Every Hamas member is a dead man, Netanyahu says

Phantasmal said:
Wiping out the infrastructure creates more terrorists, history has shown us that. We have no sources reporting accurately what is being bombed in Palestine.

Israel will lose support if the human casualties become too great, it has happened in the past.
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So what is the solution? Diplomacy hasn't ever worked. Every negotiated ceasefire only allowed the Palestinians regroup, train and rearm.

Agreed just paving over Gaza won't work and Bibi has admitted he doesn't want to occupy Gaza. OTOH, the only way to make sure Hamas is wiped out is to go through every building and tunnel in Gaza.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
An action condemned by one ideology might be celebrated by another.
Rather than judging, I'm content to know who is we and who is they.

As diversity goes up, solidarity goes down,
so diverse people like Americans have to feel mutually threatened before they'll [temporarily] come together.

I don't see any good guys in the Middle East, but no Jews knocked down the World Trade Center.
The Jews are OUR bad guys and the jihadist Muslims are THEIR'S.
Any judging will be biased and thus unhelpful.
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We is the good guys. They are the terrorists, the mass murderers of innocent people of all ages.

It's not that complicated. Consider the people who attacked the Capitol. Do you really have a problem determining who were the good guys that day and who were the bad guys, neef?
 
Cypress said:
I don't have a solution, I'm not a military tactician.

Israel certainly has the right to a lethal military response.

I'm saying that blood lust will not serve anyone well.
There has to be a sweet spot between cold, calculated military retribution, and blood lust.
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Assuming they use it on those who did the raid. The problem is they do not know who did it and many Hamas used the tunnels to escape. But blowing Gaza up will be a good political move. Israelis want their revenge, even if it is not the right people. Netanyahoo will have done something.
 
Doc Dutch said:
So what is the solution? Diplomacy hasn't ever worked. Every negotiated ceasefire only allowed the Palestinians regroup, train and rearm.

Agreed just paving over Gaza won't work and Bibi has admitted he doesn't want to occupy Gaza. OTOH, the only way to make sure Hamas is wiped out is to go through every building and tunnel in Gaza.
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They are Hamas, you keep referring to them as Palestinians, they are Hamas, they may even have foreign fighters.
 
Phantasmal said:
Wiping out the infrastructure creates more terrorists, history has shown us that. We have no sources reporting accurately what is being bombed in Palestine.

Israel will lose support if the human casualties become too great, it has happened in the past.
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Jews and Christians create terrorists.. Just by being Jews and Christians


The one thing that all these Islamic terrorists have in common is their hatred for Jews Christians and non-believers and that will always be there
 
Doc Dutch said:
We is the good guys. They are the terrorists, the mass murderers of innocent people of all ages.

It's not that complicated. Consider the people who attacked the Capitol. Do you really have a problem determining who were the good guys that day and who were the bad guys, neef?
Click to expand...


I don't have any trouble at all opining about who the bad guys are, Oom,

and those same bad guys, I'm sure, think with equal sincerity that I'm the bad guy.

That's the point.

In the end, it doesn't matter who the good guys and the bad guys are,
because it depends who you ask.

We just have to know who's with us and who's against us.
Half of the universe will think that we were right.
 
Nordberg said:
Assuming they use it on those who did the raid. The problem is they do not know who did it and many Hamas used the tunnels to escape. But blowing Gaza up will be a good political move. Israelis want their revenge, even if it is not the right people. Netanyahoo will have done something.
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They need to depopulate Gaza then bulldoze it. And then control who lives there in the future and not allow them to have weapons. They need to blow up every one of their tunnels into Israel.
 
Cypress said:
I don't have a solution, I'm not a military tactician.

Israel certainly has the right to a lethal military response.

I'm saying that blood lust will not serve anyone well.
There has to be a sweet spot between cold, calculated military retribution, and blood lust.
Click to expand...
I support cold, calculated military retribution. Blood lust is emotional and most likely to be flawed in both effect and results. It can cost friendly and non-combative lives.

That said, there's lots of other ways people can get killed when giving 20somethings high-powered equipment and high-powered weapons. This doesn't include events like Russian soldiers shooting their officers although I'm certain a lot of emotion is involved there too. LOL

Still, mistakes will happen. Ask the family of Cpl. Pat Tillman along with the 5,000+ US friendly fire deaths in Vietnam, the dozens of friendly fire deaths in Afghanistan and Iraq along with the thousands of people simply killed in non-combat related accidents.

Wars are highly fluid, highly lethal activities. Please don't mistake accidents for intent. What Hamas did on the Jewish Sabbath was intentional. If the IDF fires on a mortar position placed on top of a school, the intention, again, is on Hamas, not on the IDF for defending themselves or shooting a target which, unknown to them, is a school, hospital or religious structure.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=2985261&page=1
Soldiers slain by enemy fire are lauded as heroes and honored with parades. But those who die at the hands of their fellow soldiers in the fog of war usually don't get much attention.

Until the killing of former NFL star and Army Ranger Pat Tillman made headlines, friendly fire deaths occupied an unexamined niche in the annals of warfare....

...At least two dozen U.S. soldiers, and several British and Canadian soldiers, have been killed in such incidents, a small percentage of the total of 3,500 coalition deaths.

The ratio was higher during the Gulf War, when 17 percent of American casualties were killed or injured due to friendly fire. Of the 18 British soldiers who died during that war, half of them were killed by their U.S. allies during a single attack by an American A-10 aircraft.
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[FONT=&quot]Palestinians

[/FONT]2 Million People in the space of New Jersey, Controlled by a Government they didn't and can't Elect and are held captive by Hamas and can't leave.

351a7c5676c5edf3826a3e4075862c419c2b1f98.jpg
 
Phantasmal said:
They are Hamas, you keep referring to them as Palestinians, they are Hamas, they may even have foreign fighters.
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How long have the Palestinians been attacking Israel? Hamas is not 70 years old, but the idea of killing the Jews and pushing them into the sea is about that old.
 
Doc Dutch said:
I support cold, calculated military retribution. Blood lust is emotional and most likely to be flawed in both effect and results. It can cost friendly and non-combative lives.

That said, there's lots of other ways people can get killed when giving 20somethings high-powered equipment and high-powered weapons. This doesn't include events like Russian soldiers shooting their officers although I'm certain a lot of emotion is involved there too. LOL

Still, mistakes will happen. Ask the family of Cpl. Pat Tillman along with the 5,000+ US friendly fire deaths in Vietnam, the dozens of friendly fire deaths in Afghanistan and Iraq along with the thousands of people simply killed in non-combat related accidents.

Wars are highly fluid, highly lethal activities. Please don't mistake accidents for intent. What Hamas did on the Jewish Sabbath was intentional. If the IDF fires on a mortar position placed on top of a school, the intention, again, is on Hamas, not on the IDF for defending themselves or shooting a target which, unknown to them, is a school, hospital or religious structure.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=2985261&page=1
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Hamas are barbaric criminals.
Retaliatory military strikes by Israel that cause some collateral damage is well within the boundaries of morally just warfare, as long as attempts are made to minimize collateral damage.

I'm talking about the bloodlust of holding all Palestinian civilians responsible for Hamas. Not all of them support attacks on civilians, some of them probably don't even like Hamas, and in particular children can't be expected to have political opinions or be held accountable for Hamas
 
Phantasmal said:
Wiping out the infrastructure creates more terrorists, history has shown us that. We have no sources reporting accurately what is being bombed in Palestine.

Israel will lose support if the human casualties become too great, it has happened in the past.
Click to expand...
The hospitals have had their power cut, and they are packed to the gills with maimed children right now. It's pretty common to blame terrorists for using human shields, but Israel is leveling everything without a care for innocents.

Which is what Hamas did on a much smaller scale, so we have two terrorist organizations committing war crimes right now.
Not unlike what we did in Iraq for absolutely no reason.


https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...airstrikes-children-supplies-power-rcna119877
On Saturday, Hamas — a militant organization that is one of the two major political groups in the Palestinian territories and has been designated a terrorist group by the U.S., the European Union and other countries — launched a terrorist attack via land, air and sea that killed at least 1,200 people in Israel. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said the terrorists raped women and butchered people.
Israel has responded by bombarding the enclave, and on Monday, Israeli Defense Minister Yoav Gallant ordered a “full siege” of Gaza, blocking food, gas and power into the area. Officials say at least 1,100 people have died in Gaza in bombings since the attack. Now, as Israel's forces prepare for a possible ground invasion, doctors and aid workers say the health care system in Gaza is about to collapse.
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After Hamas’ terrorist attack Saturday, Israeli airstrikes have reduced entire neighborhoods in Gaza, including hospitals, to soot. The remaining clinics and emergency units have been operating without power and supplies.
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Cypress said:
Hamas are barbaric criminals.
Retaliatory military strikes by Israel that cause some collateral damage is well within the boundaries of morally just warfare, as long as attempts are made to minimize collateral damage.

I'm talking about the bloodlust of holding all Palestinian civilians responsible for Hamas. Not all of them support attacks on civilians, some of them probably don't even like Hamas, and in particular children can't be expected to have political opinions or be held accountable for Hamas
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Bibi had egg on his face, and he just launched into genocidal acts without a care.
Which is easy to understand (while not supporting it), as murdered babies and beheaded innocents that Hamas left behind is a horrible thing to see.

I see no reason why Israel couldn't clear out the remaining terrorists that were holed up in country, and plot a much more targeted military strike inside Gaza. For fuck's sake, Israel has total control over the region complete with video and electronic surveillance.

Bloodlust is an apt description. What Hamas did is simply unacceptable. What Israel is doing is just as bad, and getting worse.
 
Cypress said:
Hamas are barbaric criminals.
Retaliatory military strikes by Israel that cause some collateral damage is well within the boundaries of morally just warfare, as long as attempts are made to minimize collateral damage.

I'm talking about the bloodlust of holding all Palestinian civilians responsible for Hamas. Not all of them support attacks on civilians, some of them probably don't even like Hamas, and in particular children can't be expected to have political opinions or be held accountable for Hamas
Click to expand...

The majority of Palestinian like Hamas. Hamas provides medicine and food to people to endear themselves to the people. They teach hate for the Jews. Suicide bombers are revered like rock stars . They paint their pictures on walls. It is a generational deep seated hate. The only way to slow the violence is to totally destroy Hamas. It will eventually return but there will lull in the violence for awhile.
 
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