Those poor Milwaukee teachers

[zappasguitar]

I was paraphrasing you dolt. No extra money would be coming out of his pocket. As I pointed out to him. The childs funds that are paid by the Fed simply go to another school. As I pointed out to him.

He was bitching about having to 'pay for someone else's kid'.... which is why I spun it back on him in the manner I did. It is really amusing that I have to explain this to you so many times.

All the voucher does is change WHO the fed pays the money to. It does not alter how much we pay in taxes one bit. Period.



Again... it was in response to his saying the same fucking thing. He didn't want to pay for other people's kids. Is that really so difficult for you to comprehend?

Ohhh...so now, heavily editing someone's comments so they appear to be saying something else entirely and can be taken completely out of context is now being referred to as "paraphrasing" is it?

Alrightie then...

As for your comment that all a voucher does is changes WHO gets the money from the Government...I agree...a voucher TAKES money from our public school system and gives it to some RICH KIDS PARENTS so they don't have to fire their housekeeper and sell their vacation home in Aspen in order to pay for him attending some overpriced snobatorium for the rich.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Ohhh...so now, heavily editing someone's comments so they appear to be saying something else entirely and can be taken completely out of context is now being referred to as "paraphrasing" is it?

In the original post I quoted him directly and responded in kind. The fact that you are too brain dead to comprehend it, is on you. As for the paraphrase, only an idiot thinks that is somehow taking something out of context.

As for your comment that all a voucher does is changes WHO gets the money from the Government...I agree...a voucher TAKES money from our public school system and gives it to some RICH KIDS PARENTS so they don't have to fire their housekeeper and sell their vacation home in Aspen in order to pay for him attending some overpriced snobatorium for the rich.

No moron.... it tells the parents their money goes to the school that provides the child the best opportunity.

If the public school has competition from a private/charter school, they either will be forced to IMPROVE to the level where people CHOOSE them... OR THEY GO OUT OF BUSINESS.

In your moronic world, you would simply continue letting failed schools fail because you don't want the poor kids to have a shot at a good education if it means the wealthy also get to have their money spent wisely.

Also... just a side note... in your example above... do you think the housekeeper and her/his family are happy they didn't lose their job???

 

[cawacko]

Ohhh...so now, heavily editing someone's comments so they appear to be saying something else entirely and can be taken completely out of context is now being referred to as "paraphrasing" is it?

Alrightie then...

As for your comment that all a voucher does is changes WHO gets the money from the Government...I agree...a voucher TAKES money from our public school system and gives it to some RICH KIDS PARENTS so they don't have to fire their housekeeper and sell their vacation home in Aspen in order to pay for him attending some overpriced snobatorium for the rich.

Being against vouchers is one thing but it seems you are purposefully trying to misrepresent who they are intended to benefit. They are NOT set up to be given to rich parents. They ARE used for poor kids stuck in failing schools who do not have the option of moving to a better neighborhood or paying for a private school. These are the exact kids that those who are most 'compassionate' claim to want to help the most.

 

[zappasguitar]

Being against vouchers is one thing but it seems you are purposefully trying to misrepresent who they are intended to benefit. They are NOT set up to be given to rich parents. They ARE used for poor kids stuck in failing schools who do not have the option of moving to a better neighborhood or paying for a private school. These are the exact kids that those who are most 'compassionate' claim to want to help the most.

Alright...let's say vouchers do become available for the poor, do you really expect the wealthy to just sit back and continue to pay out of pocket to send their kids to private school while the poor enjoy "special privileges"?

Do you not think the wealthy will raise a stink over "discrimination" they are forced to suffer?

Because that's exactly what I see happening...

So...if you can guarantee that vouchers will be exclusively issued to the children of the poorest families first, and that no lawsuits will be brought forth by whining rich people, then I am on board with vouchers...

 

[Phantasmal]

Alright...let's say vouchers do become available for the poor, do you really expect the wealthy to just sit back and continue to pay out of pocket to send their kids to private school while the poor enjoy "special privileges"?

Do you not think the wealthy will raise a stink over "discrimination" they are forced to suffer?

Because that's exactly what I see happening...

So...if you can guarantee that vouchers will be exclusively issued to the children of the poorest families first, and that no lawsuits will be brought forth by whining rich people, then I am on board with vouchers...

Do you think the rich will let the poor into their schools? The handicapped? The mentally ill?

Ahahahahaha, yeah, vouchers will really equal the playing field!

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Being against vouchers is one thing but it seems you are purposefully trying to misrepresent who they are intended to benefit. They are NOT set up to be given to rich parents. They ARE used for poor kids stuck in failing schools who do not have the option of moving to a better neighborhood or paying for a private school. These are the exact kids that those who are most 'compassionate' claim to want to help the most.

Well that's nice in theory but in practice it doesn't work and it never has. What happens in reality is the well to do get discounted tuition rates thanks to vouchers while only a handful of carefully chosen high performing poor students get selected to attend these schools since vouchers alone cannot cover the whole cost of attending a private school. Mean while the poor kids are still stuck in their under achieving public schools which would then be in even worse shape having lost much needed funding to Private schools. It aint like this hasn't been tried before. Why do you think opposition to vouchers is so strong? Cause we all ready have a historical record of what would happen.

 

[zappasguitar]

In the original post I quoted him directly and responded in kind. The fact that you are too brain dead to comprehend it, is on you. As for the paraphrase, only an idiot thinks that is somehow taking something out of context.



No moron.... it tells the parents their money goes to the school that provides the child the best opportunity.

If the public school has competition from a private/charter school, they either will be forced to IMPROVE to the level where people CHOOSE them... OR THEY GO OUT OF BUSINESS.

In your moronic world, you would simply continue letting failed schools fail because you don't want the poor kids to have a shot at a good education if it means the wealthy also get to have their money spent wisely.

Also... just a side note... in your example above... do you think the housekeeper and her/his family are happy they didn't lose their job???

I really don't know why I bother...when you aren't even capable of admitting you sliced and diced what Mott wrote in order to make your point, you certainly aren't going to be able to admit you were wrong about anything of substance...

So...you want to tell me what planet you are from? Because here on Earth... public schools are already in competition with private/charter schools.

There's nearly 100 private/charter schools here in Houston ALONE...so please try and keep the discussion based in the REAL world and not your imaginary conservatard fantasy land.

 

[Phantasmal]

Well that's nice in theory but in practice it doesn't work and it never has. What happens in reality is the well to do get discounted tuition rates thanks to vouchers while only a handful of carefully chosen high performing poor students get selected to attend these schools since vouchers alone cannot cover the whole cost of attending a private school. Mean while the poor kids are still stuck in their under achieving public schools which would then be in even worse shape having lost much needed funding to Private schools. It aint like this hasn't been tried before. Why do you think opposition to vouchers is so strong? Cause we all ready have a historical record of what would happen.

They will let the poor into their schools, sure they will! Come on, Mott, you know how they don't look down on the ghetto types!

 

[Mott the Hoople]

They will let the poor into their schools, sure they will! Come on, Mott, you know how they don't look down on the ghetto types!

You just have to look at the history of busing and forced integration to see what would happen. This is what created the voucher movement in the first place as a back door attempt to get around enforcement of the Brown vs. The Board of Education ruling by SCOTUS in the south. Southernors tried to get around integration by converting public schools to private schools and using publicly financed vouchers to fund these quasi private schools. The end result was devastating to the public schools systems in those southern states.

 

[cawacko]

Well that's nice in theory but in practice it doesn't work and it never has. What happens in reality is the well to do get discounted tuition rates thanks to vouchers while only a handful of carefully chosen high performing poor students get selected to attend these schools since vouchers alone cannot cover the whole cost of attending a private school. Mean while the poor kids are still stuck in their under achieving public schools which would then be in even worse shape having lost much needed funding to Private schools. It aint like this hasn't been tried before. Why do you think opposition to vouchers is so strong? Cause we all ready have a historical record of what would happen.

Many states use vouchers now. Any examples of this happening?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You just have to look at the history of busing and forced integration to see what would happen. This is what created the voucher movement in the first place as a back door attempt to get around enforcement of the Brown vs. The Board of Education ruling by SCOTUS in the south. Southernors tried to get around integration by converting public schools to private schools and using publicly financed vouchers to fund these quasi private schools. The end result was devastating to the public schools systems in those southern states.

The above is absurd. Milwaukee has used vouchers for almost two decades. None of the bullshit you are spouting off has occurred. NONE.

You are simply spouting hateful fear mongering rhetoric.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

They will let the poor into their schools, sure they will! Come on, Mott, you know how they don't look down on the ghetto types!

Yes, they will. Look to Milwaukee and Harlem for prime examples.

The only ones looking 'down' on the 'ghetto types' are you and Mott who don't want the inner city kids to have access to vouchers. So you pretend that these systems aren't already in place and aren't already working.

If these were so bad for the poor, why do places like DC have to have lotteries to determine which parents get to use them? Are you suggesting the poor people simply don't know what is best for themselves and their kids? Or do YOU just KNOW better?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Many states use vouchers now. Any examples of this happening?

You really expect him to let facts and real life get in the way of his fantasy world hateful vitriolic rhetoric?

 

[Phantasmal]

You really expect him to let facts and real life get in the way of his fantasy world hateful vitriolic rhetoric?

You don't let facts get in the way of yours! why do expect it of us?

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Alright...let's say vouchers do become available for the poor, do you really expect the wealthy to just sit back and continue to pay out of pocket to send their kids to private school while the poor enjoy "special privileges"?

Do you not think the wealthy will raise a stink over "discrimination" they are forced to suffer?

Because that's exactly what I see happening...

So...if you can guarantee that vouchers will be exclusively issued to the children of the poorest families first, and that no lawsuits will be brought forth by whining rich people, then I am on board with vouchers...

1) Vouchers ALREADY are available to the poor you twit. They have been in use for decades.

2) The wealthy already sit back and watch as the poor enjoy 'special privileges'

3) Given that they have not raised a stink... NO, I don't think they will suddenly start doing so.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You don't let facts get in the way of yours! why do expect it of us?

what facts are those Rana? Do provide me with some examples.

 

[Phantasmal]

what facts are those Rana? Do provide me with some examples.

Oh, just most of those opinions of yours your pass as fact.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Many states use vouchers now. Any examples of this happening?

I wouldn't call 6 "many". As of 2005 only 6 States have tried voucher systems of which all of them I believe, except Wisconsin, have been been rejected by federal courts for violating The Seperation Clause. Many states have Charter schools but that's not the same as vouchers. I know Ohio was one of the 6 states to legalize vouchers (in the Clevelan area) but that was struck down by a Federal Court for violationg the Seperation Clause. The Wisconsin voucher system has been heavily criticized and scrutinized because it's per capita (that is "per student") cost exceeds those spent on public school students.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Well that's nice in theory but in practice it doesn't work and it never has.

Wrong. It works. It has worked in Milwaukee, DC, Harlem etc....

What happens in reality is the well to do get discounted tuition rates thanks to vouchers while only a handful of carefully chosen high performing poor students get selected to attend these schools since vouchers alone cannot cover the whole cost of attending a private school.

Wrong again. Most areas that have limited numbers of openings in the private and charter schools have a lottery system to get in.

Mean while the poor kids are still stuck in their under achieving public schools which would then be in even worse shape having lost much needed funding to Private schools. It aint like this hasn't been tried before. Why do you think opposition to vouchers is so strong? Cause we all ready have a historical record of what would happen.

ROFLMAO... so your solution is to make ALL of the poor kids remain stuck in under achieving public schools?

The only opposition to the voucher programs that is 'strong' comes directly from the teachers union.

 

[zappasguitar]

1) Vouchers ALREADY are available to the poor you twit. They have been in use for decades.

2) The wealthy already sit back and watch as the poor enjoy 'special privileges'

3) Given that they have not raised a stink... NO, I don't think they will suddenly start doing so.

So then what's the fuss all about?

If vouchers are available, then public schools are already seeing the competition you previously claimed they aren't getting.