Biden’s team fears the aftermath of a failed Ukrainian counteroffensive

anatta

100% recycled karma
it's more then just the Pentagon Leaks..the part that got me is
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says the U.S. hasn’t adequately armed his forces properly and so, until then, the counteroffensive can’t begin. :palm:
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/04/24/biden-ukraine-russia-counteroffensive-defense-00093384
A counteroffensive that doesn’t meet expectations will also cause allies in foreign capitals to question how much more they can spare if Kyiv’s victory looks farther and farther away.

“European public support may wane over time as European energy and economic costs stay high,” said Clementine Starling, a director and fellow at the Atlantic Council think tank in Washington, D.C. “A fracturing of transatlantic support will likely hurt U.S. domestic support and Congress and the Biden administration may struggle to sustain it.”

if the impending fighting season yields limited gains, administration officials have expressed privately they fear being faced with a two-headed monster attacking it from the hawkish and dovish ends of the spectrum.

One side will say that Ukraine’s advances would’ve worked had the administration given Kyiv everything it asked for, namely longer-range missiles, fighter jets and more air defenses. The other side, administration officials worry, will claim Ukraine’s shortcoming proves it can’t force Russia out of its territory completely.

That doesn’t even account for the reaction of America’s allies, mainly in Europe, who may see a peace negotiation between Ukraine and Russia as a more attractive option if Kyiv can’t prove victory is around the corner.

Those concerns recently spilled out into the open during a leak of classified information onto social media. A top secret assessment from early February stated that Ukraine would fall “well short” of its counteroffensive goals. More current American assessments are that Ukraine may make some progress in the south and east, but won’t be able to repeat last year’s success.
 
There has been discussion, per aides, of framing it to the Ukrainians as a “ceasefire” and not as permanent peace talks, leaving the door open for Ukraine to regain more of its territory at a future date. Incentives would have to be given to Kyiv: perhaps NATO-like security guarantees, economic help from the European Union, more military aid to replenish and bolster Ukraine’s forces, and the like. And aides have expressed hope of re-engaging China to push Putin to the negotiating table as well.
 
Biden has never adequately armed Ukraine. He never acted decisively.

Zelensky has no reason to take back the rubble ridden East, unless he can hold it.

It is currently a war of attrition. That favors Russia.

Biden is a horrible CIC. Our allies know he can't be trusted.
 
Biden has never adequately armed Ukraine. He never acted decisively.

Zelensky has no reason to take back the rubble ridden East, unless he can hold it.

It is currently a war of attrition. That favors Russia.

Biden is a horrible CIC. Our allies know he can't be trusted.

Funny how many rightys say the opposite. Biden has to tread a fine line between arming them and causing us to be more involved.
 
Biden has never adequately armed Ukraine. He never acted decisively.

Zelensky has no reason to take back the rubble ridden East, unless he can hold it.

It is currently a war of attrition. That favors Russia.

Biden is a horrible CIC. Our allies know he can't be trusted.

I'm sure you have a better understanding of this conflict than that.

Biden has to toe a very thin line in aiding the Ukraine. The U.S. is doing all that it can to keep the Ukraine independent, and prevent a direct war w/ Russia.
 
Funny how many rightys say the opposite. Biden has to tread a fine line between arming them and causing us to be more involved.

Exactly, half the right says he is pissing money away, the other that he isn’t doing what he should, it’s a no win for Biden with the right either way.
 
I'm sure you have a better understanding of this conflict than that.

Biden has to toe a very thin line in aiding the Ukraine. The U.S. is doing all that it can to keep the Ukraine independent, and prevent a direct war w/ Russia.

When Biden announced Russia was GOING to invade, he should have announced a No fly Zone and prevented the invasion.

The Ukraine border was a redline.
 
When Biden announced Russia was GOING to invade, he should have announced a No fly Zone and prevented the invasion.

The Ukraine border was a redline.

A no fly zone would have required American planes to shoot down Russian planes, in a world war situation. Instead, Biden made it impossible for Russian planes to fly over Ukraine, by giving Ukraine air defenses that they use themselves. We do not need to be in the war.
 
A no fly zone would have required American planes to shoot down Russian planes, in a world war situation. Instead, Biden made it impossible for Russian planes to fly over Ukraine, by giving Ukraine air defenses that they use themselves. We do not need to be in the war.

Biden did NOT make it impossible for Russians to fly planes over Ukraine's sovereign air space.

You think Russians would want to invade if it meant taking on U.S. fighter craft?
 
There has been discussion, per aides, of framing it to the Ukrainians as a “ceasefire” and not as permanent peace talks, leaving the door open for Ukraine to regain more of its territory at a future date. Incentives would have to be given to Kyiv: perhaps NATO-like security guarantees, economic help from the European Union, more military aid to replenish and bolster Ukraine’s forces, and the like. And aides have expressed hope of re-engaging China to push Putin to the negotiating table as well.

If you were told on February 24, 2022 that the Russian invasion would only manage to acquire a silver of land along the shores of the Sea of Azov, and that Kyiv and the rest of Ukraine were armed well enough to prevent any chance of a Russian conquest of the country, you would have been shocked and considered it a major achievement by Ukraine.
 
Biden did NOT make it impossible for Russians to fly planes over Ukraine's sovereign air space.

There is an overlap in claimed sovereign air space, so that would require us taking air space that is de facto Russian. We would be invading then.

The Russians are not flying planes over Ukrainian controlled air space, or anywhere near it. They have lost almost all their tanks, and do not want to lose almost all their airplanes. They sometimes, cautiously come close to the frontline, but then scurry back very quickly.

Instead, they are using missiles, hypersonic missiles, and drones. Anything that does not involve aircraft.

You think Russians would want to invade if it meant taking on U.S. fighter craft?

If we are talking about sovereign air space, then we are talking about invading air space that Russia has claimed for a decade, and shooting down Russian aircraft. That is war.

But yes, Putin is more willing to take risks than we are. That is what makes Biden's strategy so genius, it gives nothing for Putin to latch onto.
 
There is an overlap in claimed sovereign air space, so that would require us taking air space that is de facto Russian. We would be invading then.

The Russians are not flying planes over Ukrainian controlled air space, or anywhere near it. They have lost almost all their tanks, and do not want to lose almost all their airplanes. They sometimes, cautiously come close to the frontline, but then scurry back very quickly.

Instead, they are using missiles, hypersonic missiles, and drones. Anything that does not involve aircraft.



If we are talking about sovereign air space, then we are talking about invading air space that Russia has claimed for a decade, and shooting down Russian aircraft. That is war.

But yes, Putin is more willing to take risks than we are. That is what makes Biden's strategy so genius, it gives nothing for Putin to latch onto.

Wrong, our pilots could have stayed in Ukraine air space and still taken out any tank that dared cross into Ukraine. The war would have been over before it began. Biden has created a total blood covered mess.
 
Wrong, our pilots could have stayed in Ukraine air space and still taken out any tank that dared cross into Ukraine. The war would have been over before it began. Biden has created a total blood covered mess.

Before you had us taking over Ukrainian and Russian controlled air space, and now you have us attacking Russian ground forces?

The Russian forces would have to shoot back, and would probably attack the bases the planes flew out of. That would provoke WWIII.
 
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