Hi all

Scott said:
I see. Might you be joking? Speaking as someone who's been accused of being a sock myself despite the fact that I have none, I for one don't see why he has to be anyone's sock.
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I did a sock search last month and your name popped up. What surprised me was the group of names that came up with yours. Socks don't usually bother me but I was a little hurt to see which group you are in.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Yeah, ButtYurt/goat always blames Phantasmal no matter who actually did whatever he's whining about. Damo locked those old flame war discussions because ButtYurt/goat was going back literally years and digging them up because of his obsession with me. Damo also put a forced ignore on him at my request right after the forum changd software platforms. He had put one on the whining old biddy prior to that, as well, due to his stalking and disruption of discussions. But it's always Phan's fault, always. Like most psychologically-damaged MAGAT losers, goat takes no responsibility for his own actions. It's always someone else's fault. Remember when he pissed Damo off to the point where Damo closed Toxic's Deranged thread? Wasn't goat's fault.

All we need to know about goat's credibility is the fact that he thinks 9/11 was a Mossad/Israeli job. :laugh:
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:magagrin:
 
Scott said:
I agree that the U.S. constitution is generally pretty good. Based on what I've read over the years, I think it could use some improvements in some areas (electoral college comes to mind), but generally speaking, pretty good. The problem in my view is that some of its good things have been subverted to suit various political agendas that aren't good for the population as a whole.



I agree to some extent, but let's remember that there are generally -2- ways that the U.S. and I believe most other governments finance themselves. One is, ofcourse, through taxes. The other is through expansion of the country's debt. The third, that isn't used so often, is tariffs, but from what I've read, the primary funder of the U.S. government is still increasing its debt load, even now with all the tariffs. This is a problem- it's like increasing your credit card limit to the point that just paying the interest payments becomes too much. A short term solution to this, ofcourse, is to just increase the debt even more, just to finance the interest payments, but you can only go down this path so far before you start getting runaway inflation. I think the main solution here is to take money creation away from banks and put it firmly in the hands of government- the government naturally wouldn't have to pay interest payments on money it owes itself. I'm not saying that runaway inflation can't happen if the government creates its own money exclusively, just that it's easier to avoid inflation if you don't have to pay interest on debts.



That sounds reasonable, though I'd need examples to be sure I agree in all cases you might think of.



I actually debated the subject of trans people quite a bit in another forum for a while before I tired of it. I think the easiest solution to trans issues in general is to create at least some co-ed places. If there's enough money, there could still be exclusively male and female locker rooms/washrooms etc., but if not, just make the locker rooms/washrooms co-ed. This clearly requires some redesigning, such as going what I'd call the female washroom way- that is, all stalls are private. As to the definition of a woman, I think the UK courts did a good job of that recently- biological sex is in almost all cases pretty easy to determine. Gender is where it gets complicated. I'm fine with people identifying as whatever gender they like, so long as they don't try to do the same with biological sex.



I definitely find immigration to be another thorny issue. My father was born and raised in Mexico, though he never had any problems with immigration as far as I know, because he married my Canadian mother before immigrating to Canada. 4 children and around 25 years later, they divorced, but by that time he'd become a Canadian citizen. Ironically, soon after he obtained his citizenship, he decided to return to Mexico, which is where he still lives today. About 3 1/2 years ago, I decided to join him. Ironically, some time after my parents got divorced, my mother decided to immigrate to Mexico as well, just a different state in Mexico, and so did my siblings, so now we're all living in Mexico.

As to unauthorized immigration, that's where things get quite complicated. I think it's only natural for people who have few resources to want to find a place where they can earn a living. I also understand that many Americans aren't exactly rich either. What I think is happening is something akin to the hunger games books and films. Anyway, I'll leave this subject with the trailer of a film that definitely pulled on my heart strings:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jCZgUiPixE




I seem to be able to navigate between the left and the right. Sometimes with difficulty, but I seem to manage. As I said, I think it helps that on some positions, I side with the right and on others, I side with the left. And I've also made a thread in this very sub forum advocating for civility. So here's to hoping I can still have civilized conversations here with some people at least. It's definitely the reason I come here :-)
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There's a lot here and definitely much disagreement. I'm not sure you listed any real examples of agreeing with the right, but if you think you do, that's your call. My point is, most of your party isn't up for debate anymore. If you actually agree with the right on something, you're out in the woods with no one to back you up. That's not a dig, just a sad truth.

Like I said, your positions scream Democrat, a party that's lost its grip on reality. I predict they'll keep pushing away supporters unless someone with common sense, broad appeal, and enough guts to call out the craziness of the new faces running the show steps up. They need to lay out a vision that's not straight-up communism, one that leads with ideas different from Republicans but still respects the Constitution and aligns with what most of their voters want.

Again, a healthy two-party system matters. Right now, the Democrats are so far gone and corrupt, if they got power, they'd rig the game to never lose again, turning us into another communist disaster like every other time it's been tried. If you think your party's still capable of real debate, you're being naive. Just keeping it real.

Not long ago, if you asked any Democrat if they loved this country, supported the Constitution, and backed free-market capitalism, you'd get a firm yes every time. That's what being part of a country means. You support it, love it enough to fight for it, and work to improve it, not tear it down, condemn it, or try to transform it instead of reform it.

Your mention of the Electoral College shows where you're at on understanding our system of government. It's either ignorance or worse. If you know what scrapping the Electoral College would do to our system and still want to change it, you're in the wrong country, try France. Good thing it's hard to change by design. Our founders knew people like you would come along, sore losers blaming the Electoral College for their losses, trying to convince folks to ditch it. Your idea isn't new. It's a tired argument born from ignorance or bad intentions.

It's great you think you can bridge the left and right but saying it doesn't make it true. Give me one example of something Trump has done that you agree with. No buts, ifs, or almost. He's done plenty most sane Americans can get behind. Let's start there, and please spare me the anecdotal stories, I know it's a favorite 'debate' technique of the left, but it's not productive, it's almost always a waste of time that deflects from the actual argument thinking that some real or made-up story about the exceptions or the expectational should drive the debate. Just to be clear, I or nobody I know is against immigration, it's illegal immigration we are against, something I'm really get sick of, morons or straight up liars conflate the two, usually intentionally, knowing they're very different.

And let's move away from your dream of turning our representative republic into a democracy, which would gut the core of our brilliant system. Bring it down to something smaller, like no men in women's sports. That's an 80/20 issue Democrats ignore their voters on, pushing this insanity. Can you say you agree with Republicans on this and think Democrats have lost their minds?

I suspect you can't, but if you do, you will further alienate yourself from your current mess of a party and will get no quarter here from your compadres, which is my whole point. Your party is brain dead and spiraling into disaster, at least in the short term.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
He did leave some years ago and was gone for at least a couple more years. Then he returned as "goat," pretending to be a newbie. Yet like most socks, he gravitated right to the exact same ppl he was obsessed with during his prior tensure. He also rejoined the same Gossip Grrls Gang he belonged to in his prior incarnation as YaYa/Yurt aka ButtYurt. lol
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Well, he hasn't denied what you've said, so I'll keep it in mind as a possibility. Since I never knew YaYa/Yurt, I've only known him as goat. I've agreed with goat on some things, disagreed with him on others. I think the same is true for most if not all of the posters in this forum :-p. As to goat personally, he seems to refrain from insulting too much, which I definitely consider to be a plus.
 
Tobytone said:
Scott said:
I agree that the U.S. constitution is generally pretty good. Based on what I've read over the years, I think it could use some improvements in some areas (electoral college comes to mind), but generally speaking, pretty good. The problem in my view is that some of its good things have been subverted to suit various political agendas that aren't good for the population as a whole...
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There's a lot here and definitely much disagreement. I'm not sure you listed any real examples of agreeing with the right, but if you think you do, that's your call.
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I didn't mention any of my right leaning in the post you're responding to, I did that in a previous post. Right leaning is in orange:
Scott said:
In fairness, I'm a bit of a political hybrid- so while I agree with those on the left on some things (immigration issues for the most part, the right to choose whether to carry a pregnancy to term), I also agree with those on the right on others (the right for sane citizens to bear arms and the right to choose whether to take vaccines or not, for instance). I'm also against foreign wars, which is something that Trump seemed to be into before his term but now, well... to their credit, some on the right such as Tucker Carlson, who I definitely respect on various themes, aren't happy with this new trend.
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Scott said:
Well, he hasn't denied what you've said, so I'll keep it in mind as a possibility. Since I never knew YaYa/Yurt, I've only known him as goat. I've agreed with goat on some things, disagreed with him on others. I think the same is true for most if not all of the posters in this forum :-p. As to goat personally, he seems to refrain from insulting too much, which I definitely consider to be a plus.
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You'll learn otherwise if you stick around. lol
 
Tobytone said:
My point is, most of your party isn't up for debate anymore.
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You think I'm a democrat? I supported Bernie Sanders when he ran for President on the democratic ticket, as well as RFK Jr. when he did the same. I imagine you know that both of those candidates weren't what the democratic establishment wanted and both of those candidates were delt with in a dirty manner by said establishment, resulting in neither of them getting the ticket. After Bernie dropped from the electoral race the first time, all I knew is that if I were American, I wouldn't have voted for Hillary or Trump. After 4 years of Trump, when Bernie dropped out again and endorsed Biden, I figured Biden should be better than another 4 years of Trump. Now I'm not so sure. In any case, when it was Trump vs. Kamala, again, I wouldn't have voted for either. I -was- pleased when Trump picked RFK Jr. to lead the department of Health and Human Services. I think RFK Jr. has done some good work there and I hope he continues to do more.

Tobytone said:
If you actually agree with the right on something, you're out in the woods with no one to back you up. That's not a dig, just a sad truth.
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Well, I manage here. I've already told you I agree with Tucker Carlson on some things, such as his want to get out of various foreign wars and his distrust of covid vaccines.
 
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