Bachmann: I'll bring back $2 gas

Electric cars cannot be used in places which experience below-zero, or even near-zero weather. Electric cars cannot be useful in low-population density states or rural areas which require longer distance driving. Imagine trying to run a Volt in NE Montana where there are places you travel 50-60 miles without even seeing a farmhouse from the highway, let alone someplace to recharge. And electric motors, as well as electrical storage, will need a MASSIVE breakthrough in basic theory before they can power anything larger than a mini-van, especially over long distances. Unfortunately, the larger majority of fuel used in the transport infrastructure is used in mass transport - trucks, cube vans, 18-wheelers, etc. We are not replacing that anytime in the near future, nor even far future unless some myopic superbrain finds an answer to the problem of a mobile source (battery) providing enough electrical power to large enough motors to drive a tractor-trailer hauling 25 tons of goods over 1000 miles. With out the needed breakthrough in theory that would allow us to build super-batteries that hold massive charges and don't lose efficiency with dropping temperatures, electric cars can be useful in cities in moderate climates, and that is about all they'll be good for. That leaves about 2/3 the U.S., plus the entire goods transportation industry, still dependent on IC engines.

In short, spending massive amounts of tax dollars on subsidizing the manufacture and sale of electric automobiles is a horrendously inefficient use of limited resources when the purpose is to significantly reduce our dependency on oil. We would be much better off investing in alternate fuels technology that can be used with little to no modification of current IC engines. The less we have to modify current infrastructure, the more likely we can achieve an economically viable alternative to petroleum. There are a number of very promising possibilities, such as algae derived fuels, which will take far less breakthrough of basic theory to bring about. And, of course, there are already several types of bio-diesel on the market as we speak. It will be far easier and far more cost efficient to tweak current diesel engines to operate better on bio-diesel, and encourage the production of bio-diesel fuels via tax breaks and such, than to subsidize off-market vehicles while hoping we can someday build a battery that will not lose power as its charge drains, AND can power a semi-truck with full cargo AND not lose power with changes in temperature, etc. etc. etc.
 
Has anybody asked her in a format where she had time to elaborate on this statement? I'd like to see her plan to get $2 gasoline...

Do you believe (like most of the pinheads here) that it's laughably impossible? I certainly don't, and I think she was dead serious. In fact, I bet it wouldn't be THAT hard to do, to be honest. Just the announcement that we are going to massively expand oil drilling and exploration, would cause a huge drop due to speculators. We might be able to get it to $2 without even putting the first drill in the ground.
 
Do you believe (like most of the pinheads here) that it's laughably impossible? I certainly don't, and I think she was dead serious. In fact, I bet it wouldn't be THAT hard to do, to be honest. Just the announcement that we are going to massively expand oil drilling and exploration, would cause a huge drop due to speculators. We might be able to get it to $2 without even putting the first drill in the ground.

No, Superfreak presented a realistic idea that would do it. I just wonder what her plan is.
 
Electric cars cannot be used in places which experience below-zero, or even near-zero weather. Electric cars cannot be useful in low-population density states or rural areas which require longer distance driving. Imagine trying to run a Volt in NE Montana where there are places you travel 50-60 miles without even seeing a farmhouse from the highway, let alone someplace to recharge. And electric motors, as well as electrical storage, will need a MASSIVE breakthrough in basic theory before they can power anything larger than a mini-van, especially over long distances. Unfortunately, the larger majority of fuel used in the transport infrastructure is used in mass transport - trucks, cube vans, 18-wheelers, etc. We are not replacing that anytime in the near future, nor even far future unless some myopic superbrain finds an answer to the problem of a mobile source (battery) providing enough electrical power to large enough motors to drive a tractor-trailer hauling 25 tons of goods over 1000 miles. With out the needed breakthrough in theory that would allow us to build super-batteries that hold massive charges and don't lose efficiency with dropping temperatures, electric cars can be useful in cities in moderate climates, and that is about all they'll be good for. That leaves about 2/3 the U.S., plus the entire goods transportation industry, still dependent on IC engines.

In short, spending massive amounts of tax dollars on subsidizing the manufacture and sale of electric automobiles is a horrendously inefficient use of limited resources when the purpose is to significantly reduce our dependency on oil. We would be much better off investing in alternate fuels technology that can be used with little to no modification of current IC engines. The less we have to modify current infrastructure, the more likely we can achieve an economically viable alternative to petroleum. There are a number of very promising possibilities, such as algae derived fuels, which will take far less breakthrough of basic theory to bring about. And, of course, there are already several types of bio-diesel on the market as we speak. It will be far easier and far more cost efficient to tweak current diesel engines to operate better on bio-diesel, and encourage the production of bio-diesel fuels via tax breaks and such, than to subsidize off-market vehicles while hoping we can someday build a battery that will not lose power as its charge drains, AND can power a semi-truck with full cargo AND not lose power with changes in temperature, etc. etc. etc.

No doubt Montana, one of the least populated states in the country would be a poor candidate for electric cars.

What about Florida and California, two warm states which hold almost 20% of the countrie's people?

The average american drives just 30 miles a day, so the Volt at 40 mile charge is sufficient for most people, especialy as it is an extended range vehicle anyway.

No one said tractor trailer trucks on 1000 mile runs are good or even potential candidates for electrification. Long distance trucks, however, are the reason that most cars should be electric, thereby leaving natural gas resources available for applications where electric is impossible or impracticle.

Fed Ex, Ups are already in the process of replacing 20,000 local delivery vehicles with electrics, an event which could only have occured due to subsidies.
Critizising alternative energy subsidies is quite hypocritical, considering the vast subsidies enjoyed by fossil fuel producers so this entire part of your rant is empty and meaningless.
 
No, Superfreak presented a realistic idea that would do it. I just wonder what her plan is.

Superfreak's plan may be realistic, except for his time frame, which makes it unrealistic. Oil compainies presently hold plenty of leases in area's of known reserves, that they do not drill.

How are you going to force them to perform costly exploration and drilling in currently un-licensed, unexplored areas?
 
No doubt Montana, one of the least populated states in the country would be a poor candidate for electric cars.

What about Florida and California, two warm states which hold almost 20% of the countrie's people?

The average american drives just 30 miles a day, so the Volt at 40 mile charge is sufficient for most people, especialy as it is an extended range vehicle anyway.

No one said tractor trailer trucks on 1000 mile runs are good or even potential candidates for electrification. Long distance trucks, however, are the reason that most cars should be electric, thereby leaving natural gas resources available for applications where electric is impossible or impracticle.

Fed Ex, Ups are already in the process of replacing 20,000 local delivery vehicles with electrics, an event which could only have occured due to subsidies.
Critizising alternative energy subsidies is quite hypocritical, considering the vast subsidies enjoyed by fossil fuel producers so this entire part of your rant is empty and meaningless.
One: where have you EVER seen me support subsidies for petroleum fuels? So shove your "hypocrisy" straight up that anal canal you call a mouth.

Two: the idea is to spend our tax money as efficiently as possible on systems which can lead to real, economically (ie: won't need subsidies forever) long term alternate energy sources. Yea, it's great that California and Florida cities can reap the benefits of electric cars, as well as other southern cities. More power to you. That still does nothing for rural CA, rural FL, and other southern areas, nor does it do squat for northern climes, including cities, that experience cold weather a significant portion of the year. Now, explain why I should support my taxes going to a solution which leaves 2/3 of the nation out of the benefit?

We need solutions which can be applies everywhere, not just a select few areas. Considering a 14+ trillion dollar and growing national debt, we need to spend tax dollars wisely when using them to reduce dependence on petroleum fuels. A huge factor in efficiency is finding solutions which require the least change in infrastructure. That leaves electrification out, because too much infrastructure needs to change to support it. A second huge factor in efficiency is the amount of pure research needed to bring about the changes. Electric cars are simply too limited in their application, and needs too much new science to apply in a broad manner to be an efficient solution to spend tax money on. Development of bio-fuels would be FAR more efficient manner to spend our tax money because it requires far less changes to the existing infrastructure AND needs the least amount of research and development to apply in a broad, cross-the-board solution to getting off the petroleum teat.
 
Superfreak's plan may be realistic, except for his time frame, which makes it unrealistic. Oil compainies presently hold plenty of leases in area's of known reserves, that they do not drill.

How are you going to force them to perform costly exploration and drilling in currently un-licensed, unexplored areas?

1) No one is suggesting we force drilling in areas that are not economically viable to do so

2) Many of those leases the left likes to point to are just that... sites that are not currently economically viable or the leases are attached to sites that are economically viable and tied together

3) When is the last time we did in depth geological surveys of the coastal regions in CA, FL and the Gulf?

4) We have plenty of sites that we COULD be opening up that the oil and nat gas companies WANT us to open up but are currently denied due to bureaucratic crap. The time line is not to have that oil and nat gas on line. The three year (or four) year window I have mentioned is for the conversion of vehicles to nat gas, the addition of nat gas pumps at gas stations, the production of nat gas vehicles by the auto makers.... all of which are feasible. The opening of the new sites for nat gas and oil are to demonstrate a new supply coming on line in the future. Couple that with the reduction in demand and oil futures will sink rapidly.
 
We need solutions which can be applies everywhere, not just a select few areas. Considering a 14+ trillion dollar and growing national debt, we need to spend tax dollars wisely when using them to reduce dependence on petroleum fuels. A huge factor in efficiency is finding solutions which require the least change in infrastructure. That leaves electrification out, because too much infrastructure needs to change to support it. A second huge factor in efficiency is the amount of pure research needed to bring about the changes. Electric cars are simply too limited in their application, and needs too much new science to apply in a broad manner to be an efficient solution to spend tax money on. Development of bio-fuels would be FAR more efficient manner to spend our tax money because it requires far less changes to the existing infrastructure AND needs the least amount of research and development to apply in a broad, cross-the-board solution to getting off the petroleum teat.

We need EVERY solution, in combination to dis-entagle ourselves from foriegn oil. We can hardly afford to discard anything which works.

Electric cars work. They do not fit everywhere or every person.

Infrastructure is sufficient for electric cars for now, as proven by links I posted earlier.

Perfect is the enemy of good enough. Holding out for the perfect, one size fits all solution benefits none but the oil companies.
 
oh no, the obsessive whiner is on a groan spazz....over 15 so far in a couple of minutes....but dune claims to only groan tit for tat....

:cof1:

keep it up little dune, let's see your temper tantrums, they are funnier than your hissy fits

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