

I disagree. Think of all the money they are making? Where do you think that money goes???They are investing it in more real wealth. The fed must be backed by real wealth. The problem is that it has never been audited and it can easily exaggerate its holdings.

We need to kill the FED. We need congress to specify exactly what our monetary unit is, in terms of an actual commodity. Giving congress the printing press will end very badly.

Yes, the fed has to go down. It is what keeps us enslaved via the taxes to pay off the debt, they and their henchmen accumulate, the interest paid, and the inflation they cause.

Do you believe every state should have their own currency? Can you imagine the scams??? Who else would you trust with printing the money? Should we just go back to a barter system? No paper money?

 

[wiseones2cents]

*sigh*

Do you in fact realize that Greenbacks were fiat currency? It is by definition fiat currency. It is inane to say that it would fix stuff then say "not if you made it illegal to actually be Greenbacks"

Again, this only underlines your complete ignorance of monetary policy. Educate yourself from some sites that don't mention Freemasons, learn about the policy instead of the "conspiracy", it will really make you look less like a fool.

Duh.





Please look up the Weimar republic, it is exactly what they did.







However, fiat currency has not been around "longer" than that. Reality: What you have an issue with didn't exist until after 1913, and actually it didn't exist fully until the 1970s when the last vestige of the gold standard was legislated away. When your note was no longer capable of being traded in for any amount of gold secured in our treasury...





You are confusing types of centralized banking. The Freemasons built a system where fiat currency was non-existent.



Again, one can only create inflation if the money is no longer backed by something of actual worth. One has to decouple the money from the item of value before they can print more fiat currency and create inflation. This is still more evidence that you don't understand monetary policy even to the most basic of the terms, let alone economics at any level whatsoever.






The fact is that people who are persecuted often can only participate in a service economy, that they aim for the top of a service economy doesn't make them evil. In a place and time where Christians were not allowed to charge interest, only Jews could be the bankers.



More racism code. No other people participated in a black market than Jews? Total garbage.





I've answered it previously in this post. They can. See the Weimar republic to find out how it turns out when you artificially inflate and it gets out of control. Now, if your currency is the international reserve currency you have a bit more room, but the downfall will begin when they choose a different reserve currency. For an example of this see Britain, right around the 1970s...




I wish we did. John Kerry is not a Freemason. Nor is George Bush. While Bill Clinton was a DeMolay he also was not a Freemason (and before you say they are the same thing, it is like saying the Cub Scouts are the "same thing" as a Soldier.)

The last person that I know of who ran for President that was a Freemason was Bob Dole, and he wasn't there because he was a Freemason, he was there in spite of it.

Reality: the anti mason movement in the US pretty much stripped all political influence from the Freemasons. They become an altruistic society that donates money to education and charity. Pretty much like the Knights of Columbus, just not Catholic.

My replies are somehow at the bottom, so you can reply there. If not I will cut and paste it up here.

 

[wiseones2cents]

Damn, you are fucked up.
Nevermind the paranoid Freemason bullshit, you have no idea how the Fed works, and you contradict yourself in sentence after sentence.

Show me the contradictions!!! I seem to have hit a cord! Are you a jew, freemason or both?

You truly have no idea what the fuck you are talking about at all, in fact, you seem to suffer from some form of mental illness as well.

Let me give you an example of your insanity.

You claim the Weimar Repulic's money is backed by real wealth, yet was subject to hyper-inflation when they printed more notes.

You can't have it both ways, as much as you need to to benefit your paranoia.

How is that contradictory? Lets say the king has $1,000,000,000 dollars worth of GOLD. And he issues 1,000,000,000 notes representing that gold to his people. Then he creates another 1,000,000,000 notes(because he has none of the initial 1 million to pay for anything, but he still has the gold). What does he do? He creates another 1,000,000,000 notes. There are now 2,000,000,000 notes representing the $1,000,000,000 dollars, therefore the value of the notes are no longer $1, but 50 cents. That is what causes the inflation. All the cost of the products especially those imported have gone up because the value of your dollars has gone down. Thus making the cost of the imports go up. Though if he has private enterprises running the resources, they would expect full global market value also. Therefore the price of everything would go up.

Here try to pic up a dictionary.

in·fla·tion
   [in-fley-shuhn]
noun
1.
Economics. a persistent, substantial rise in the general level of prices related to an increase in the volume of money and resulting in the loss of value of currency

Now, repeat after me.

The Fed is a private central bank.

It prints fiat currency, which is backed by nothing but debt.

That is a fact, plain and simple. NONE of your aguments prove this untrue, they just prove your lack of reasoning ability.

Then debate my arguments. Just you saying it doesn't, doesn't prove anything.

The only logical explanation is that it is backed by wealth(Gold). After they gained a monopoly on the entire global economy, they could then greatly exaggerate their holdings. But they'd have to keep it believable or the rest of the world would catch on and that would be it for their little game.

Every country can claim bankruptcy as much times as they want. As long as the feds possess the real wealth. The GOLD/land ect... They can always re-issue currency.

That is why they made tender that can no longer be redeemed for actual wealth(Gold). Great scam hey?

They keep the gold with no risk of losing their assets and continue to buy the world with the profits!

If they could make money out of thin air, they would have already owned everything decades ago.

Heck let Canada know! I want to build the largest military the world has ever seen!!!!!!Tanks, Missiles, fighter jets, ects....Oh wait, they have to prove they are able to pay the bills!!! That is where GDP comes in. So its not backed by debt. Its backed by WEALTH(GDP) as collateral.

 

[Damocles]

ummmm your reply does not address what I stated. Secondly, I know that the greenback is fiat money(Though I'm assuming it is backed by wealth(GOLD/GDP).

OMFG>... Fiat currency is by definition not backed by anything. Why am I speaking with you? You are cripplingly uneducated on the subject at hand.

Also you seem to be raising a stink over the greenback. Are you for or against America having the power to make their own currency, interest free?

Only if it is not a fiat currency.

At least we agree on something.lol

It is what the conversation is about. You, however still don't quite understand what "fiat currency" actually means.

From what I read? The weimer republic was in debt to the US(and couldn't pay making money out of thin air.lol) Therefore they increased amount of paper money in circulation, which caused hyperinflation. Therefore it was real wealth via hyperinflation payed by the people that was paying off the debt.

Again, backed by debt and then printed their own currency causing hyperinflation. This is one of the patterns that happen often with fiat currency.

The point is that they have been making money or exaggerating their wealth for much longer then the FR.

And again, the actual subject is fiat currency, which wasn't in effect in the US until 1970, not during George Washington's time. Please refocus, learn, then come back.

I'm not confusing anything. You said free masons were against centralized banking and I proved you wrong. Look at Roosevelt(a free mason)? As soon as he was elected the Feds poured tons of capital into the economy. Sorry their relationship is evident.

Yes the initial constitution has the currency being backed by gold. And today it is not(at least not directly, but still is indirectly, VIA the Federal Reserve) The European banks did actually have GOLD that they lent to the USA.

The USA borrows from the FEDS with 50% interest. For every dollar borrowed they pay back TWO. This is why the wealth of the Federal reserve is enormous(in the trillions of real wealth). When their was no more gold to give, they set up a payment via GDP.

It all makes perfect sense, as opposed to you people believing money is made out of thin air. Though they can easily exaggerate their holdings and thus collect interest on wealth they do not have.

Here check this out.

Comparison to Federal Reserve Notes

Both United States Notes and Federal Reserve Notes are parts of the national currency of the United States, and both have been legal tender since the gold recall of 1933. Both have been used in circulation as money in the same way. However, the issuing authority for them came from different statutes.[24] United States Notes were created as fiat currency, in that the government has never categorically guaranteed to redeem them for precious metal - even though at times, such as after the specie resumption of 1879, federal officials were authorized to do so if requested. The difference between a United States Note and a Federal Reserve Note is that a United States Note represented a "bill of credit" and was inserted by the Treasury directly into circulation free of interest. Federal Reserve Notes are backed by debt purchased by the Federal Reserve, and thus generate seigniorage, or interest, for the Federal Reserve System, which serves as a lending intermediary between the Treasury and the public.

Here are some key notes. What was the GOLD recall? Roosevelt your mason buddy made it illegal for anyone to have any gold(Did anyone notify John Paulson?lol) Giving them a gold monopoly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

Yes, it is what I have been speaking about in this thread. It's like you don't pay attention and are incapable of actually retaining information. It was the beginning of fiat currency, which didn't take full effect until the 1970s.

It was a bad plan, but again he didn't do it because he was a Freemason, nor was he in the office due to that. The reality is, at that time and now Freemasonry is a negative, not a positive for a politician.

Also the federal reserve notes according to the paragraph PURCHASE American debt. Are they purchased with real wealth or worthless paper money? Are you saying they pay worthless debt, derived from worthless money with more worthless money?lol

Right, that is how it is "valued" by the debt. Seriously, are you really this inane?

Maybe YOU don't understand. I am saying you should not be able to cannot create more money unless you create more real wealth(GDP) simple as that! Therefore eliminating inflation. Inflation is a scam, where the bills/expenses of the rich are passed down to the consumers. To keep the rich in power.

*sigh*

Fiat currency is still fiat currency even if you say "real wealth" and try to pretend it is backed by the GDP. Currency needs to have a true value, not be valued on debt and used to "control" inflation and thus reduce the value of your money in savings forcing you to spend or lose.

That's not the reason. As long as they had the Temple they had money(donations) coming in from all over the world. And those who controlled that wealth had fiscal influence. You can say the Temple was like the first bank and the first to collect taxes.

Its what they do at the top that makes them evil. Their beliefs are that the outcome justifies the means and that is not kosher so to speak. Still don't know what part the Catholic Church plays in all this....

Actually no one in the empire was allowed to charge interests, so if the jews were doing it, they were doing it illegally. And if they were doing it illegally, they must have hired thugs to collect. Starting the first organized crime ring.

Again, do you have any evidence only those "dirty Jews" were doing it? Your bigot is showing again.

From what I read from history books, not as much as the jews. This is where the jews rose up out of the ashes again and started waging economic warfare on kings with their newly acquired wealth.

You didn't read that in history books, you read that on the bigoted websites you researched this on. You learned to hate a whole people but never learned what fiat currency means.

Some can see this as a cycle of persecution and its basically persecute or be persecuted but this cycle must end.....The jews persecuted the Christians, the Christians persecuted the jews, now the jews are back on top waging war against Christianity.

The downfall for whom? America. That is about it.

From what I understand? The amount of money in circulation in the weimer republic was backed by WEALTH, not by debt. Though they had alot of debt to America. What they did was they increase the number of notes(THAT were backed by wealth), which made the notes depreciate in value, and thus you needed more notes to pay for stuff(especially imports), causing super inflation. To say that the money was backed by nothing means YOU are clueless of monetary policy. How can they evaluate the value of the currency if it were not backed by actual wealth? Why do you think Britain's pound is worth more then most currencies? Because it is backed by the most wealth made out of thin air?lol

From what you "heard"? Where, on the anti Freemason sites? You quite literally do not know the simplest of concepts to be able to participate in this conversation with any meaning.

Germany and England were the riches countries, but when the Germany's Rothchild's son(who had just acquired money via Wilhelm IX wealth) moved to England with all his wealth and married the richest person's daughter in England(Hannah Barent-Cohen) who was also a jew. And together they were the most powerful union on the earth.....

Even though kings and bankers were known for exaggerating their holdings(So they can lend out more money), most was still backed by gold.(real wealth).

Therefore your belief that the weimer public was making money out of thin air is illogical. Heck American banks were financing Germany. If they could make money out of thin air, they wouldn't need American loans! Or they could have paid them off in full.

Do you actually understand what hyperinflation is and what causes it? The money was not even backed by debt at the point where they were using wheelbarrows full of money to buy bread.

Seriously, this is absolutely one of the most stupid conversations I have ever had on this site. You don't know the simplest of terms, absolutely don't know the first thing about monetary policy. Seriously, it's like speaking to an 8 year old.

Actual they were ALL freemasons from Bush to Clinton. The devil may disguise himself but he is always the devil.

No, they weren't.

The Skull and bones was started by Alphonso taft a 33 degree free mason as an extension of freemasonry after they had to go underground because of public backlash for assassinating a member that gave out freemason secrets. That when they offshoots started springing up all over the globe.

It's a college fraternity. It is not the same thing. That's like saying that a brick of clay and a brick of gold are the same thing because they are both "bricks"...

They aren't the same thing.

The regular freemasons are just pawns, though are given opportunity to work their way up, as long as they pay their dues. The real power now lies in their offshoot organizations, consisting of the wealthy elites. Like Skull and Bones.

That's funny. But you are lost in stupid conspiracy and actually missed any information offered by the sites you visited to "research" this POS.

I can't believe that I have wasted any amount of time with you.

Fiat currency - Currency not backed by anything but the "faith and credit" of some entity... See the US dollar... Debt is what creates and backs our currency.

 

[wiseones2cents]

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered...I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies... The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

"The system of banking [is] a blot left in all our Constitutions,
which, if not covered, will end in their destruction...
I sincerely believe that banking institutions are more dangerous
than standing armies; and that the principle of spending money to
be paid by posterity... is but swindling futurity on a large scale."

 

[Damocles]

I cannot have a serious conversation with somebody who actually doesn't know the basic vocabulary for the topic at hand. I'm done with you. You are right about one thing, your "wisdom" is worth about two cents.

At least we agree on one thing, our currency should be backed by something. You just don't know why, nor what things actually mean and spend more time trying to assign blame than to learn the root cause of things.

 

[wiseones2cents]

I cannot have a serious conversation with somebody who actually doesn't know the basic vocabulary for the topic at hand. I'm done with you. You are right about one thing, your "wisdom" is worth about two cents.

At least we agree on one thing, our currency should be backed by something. You just don't know why, nor what things actually mean and spend more time trying to assign blame than to learn the root cause of things.

Your done because you know you cant win. The European banks didn't come to America and say hey! Let me lend you money backed by nothing(Just debt) and you can pay me back with 50% interest ok? That's a great idea!

But wait a minute? Why do we need you? Why cant we make our own money and pay ourselves 50% interest? UMMm wellll ummm we can make money out of thin air! Umm so can we!

Basically what these fuckers did was basically they stirred trouble in Kingdoms instigated wars that led to depletion of gold reserves(to pay for the wars) and when the Kings/Presidents were broke, the banks who had all the gold would go to the king and lend him money. Once they lent to the kings they would use their agents to undermine the economy creating perpetual debt. And take over the economy and the kingdom/country.

When England caught on they tried to throw them out. Their economy did a nose dive and they were asked to come back in......

Here is what Andrew Jackson had to say about the national banks(who were the precursor for the FR).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_jackson

The Second Bank of the United States was authorized for a twenty year period during James Madison's tenure in 1816. As President, Jackson worked to rescind the bank's federal charter. In Jackson's veto message (written by George Bancroft), the bank needed to be abolished because:

It concentrated the nation's financial strength in a single institution.
It exposed the government to control by foreign interests.
It served mainly to make the rich richer.
It exercised too much control over members of Congress.
It favored northeastern states over southern and western states.
Banks are controlled by a few select families.
Banks have a long history of instigating wars between nations, forcing them to borrow funding to pay for them.

P.S.Yes we both agree that money should be backed by real wealth and inflation should be illegal. The real culprit is always at the end of the money trail and in this case the Federal Reserve. Are you saying I should point to another culprit?

 

[Centinel]

As long as they have money and say that it is valuable and accepted by all? They can buy anything. Your land is worth 5,000? Heck I'll give you $20,000(of worthless money).And to those who don't want to sell? Well they can buy all the muscle and military they like and conquer them. How do you compete with a nation that can make money out of thin air? It doesn't add up.

WHy would they care about transfering the people wealth when they already have limited wealth at their disposal? Sorry makes no sense.

I disagree. Think of all the money they are making? Where do you think that money goes???They are investing it in more real wealth. The fed must be backed by real wealth. The problem is that it has never been audited and it can easily exaggerate its holdings.

Yes, the fed has to go down. It is what keeps us enslaved via the taxes to pay off the debt, they and their henchmen accumulate, the interest paid, and the inflation they cause.

I think we may be saying the same thing in different ways. Or maybe we see things slightly differently, but at this point I don't see the need to argue the minutia. The fact is, we agree in our desire to see the fed go away.

Do you believe every state should have their own currency? Can you imagine the scams??? Who else would you trust with printing the money? Should we just go back to a barter system? No paper money?

I'm not precisely sure what you mean when you use the term currency, but I'll try to give you an overview of how I would like to see things work.

Money would not be printed. Money would be gold, or silver. (I don't care which it is. Let's say it's silver.) Prices would be expressed in grams of silver. So lets say a loaf of bread costs 10 grams of silver. I could pay the baker in a number of ways. I could give him coins containing 10 grams of silver. (I'm imagining that these might be produced by various companies in standard denominations, eg. 1, 5, 10, 25, 100g.)

On the other hand, I could pay with a check. This would go through the currently existing check clearing process and would have the effect of removing 10g of silver from my bank account and adding 10g of silver to his bank account. Or, I could pay with a debit card, which would have essentially the same effect.

I can't particularly see the need for paper money. You've got coins, checks, debit and credit cards.

I'm not exactly sure what sorts of scams you are imagining. It's essentially the same sort of mechanism we have today: coins, checks, debit, and credit. Just drop the paper money. I don't know how much actual coinage would pass hand-to-hand. I imagine that big payments, anything for which people would not pay with cash but would use a check, would continue to be paid in the same way.

 

[Rune]

One is an idiot and the other hates paper money. Too fucking funny.

 

[Rune]

Your done because you know you cant win. The European banks didn't come to America and say hey! Let me lend you money backed by nothing(Just debt) and you can pay me back with 50% interest ok? That's a great idea!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Even funnier is your complete lack of understanding of compound interest.

Shut up you freaking moron.

 

[wiseones2cents]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Even funnier is your complete lack of understanding of compound interest.

Shut up you freaking moron.

Either, I'm a moron or you are. Try to keep up. I will go as slow as possible.

The federal reserve is composed of foreign investors who have REAL wealth(Not backed by debt). They lend that REAL wealth to America in Federal reserve notes with interest. I exaggerated the 50% interest.

I heard more modern figures as being less(like 6%) but either way, you are already in the hole as soon as you take FRN.

Anyways, when America had no more gold to pay, they set up a GDP system, where Americans could use the GDP as collateral to pay back the loans. The GDP guaranteed(for the most part) real wealth income. As long as they were able to pay the debt? The Fed would allow them to increase the debt. Therefore America's debt was backed by FED wealth. And of course as I explained the GDP.

Again the feds could exaggerate their holdings but up to a certain point.

 

[wiseones2cents]

One is an idiot and the other hates paper money. Too fucking funny.

Why don't you read my reply above and then look in the mirror and see who the true idiot is.