Berlin Wall and Ronald Reagan Video

Damocles said:
It is quite shocking, true, I mean why would a liberal want everybody to think Reagan was unimportant or something, right? And by trying to minimize the importance of Reagan's diplomatic and administrative role in bringing about that conclusion.

Even the most dismissive gives him some credit, but it's always some left-handed nod towards some responsibility. Reagan believed that the Cold War could be won, worked towards it relentlessly and had a major contribution towards it, they just want everybody to be dismissive of his role as they are.

They like to pretend that people who liked Reagan and think he was one of the better leaders the nation had believe that Reagan did it by himself. Nobody suggests that, that's just a liberal myth based on their own stereotype of how they want to view any conservative. Another way they do this is by pretending Reagan had it out for homosexuals.
Click to expand...

There are plenty who give Reagan WAY too much credit for the fall of the wall. In many conservative circles, he is definitely seen as the impetus & primary reason it came down...
 
Onceler said:
There are plenty who give Reagan WAY too much credit for the fall of the wall. In many conservative circles, he is definitely seen as the impetus & primary reason it came down...
Click to expand...

and on the opposite side of the coin, there are plenty of liberals who want to diminish his role as much as possible.
 
Superfreak said:
and on the opposite side of the coin, there are plenty of liberals who want to diminish his role as much as possible.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't argue that, but to many liberals, Reagan was a disaster for the country.

You don't always look to give credit to people who you think were otherwise a complete disaster, nor do I think it reflects poorly on anyone for not doing so.
 
Superfreak said:
you must be a GED'er to have said something as ignorant as the above.
Click to expand...

yeah cause the world was sitting on thier seat waiting to act when the crazy man spoke.
He rushed in like the glory pimp he was and remarked on an already done deal.
NOt like its odd for a republican to steal Leak's glory.
 
Onceler said:
I wouldn't argue that, but to many liberals, Reagan was a disaster for the country.

You don't always look to give credit to people who you think were otherwise a complete disaster, nor do I think it reflects poorly on anyone for not doing so.
Click to expand...

Yes, I realize many liberals have a hatred of Reagan that rivals many right wingers 'love' of Clinton. But they, like the right wingers, are smoking crack.

Both had their faults, but both would have won third terms hands down had they been permitted to run again. While the extremes disliked them (to put it nicely), the bulk of the county thought they had done a good job overall.
 
Superfreak said:
Yes, I realize many liberals have a hatred of Reagan that rivals many right wingers 'love' of Clinton. But they, like the right wingers, are smoking crack.

Both had their faults, but both would have won third terms hands down had they been permitted to run again. While the extremes disliked them (to put it nicely), the bulk of the county thought they had done a good job overall.
Click to expand...

Worst. President. Ever.
 
Topspin said:
yeah cause the world was sitting on thier seat waiting to act when the crazy man spoke.
He rushed in like the glory pimp he was and remarked on an already done deal.
NOt like its odd for a republican to steal Leak's glory.
Click to expand...

Like I said... you are a nazi GEDer
 
Superfreak said:
That is a pretty accurate quote. There were far too many moving components to proclaim any one of them the primary reason.

1) The Polish Solidarity movement
2) The East German Police/people
3) The Pope
4) Thatcher
5) Gorbachev
6) Reagan

The above are in no particular order, but would the wall have come down without any of the above components? As that article states, Reagan most certainly played a significant role... but others played equally vital roles in bringing down the USSR as we knew it.

Reagan is one of my favorite Presidents (behind Ike). I think he was one of the best leaders this nation had during the last century. But to give him too much credit is a dishonor not only to the other players, but also to Reagan.
Click to expand...

Reagan empowered the Pope, who then empowered the Solidarity movement. He also worked with Thatcher, and of course, had huge influence on Gorbachev. The USSR would not have fallen without his influence.
 
Southern Man said:
Reagan empowered the Pope, who then empowered the Solidarity movement. He also worked with Thatcher, and of course, had huge influence on Gorbachev. The USSR would not have fallen without his influence.
Click to expand...

How can you say "reagan empowered the Pope"? They both shared the same view of communism and wanted to end it but reagan had no authority enabling him to give power to a sovereign state.
 
christiefan915 said:
How can you say "reagan empowered the Pope"? They both shared the same view of communism and wanted to end it but reagan had no authority enabling him to give power to a sovereign state.
Click to expand...

Because he is one of those on the right I spoke of that wants to give too much credit to one person. I don't doubt for a second that he truly believes what he writes, but it is ridiculous nonetheless. Just as ridiculous as those on the left that pretend Reagan was a bad President.
 
Never voted for Reagan, couldn't in 80 didn't in 84. That said, he was a good president. He lifted the US Military out of a 2 decade long morass that was close to destroying it. He made it an honor to serve in the military again and he made sure we got the equipment, training and pay that we deserved. As for the speech, it did NOTHING to bring down the wall. It showed the world nothing more than that we supported those on the otherside who longed or the end of communism. Like no one knew that. What Reagan did do, was hyper accelerate the spending of money on military weapons systms that forced the soviets to try to match us. They couldn't. The primary cause of the fall of the wall was the mass exodus from East Germany to the West via Hungary and then later Czechoslovakia. Then came the mass demonstrations inside East Germany. On November 4, 1989 500,000 protesters gathered at Alexanderplatz and chanted among other things "Wir wollen aus!" On this day the East Germans accidentally announced they would begin to allow refugees to leave through the gates in the wall. The plan was to have been executed more orderly but the politiburo didn't communicate with their own spokesperson and he made the announcement with no timeline allowing people to leave. The November 9, 1989 event had almost nothing to do with the US or NATO than it did the peaceful revolution that took place inside East Germany than what took place outside. But to claim that Reagan had little or no effect on the collapse of the wall is as much hackishness as to claim that Reagan's speech was anything more than symbolic.
 
christiefan915 said:
How can you say "reagan empowered the Pope"? They both shared the same view of communism and wanted to end it but reagan had no authority enabling him to give power to a sovereign state.
Click to expand...
The Pope has no military to back up his policies- the leader of the Free World does. That was very important to the Poles, who have been under the Soviet sword since WW2.
 
Socrtease said:
Never voted for Reagan, couldn't in 80 didn't in 84. That said, he was a good president. He lifted the US Military out of a 2 decade long morass that was close to destroying it. He made it an honor to serve in the military again and he made sure we got the equipment, training and pay that we deserved. As for the speech, it did NOTHING to bring down the wall. It showed the world nothing more than that we supported those on the otherside who longed or the end of communism. Like no one knew that. What Reagan did do, was hyper accelerate the spending of money on military weapons systms that forced the soviets to try to match us. They couldn't. The primary cause of the fall of the wall was the mass exodus from East Germany to the West via Hungary and then later Czechoslovakia. Then came the mass demonstrations inside East Germany. On November 4, 1989 500,000 protesters gathered at Alexanderplatz and chanted among other things "Wir wollen aus!" On this day the East Germans accidentally announced they would begin to allow refugees to leave through the gates in the wall. The plan was to have been executed more orderly but the politiburo didn't communicate with their own spokesperson and he made the announcement with no timeline allowing people to leave. The November 9, 1989 event had almost nothing to do with the US or NATO than it did the peaceful revolution that took place inside East Germany than what took place outside. But to claim that Reagan had little or no effect on the collapse of the wall is as much hackishness as to claim that Reagan's speech was anything more than symbolic.
Click to expand...

REAGAN SMASH!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top