Alternative Energy is for Pinheads!

D

Dixie - In Memoriam

New member
Let me qualify that statement, I am all for alternative forms of energy, renewable energy, energy efficiency, energy conservation... all great ideas! I support any and all private sector exploration into any alternative form of energy, and I even support the government supporting something viable being researched or put into place, when that time comes.

The problem I have with the Alt Energy debate, it seems to supplant the concept of drilling for more domestic oil. Pinheads want to scream and moan about drilling, while holding up this idea of alternative energy instead. Even some moderate pinheads will clamor for a "Moon Shot" initiative, where we convert by the end of the decade or bust... but the thing is, with the mission to the moon, we had a moon to go on a mission to! Here, we have nothing... oh, we have 50-gazillion cockamamie ideas for what we COULD do, or what MIGHT be possible, but we don't have a clearly defined goal or objective... we have no moon to go to yet!

How dumb would it have been for Kennedy to say, we are committed to shoot three men into space and see if they can find a place to land before the decade is out? Before we can ever have some Grand Initiative to switch us over to an alternative fuel, we have to have the fuel! There has to be a consensus on what fuel we are going with. We can't have some hodgepodge of various ideas floating around, and expect one of them to just emerge as the standard. This kind of thing takes decades to sort out... we don't have decades!

The only answer for meeting our needs short-term as well as long term, is to increase domestic oil production. If some "moon" is discovered in the future, we can discuss a mission within the decade... until that happens, we need to increase drilling and production of domestic sources of energy.
 
Dixie said:
Let me qualify that statement, I am all for alternative forms of energy, renewable energy, energy efficiency, energy conservation... all great ideas! I support any and all private sector exploration into any alternative form of energy, and I even support the government supporting something viable being researched or put into place, when that time comes.

The problem I have with the Alt Energy debate, it seems to supplant the concept of drilling for more domestic oil. Pinheads want to scream and moan about drilling, while holding up this idea of alternative energy instead. Even some moderate pinheads will clamor for a "Moon Shot" initiative, where we convert by the end of the decade or bust... but the thing is, with the mission to the moon, we had a moon to go on a mission to! Here, we have nothing... oh, we have 50-gazillion cockamamie ideas for what we COULD do, or what MIGHT be possible, but we don't have a clearly defined goal or objective... we have no moon to go to yet!

How dumb would it have been for Kennedy to say, we are committed to shoot three men into space and see if they can find a place to land before the decade is out? Before we can ever have some Grand Initiative to switch us over to an alternative fuel, we have to have the fuel! There has to be a consensus on what fuel we are going with. We can't have some hodgepodge of various ideas floating around, and expect one of them to just emerge as the standard. This kind of thing takes decades to sort out... we don't have decades!

The only answer for meeting our needs short-term as well as long term, is to increase domestic oil production. If some "moon" is discovered in the future, we can discuss a mission within the decade... until that happens, we need to increase drilling and production of domestic sources of energy.
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There is no whitehaired old man in the sky but you believe there is one. So I don't see your problem.
 
LowIQ said:
There is no whitehaired old man in the sky but you believe there is one. So I don't see your problem.
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John Glenn came back to Earth, so... no whitehaired old men are currently in the sky, as far as I know. I don't know what that had to do with Alt Energy, or domestic drilling, but I'm sure it made total sense to you.
 
Beck, came back to Earth? Well, then he has been relaunched because he is still "out there" and if you think he has come down, then I am worried about you!
 
I see that your confusion could indeed take decades to sort out, likely longer. Fortunately though, you are not in charge, just some nut on one of the larger branches of the nut tree.

FYI; solar energy strikes the earth with an average (worldwide) density of 1 KW/square meter. Currently we can capture and utilize about 20% of that energy. With a shoot for the moon or Manhatten Project scale effort, we could perhaps achieve 30%. If I have to explain the benefit of this to you, you would not comprehend it.
 
Dune said:
I see that your confusion could indeed take decades to sort out, likely longer. Fortunately though, you are not in charge, just some nut on one of the larger branches of the nut tree.

FYI; solar energy strikes the earth with an average (worldwide) density of 1 KW/square meter. Currently we can capture and utilize about 20% of that energy. With a shoot for the moon or Manhatten Project scale effort, we could perhaps achieve 30%. If I have to explain the benefit of this to you, you would not comprehend it.
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Sorry, I haven't heard of this consensus plan to convert us from oil to solar power.... How large would a car have to be, in order to accommodate the solar panels required to power it? ....The size of Manhattan, perhaps?
 
This is why it is good that you are not in charge. Batteries! Electric cars run on batteries, which can be charged with solar power.
 
Dune said:
This is why it is good that you are not in charge. Batteries! Electric cars run on batteries, which can be charged with solar power.
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Okay Mr. Wizard.... How many solar panels will it take to charge the batteries of all these cars?
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la-rush-hour.jpg
 
Dixie said:
Sorry, I haven't heard of this consensus plan to convert us from oil to solar power.... How large would a car have to be, in order to accommodate the solar panels required to power it? ....The size of Manhattan, perhaps?
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Kind of typical of you to be so dismissive & focus on technology as it is today.

Advancement in fields like tech is exponential; there is stuff out there that people haven't even dreamed of yet, but could be reality much more quickly than you ever think it could.

With your line of reasoning, no revolutionary advancements in history would have really be possible....
 
Onceler said:
Kind of typical of you to be so dismissive & focus on technology as it is today.

Advancement in fields like tech is exponential; there is stuff out there that people haven't even dreamed of yet, but could be reality much more quickly than you ever think it could.

With your line of reasoning, no revolutionary advancements in history would have really be possible....
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My line of reasoning is, none of this shit is going to replace oil-based fuels anytime soon, probably not something our KIDS or even going to see. You are dreaming if you think otherwise. Fossil fuels are so rooted and ingrained into our system, it would take decades to replace, and that's IF you had something already out there, viable and ready to go.... which we DON'T! We have 5-gazillion cockamamie ideas.... like SOLAR POWER.... There is no consensus on WHAT the fuel of the future will be, and we have to first know and establish that, before we can replace fossil fuels. I'm all for technology! As I said in the OP, I wholeheartedly want the private sector to explore all the possibilities and do all the research they like, and I'll even pitch in some tax revenues to sweeten the pot for a really good idea or two... but this idiotic idea that we can't drill for domestic oil because we need to convert to alternative fuels, is just plain stupid. It's like Kennedy promising to shoot men off into space to explore new celestial bodies! Without the moon, the Moon Shot would have been a really STUPID idea!
 
Dixie said:
Sorry, I haven't heard of this consensus plan to convert us from oil to solar power.... How large would a car have to be, in order to accommodate the solar panels required to power it? ....The size of Manhattan, perhaps?
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Ah yes, but just think how many tighty righties you could drive over a cliff in a car that size.
 
"We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win"
President John F. Kennedy

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We will eventually need alt energy!!! For pinheads to act like the moonshot moment is now is the height of uneducated pissing in the wind mentality.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
dude, that "one" is hardly enough.....the article says that it's intended to produce 500MW (actually BFGN's article pegs it at under 400) so that's maybe enough for a hundred thousand cars......
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The great French Marshall Lyautey once asked his gardener to plant a tree. The gardener objected that the tree was slow growing and would not reach maturity for 100 years. The Marshall replied, 'In that case, there is no time to lose; plant it this afternoon!'
President John F. Kennedy

brightsource.jpg

About Us

The company is actively developing more than 4GW of solar power projects in Southwestern states – enough to power 1.4 million homes. BrightSource now has more than 2.6 gigawatts of power under contract, including the two largest solar power agreements ever – 1,300 megawatts with Southern California Edison and 1,310 megawatts with Pacific Gas & Electric Company. The company’s Solar Energy Development Center in Israel’s Negev Desert is demonstrating BrightSource’s LPT 550 technology and producing the world’s highest temperature and pressure solar thermal steam.
http://www.brightsourceenergy.com/about_us

According to the ancient Chinese proverb, "A journey of a thousand miles must begin with a single step."
President John F. Kennedy
 
Dixie said:
My line of reasoning is, none of this shit is going to replace oil-based fuels anytime soon, probably not something our KIDS or even going to see. You are dreaming if you think otherwise. Fossil fuels are so rooted and ingrained into our system, it would take decades to replace, and that's IF you had something already out there, viable and ready to go.... which we DON'T! We have 5-gazillion cockamamie ideas.... like SOLAR POWER.... There is no consensus on WHAT the fuel of the future will be, and we have to first know and establish that, before we can replace fossil fuels. I'm all for technology! As I said in the OP, I wholeheartedly want the private sector to explore all the possibilities and do all the research they like, and I'll even pitch in some tax revenues to sweeten the pot for a really good idea or two... but this idiotic idea that we can't drill for domestic oil because we need to convert to alternative fuels, is just plain stupid. It's like Kennedy promising to shoot men off into space to explore new celestial bodies! Without the moon, the Moon Shot would have been a really STUPID idea!
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You're such a visionary. Such confidence in the American "can do" spirit....
 
PostmodernProphet said:
we should be drilling domestic oil while they're dreaming.....
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Certainly keep drilling, but is there something wrong with, as you so quaintly put it, covering all your bases? Energy conservation, alternative fuels, etc. were not suddenly dreamed up by people you so misguidedly and incorrectly call Liberals. Many of the ideas came from inventors and entrepreneurs and scientists, some working in their own back yards, as it were.
It is only comparatively recently that party politics has become a tool with which to beat your most creative people.
It's another example of the naivete of many Americans, that they can only think in terms of black and white, good or bad, us and them. It is very immature and it seems to me, from the position of an observer, that while your right wing are the most vociferous against good sense, your left wing must also shoulder some of the blame.
I just wonder for how many years you will be narrowing your sights, how many more years will antagonism and beligerence rule American life?
It is not natural and it eats away at some of you like a cancer. It drags you back and it keeps you back.
 
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