Israeli response: is a 2 for 1 ratio acceptable?

[Dutch Uncle]

I think a lot of people would go, most men want their families safe. It would also lessen overcrowding, which causes a lot of problems.

IDK, but agree it'd be nice if the other Arab states at least made a sincere offer.

Let's give credit to Biden's WH for persuading the Egyptians to open up, no matter how briefly. Notice all the UN members who are whining about Israel aren't offering to open up their doors either.

 

[Cypress]

That's all pretty fair.

And I don't think IDF bears sole blame either. Obviously, Hamas is putting people in harm's way, as a form of defense & to protect themselves.

But I also think it's a moral conundrum. The line is somewhere - has Israel crossed it? I started the thread to get the opinions of others on that. I think for some here, there is NO line, which I can't agree with. Some see a line, but err more on the side of supporting any Israeli action right now, simply because of how horrific the initial Hamas attack was. It demands a response, and Hamas absolutely needs to be brought to justice one way or another.

I think on this site & elsewhere, there has been some conflation of Hamas w/ Gazan civilians - which is definitely troubling. If Israel has to kill civilians to get to Hamas - there should at minimum be some concern and compassion for the suffering caused.

The whole situation is tragic, because there are Gazans who don't support Hamas and don't deserve to die, and none of those Israelis deserved to have bloodthirsty barbarians gun them down for sport.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The whole situation is tragic, because there are Gazans who don't support Hamas and don't deserve to die, and none of those Israelis deserved to have bloodthirsty barbarians gun them down for sport.

A context the extremists often fail to appreciate.

 

[martin]

Human beings can be very bigoted for several reasons. Very few of them logical.

Are you claiming Israelis are committing genocide and violating international rules of war or will you admit it's Hamas that is committing war crimes and the Israelis who adhere to rules of war?

To the extent it’s bigoted by definition it isn’t logical.

The raid on Israeli villages was terrorism at its worst. I’ve stated that opinion before

 

[Dutch Uncle]

To the extent it’s bigoted by definition it isn’t logical.

The raid on Israeli villages was terrorism at its worst. I’ve stated that opinion before

Agreed. Bigotry is often both ignorance and emotion over logic.

Agreed. Notice how many are quick to overlook that terrorism.

 

[Cypress]

IDK, but agree it'd be nice if the other Arab states at least made a sincere offer.

Let's give credit to Biden's WH for persuading the Egyptians to open up, no matter how briefly. Notice all the UN members who are whining about Israel aren't offering to open up their doors either.

It's hard to think of really effective solutions
.
It's perfectly understandable that Israel wants to eradicate Hamas and remove them as the ruling authority in Gaza.

That's not going to happen by politely asking the Gazans to hold an election.

Removing Hamas from power is going to require urban warfare.

The difficult question is how to minimize harm to civilians and how to get humanitarian aid in.

 

[ExpressLane]

It's hard to think of really effective solutions
.
It's perfectly understandable that Israel wants to eradicate Hamas and remove them as the ruling authority in Gaza.

That's not going to happen by politely asking the Gazans to hold an election.

Removing Hamas from power is going to require urban warfare.

The difficult question is how to minimize harm to civilians and how to get humanitarian aid in.

Build refuge camps and offer Food Shelter and Water and they will come.

 

[Monad Portal]

A context the extremists often fail to appreciate.

israelis don't want a two state solution either.

that's why they kept letting israelis settlers commit terrorism in the gaza and west bank.

 

[Cypress]

Build refuge camps and offer Food Shelter and Water and they will come.

Easier said than done. Aid workers probably don't want to be blown up by Israeli missiles, or used as human shields by Hamas

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Build refuge camps and offer Food Shelter and Water and they will come.

Easier said than done. Aid workers probably don't want to be blown up by Israeli missiles, or used as human shields by Hamas

Agreed on the problems. Building the camps outside of Gaza would allow better screening of the refugees for weapons.

The main problem is Iranian funding of Hamas. Hamas would quickly be reduced to rock throwing if funding was cut off. The IDF would have to screen the area for weapon caches but it's important to stop Iran from funding terrorism in Gaza, Lebanon, Yemen and elsewhere.

 

[Yakuda]

It was reported yesterday that there are 2 civilian deaths for every Hamas fighter killed in Gaza.

Is that an acceptable ratio? Has Israel gone too far?

Its absolutely unacceptable! 4 to 1 is acceptable

 

[martin]

Agreed. Also agreed life isn't fair. Why do other Arab nations refuse to help evacuate Palestinian non-combatants?

No, Israel has not crossed the line. The people blaming Israel for 75 years of Palestinian terrorism have crossed the line.

I support ending wars as quickly as possible. The fact the US killed more Japanese in the firebombing of Tokyo than at Hiroshima or Nagasaki is why I suspect many Americans are very lacking in historical context. Total civilian casualties of the American bombing of Japan are estimated to be almost 1M. Starting wars has consequences.

Hamas started this war, with Iran's backing. Israel is trying to end it as quickly as possible. I support their efforts. Why don't you condemn 75 years of terrorist attacks against Israel? Why don't you condemn Iran for funding Hamas and Hezbollah?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_raids_on_Japan
241,000–900,000 killed
213,000–1,300,000 wounded
8,500,000 rendered homeless

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Tokyo
The Operation Meetinghouse firebombing of Tokyo on the night of 9 March 1945 was the single deadliest air raid of World War II, greater than Dresden, Hamburg, Hiroshima, or Nagasaki as single events.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Tokyo_(10_March_1945)

You really think Pearl Harbor and then the American war with Japan is "historical context" for evaluating how Israel is responding to the terrorist attack? Pretty big stretch in my opinion.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Sad state of affairs. Our support for Israel is immoral.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

It was reported yesterday that there are 2 civilian deaths for every Hamas fighter killed in Gaza.

Is that an acceptable ratio? Has Israel gone too far?

ask madeline albright. then, when israel reaches half a million civilian deaths, we can talk.