Early assessments, Nuclear program not destroyed.

[Into the Night]

What a horrible, illogical thing to say.

It's completely logical and even correct.

Trump is an asshole.

Everyone's an asshole, you included. Everyone has an asshole, even those that have had part of their colon removed.

This mess is HIS fault.

You can't blame Iran on Trump.

He wanted to take credit for the bombing.

Since he gave the order, he should.

He went on TV way too soon and made claims that were not then, and are not now, substantiated.

They are substantiated.

How do you hate someone in place of someone else?

You'll find a way...just as soon as Trump leaves office and Vance becomes President.

I wish they would have refused the mission.

1. They can't.
2. They didn't want to. They were proud to carry off such a complex mission so well, and with good reason!

We were not at war with Iran,

Iran is at war with us and has been for years. It's not a one way street.

and they bombed a nation at Trump's stupid orders.

They sure did! Of course, only YOU think the orders were stupid.

I am not proud of a sneak attack on another country. I thought America did not do things like that.

It will certainly do things like that. Patriot troops have been conducting sneak attacks since the Revolutionary War. They were good at it too!

Iran will not have nuclear weapons.

 

[Into the Night]

Wrong. It is applicable. Greater weapons accuracy means fewer are needed to reach a level of damage, that's all. The problem is that smacking a direct hit on say a building with heavy machinery in it doesn't mean the machinery is all destroyed. Instead, what often happens is the destruction of the building is equated with destruction of the equipment and that often isn't the case.


And that works until the bad guys dig it out, find it's intact more or less, and put it back into service there or somewhere else.


I can't say how vulnerable to damage they are, but it they're intact even if the building they're in is destroyed, then you didn't take the target out. The damage is cosmetic and superficial. The USSBS discussed this at length as it was a primary finding from examining bombing damage close up.

This is a bombed German factory.

Do the vehicles in production look destroyed to you? I'm sure production was disrupted to one degree or another, but it wasn't destroyed.

Production looks destroyed.
Half built tanks are not a threat to anything.

Oh...and these factories and forges including their equipment were utterly destroyed by a different type of bomb developed by the British. The resulting floods that bomb caused wiped these factories from the face of the Earth, including all their equipment.

 

[Into the Night]

Agreed...and neither does DUI Pete nor General Caine.

They can view the damage to the outside of the mountain and even collapsed entrances. Scientists can calculate the physics, but without knowing what the inside looks like or how it was constructed, it'd be very difficult to know how much damage was done.

There is no "inside" anymore, Sybil.

No doubt spy satellites will keep an eye on the area to look for activity.

Why? Do you think somebody shut them off?

Much of which the Iranians can simply say they are removing bodies, not rebuilding.

Nothing to remove, Sybil. Any bodies in there are quite thoroughly buried.

Also, as mentioned earlier, the Iranians are very patient.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

They can bribe, flatter and wheedle a peace deal out of Trump, specifically hoping to lift the sanctions which cost them $100B/year. With the money and after 5-10 years, they can go back to rebuilding.

Then they will be bombed again.

In the meantime, they can work on their "satellite" rocket program.

What rocket program, Sybil??????

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Production looks destroyed.
Half built tanks are not a threat to anything.

Oh...and these factories and forges including their equipment were utterly destroyed by a different type of bomb developed by the British. The resulting floods that bomb caused wiped these factories from the face of the Earth, including all their equipment.

You'd be wrong. All of the armor and castings were done elsewhere and shipped to this factory for assembly. The vehicles are intact and the components to be added need only be dug out of the rubble. That was hardly the only factory that was capable of recovery. The USSBS found that disrupting things like transportation lines (railroads in particular) were far more effective. Bombing a factory only worked if conditions for the strike were good and the bombing accurate.

One of the few times where the USAAF achieved total destruction of a factory was at Marienburg where in perfect conditions, they bombed an about to open Focke Wulf aircraft factory into rubble. The US waited until the factory was complete and ready to open (Göring was supposed to give a speech and 'ribbon cutting' ceremony the next day) to bomb it flat. That way the maximized the waste of German resources.

 

[zymurgy]

They go right through cement.

Someday you should visit the World of Concrete convention in Las Vegas (one of the largest shows in 'Vegas!). The high tech stuff is for specialized applications like runway overruns and hydraulic sealing techniques. Iran has no access to it, and it wouldn't have done them any good anyway.

some day you should read an actual book. Iraq, Iran, China, North Korea all know for a fact you are a retard in regards to their technology


your ignorance is fucking amazing though.

Iran develops ultra-high-performance quartz-infused concrete

Civil engineers in Iran have two major problems that their building materials need to be able to deal with. The first is earthquakes. The other is bombs

www.wired.com

 

[zymurgy]

it is getting ridiculous how retarded the trumpers have been on this messaging in relation to the attack

now "logic boy" claims a leader in high tech cement has no idea how high tech cement works

these retards simply make it up as they go

 

[Dutch Uncle]

There is no "inside" anymore, Sybil.

Why? Do you think somebody shut them off?

Nothing to remove, Sybil. Any bodies in there are quite thoroughly buried.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Then they will be bombed again.

What rocket program, Sybil??????

Random words. No apparent coherency.

 

[Earl]

It's completely logical and even correct.

Everyone's an asshole, you included. Everyone has an asshole, even those that have had part of their colon removed.

You can't blame Iran on Trump.

Since he gave the order, he should.

They are substantiated.

You'll find a way...just as soon as Trump leaves office and Vance becomes President.

1. They can't.
2. They didn't want to. They were proud to carry off such a complex mission so well, and with good reason!

Iran is at war with us and has been for years. It's not a one way street.

They sure did! Of course, only YOU think the orders were stupid.

It will certainly do things like that. Patriot troops have been conducting sneak attacks since the Revolutionary War. They were good at it too!

Iran will not have nuclear weapons.

One hundred percent accurate on all all points.

 

[FastLane]

it is getting ridiculous how retarded the trumpers have been on this messaging in relation to the attack

now "logic boy" claims a leader in high tech cement has no idea how high tech cement works

these retards simply make it up as they go

They dropped 5 GBU 57 bombs going faster than a 45 cal bullet down an air shaft that led all the way to the main hall. I seriously doubt your "magical" cement could resist that. But you can believe in miracles if you like.

 

[FastLane]

One hundred percent accurate on all all points.

If the GBU 57s didn't work the US could build a nuclear bunker buster and drop it down the air shaft. That way Iran could get a nuke.

 

[Into the Night]

They can't dig it out and hide from satellites at the same time. Their only option is to try and build a new facility with new centrifuges, in other words 'start over', and yea Iran is a big place and if nobody stops them they can just keep trying; but that doesn't mean it isn't worth it to reset the clock.

And if Iran tries, they will just be bombed again.

 

[Into the Night]

so?


cement reinforcement is constantly happening. We discovered in Iraq how our smaller bunker busters were failing

Ooooooh. NOW you are trying to claim magickal steel!

Illiteracy: Sentences begin with capital letters. Missing period.
Logical errors: strawman fallacy. Attempted proof by contrivance.

 

[zymurgy]

They dropped 5 GBU 57 bombs going faster than a 45 cal bullet down an air shaft that led all the way to the main hall. I seriously doubt your "magical" cement could resist that. But you can believe in miracles if you like.

scientists disagree with you on how the cement will react

which is why they target things like ventilation shafts

and why we need to demand on site inspections and to demand they account for the previously enriched product

and none of that defends the shit stain king for claiming Iran has no capability in regards to cement here

you get that right? people that you side with are flat out dumb and saying dumb shit

and you let it go because you all don't care about logic and facts. you are just ideological shit heads that choose sides and fight regardless

 

[Into the Night]

Do you understand how declaring war works?

What war???

How many military bases do we have surrounding them? Is that an act of war? Mercenaries? Guys like Blackwater contracting their services is an act of war? Is it OK if they establish military bases on our borders?

They'll sink. It's the sea, Sybil.

 

[zymurgy]

Ooooooh. NOW you are trying to claim magickal steel!

Illiteracy: Sentences begin with capital letters. Missing period.
Logical errors: strawman fallacy. Attempted proof by contrivance.

I already supplied a link that makes you look like a fool

the link you are ignoring

but I get it. you can't win this, so you are worried about your missing period. derp derp

Iran develops ultra-high-performance quartz-infused concrete

Civil engineers in Iran have two major problems that their building materials need to be able to deal with. The first is earthquakes. The other is bombs

www.wired.com

 

[FastLane]

you are a poser.

if successful, it is because we used ventilation shafts, not because the bombs are keeping up with the UHC

In a First, America Dropped 30,000-Pound Bunker-Busters—But Iran’s Concrete May Be Unbreakable, Scientists Say

President Trump is claiming the strikes “obliterated” three underground nuclear sites in Iran protected by military grade concrete. The truth may be more complicated.

www.popularmechanics.com

You are knuckle dragging moron. They know exactly how much material came out of Fordow when they dug it out and they know how much material went into Fordow when they built it so they know about how thick the concrete in Fordow is. I would be AMAZED if they didn't get a sample of the very concrete they used in Fordow. The GBU 57 was designed and tested to penetrate Fordow. I'm pretty sure 5 down a vent shaft did the job.

 

[Into the Night]

scientists disagree with you on how the cement will react

The bomb goes through cement, Ziggy.

which is why they target things like ventilation shafts

The bomb makes its own "ventilation shaft", then ventilates the place.

and why we need to demand on site inspections and to demand they account for the previously enriched product

It was already bombed by Israel.

and none of that defends the shit stain king for claiming Iran has no capability in regards to cement here

There is no Magickal Bombproof Cement, Ziggy. The bomb goes through cement.

you get that right? people that you side with are flat out dumb and saying dumb shit

Inversion fallacy.

and you let it go because you all don't care about logic and facts. you are just ideological shit heads that choose sides and fight regardless

Yes. I choose sides. I side with the U.S. and with Israel's actions here.

Illiteracy: Sentences begin with capital letters. Missing periods.
Logical errors: Assertion (Ipse dixit) fallacies. Inversion fallacies. Insult fallacies.

 

[zymurgy]

You are knuckle dragging moron. They know exactly how much material came out of Fordow when they dug it out and they know how much material went into Fordow when they built it so they know about how thick the concrete in Fordow is. I would be AMAZED if they didn't get a sample of the very concrete they used in Fordow. The GBU 57 was designed and tested to penetrate Fordow. I'm pretty sure 5 down a vent shaft did the job.

bwahaha

I proved to the other idiot that he was wrong about cement

your knuckle dragging butt buddy got pwned

NEXT

 

[FastLane]

They can't dig it out and hide from satellites at the same time. Their only option is to try and build a new facility with new centrifuges, in other words 'start over', and yea Iran is a big place and if nobody stops them they can just keep trying; but that doesn't mean it isn't worth it to reset the clock.

It's a lot more efficient than trying to take out every ball bearing factory that's for sure.



If tools are destroyed that is production destroyed. You don't bomb factories to destroy the things they are building at the moment you bomb factories to stop the production of more things.

You can't repackage the obvious fact that eventually everything can be rebuilt as "it's pointless".

If the same ordinance that was dropped in WW2 was done with the accuracy of a modern laser guided bombs they would have ended the industrial existence of the axis in ten days.

There is no question it hurt their production, the only question is whether it was worth the price, i.e. would the allies have won faster if they put all those resources into fighters and close air support planes.

The modern west places a much higher value (due to political infighting) on soldiers lives than currency, so it would have to be freaking expensive to not be worth it compared to even special forces infiltration.

And those evil Jews blew up their centrifuge factory too.

 

[zymurgy]

The bomb goes through cement, Ziggy.

you said they can't produce better cement derpity


you can't wiggle your way out of this