Should the 45% of Americans who self ID as political Independents be able to vote in party primaries?

[Jake Starkey]

And thus began our national nightmare. The Republicans nominated one of the worst humans alive. The Democrats got him elected. Twice.

By nominating the second worst Dem candidate in history in 2016 and screwed up their candidate in 2024.

All of that with MAGA cheating in all three elections.

 

[Jake Starkey]

Then we simply disagree--strongly.
I don't recognize your right to interfere my MY party.
You've done nothing to earn it.
I've been loyal and supportive since registering in 1967.

You have no such right to be left alone, period.

 

[Diesel]

By nominating the second worst Dem candidate in history in 2016 and screwed up their candidate in 2024.

All of that with MAGA cheating in all three elections.

I've always said that nobody beats the Democrats better than the Democrats. Both parties are owned by Big Money. The politicians are figureheads. Nifty will be disappointed to hear that in Colorado, I can vote in primaries. A person can only vote in one or the other primary, but we don't have to be registered with either party. I voted for Buttigieg in 2016. Of course, the Democrats didn't let us vote in 2020. In both elections, they got what they deserved. And fucked every single American in the process.

 

[Jake Starkey]

 

[QP!]

You have no "leave me alone" rights on politics and voting when such affects all of us.

What an EPA you are.

@NiftyNiblick is heavily invested in the current two party system as is and does not want the growing Independent block, who want to change the system, to succeed.

And that is fine. He can fight to keep the status quo and to try and force us to pick a party and join in to have any real say.

Where i feel he crosses a line is he seems to think it is wrong for us to try and change them in this way and it is not, even if it is not what he wants.

As Independents start to greatly out number party affiliation people with a message 'the current system is not working for us', simply demanding they comply to the current system and join it will not work.

 

[QP!]

By nominating the second worst Dem candidate in history in 2016 and screwed up their candidate in 2024.

All of that with MAGA cheating in all three elections.

Ya I think Biden beats Trump in 2016, if Obama backed his VP. Even Bernie may have beat him in 2016. Biden then gets two terms and Trump is out and the Dems have a good chance again after him.

 

[Diesel]

View attachment 71173

What is?

 

[NiftyNiblick]

@NiftyNiblick is heavily invested in the current two party system as is and does not want the growing Independent block, who want to change the system, to succeed.

And that is fine. He can fight to keep the status quo and to try and force us to pick a party and join in to have any real say.

Where i feel he crosses a line is he seems to think it is wrong for us to try and change them in this way and it is not, even if it is not what he wants.

As Independents start to greatly out number party affiliation people with a message 'the current system is not working for us', simply demanding they comply to the current system and join it will not work.

Try to change the system as much as you want.
Just don't interfere in the matters of established parties to which you have not personally committed.

We've contributed money to them.
We've worked on their campaigns.
We're entitled to nominate our own candidates without your interference.

Support independent candidates or new parties of your own creation.
You've not earned the right to participate in our nominations
with either your work or your money.

Why would you even think that you have?

 

[QP!]

Try to change the system as much as you want.
Just don't interfere in the matters of established parties to which you have not personally committed.

We've contributed money to them.
We've worked on their campaigns.
We're entitled to nominate our own candidates without your interference.

Support independent candidates or new parties of your own creation.
You've not earned the right to participate in our nominations
with either your work or your money.

Why would you even think that you have?

"...Just don't interfere in the matters of established parties to which you have not personally committed...."

We will interfere as much as the rules allow us to. We want to interfere as the parties will not change without that interference.

You do not get to dictate how these primaries will work nor do it. It will be decided by the powers who be based on several different citizen and special interest pressures.


I think you would see it as silly if i told you 'just do not try and keep the established parties are they are' because that is my view in contrast to yours. I think you would tell me you are going to continue to fight to maintain the status quo in the existing parties and it is silly for me to try and tell you what to do.

Similarly it is silly for you to try and tell me. If my vote and voice along with others in a massive Independent voting block, can influence the powers that be to change the current systems no amount of Nifty trying to tell us not to do (because Nifty supports it as is) will change our efforts.