Ukrainians don't surrender as easily as Republicans

[NiftyNiblick]

My father, who was first generation right-off-the-boat, always told me that new immigrants were the backbone of America, and typically the most patriotic citizens. Because they could appreciate America in a way native born citizens couldn't.

To him there was absolutely no conflict between being aware and pround of your ancestry, and being a rock solid American citizen.

Off the boat isn't first generation. First generation is first generation born here. Just a minor point.

People expatriate from worse conditions to come here. So here looks good for now.
People from much better conditions--which is most of post WWII Western Europe--wouldn't like it here unless they were very wealthy.
America is a fairly decent place for the top 1/100th of one percent, but the rest of us are just extras from central casting. We're socially regressive, plain and simple.

 

[McRocket]

You couldn't have possibly been more wrong when this conflict started. Is this some sort of attempt at a mulligan?

Wrong.

I assumed - as did many, MANY others - that Putin could not possibly be stupid enough to start an all out war with Ukraine.
And I was dead wrong on that.

But I also said that if Putin thought that Ukraine would be a pushover - he was wrong.

So clearly, you point is erroneous as I certainly could 'possibly' have been more wrong.


Now, do you have anything to add besides strawman arguments?
And flawed ones at that.

 

[McRocket]

My father, who was first generation right-off-the-boat, always told me that new immigrants were the backbone of America, and typically the most patriotic citizens. Because they could appreciate America in a way native born citizens couldn't.

To him there was absolutely no conflict between being aware and proud of your ancestry, and being a rock solid American citizen.

What a load of shit.

Your father did not know 99% of those people.

So for him to make vast generalizations about people he never even met is beyond stupid and/or arrogant.

 

[McRocket]

No nation is pure and saintly.

You would be extremely hard pressed to make the case I have ever blindly caricatured the nation of Russia as pure evil.

Russia's contributions to humanity artistically, spiritually, philosophically, morally are deep and estimable. That's what I think, and I have the posts to prove it.


The calculus in the current situation is easy for me. I have always opposed unprovoked military aggression and war crimes. Whether it is Iraq's invasion of Kuwait, Serbian ethnic cleansing in the Balkans, or Putin's bloodthirsty War of aggression in Ukraine.

So, did you oppose Kiev's, unproved attacks of the Donbass region - starting in 2014? And the thousands of lives they took?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbas

Did you oppose America's unprovoked invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan?

Do you oppose Saudi Arabia's bombing of civilians (supported by the US and GB) of innocent Yemeni's?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabian–led_intervention_in_Yemen

Do you oppose Turkey's unprovoked invasion of Syria?

Do you oppose Israel's unprovoked refusal to led the Palestinian's go? And thus force them to live in perpetual poverty and misery?

 

[Geeko Sportivo]

Putin would have never attacked Ukraine if Trump was president. Putin took the Crimea during the Obama /BIDEN administration while BIDEN was in charge of Ukraine for the US. Then Putin did nothing during the Trump administration. Then because Putin thought Biden was a weak leader Putin tries to take all of Ukraine. To make things worse Biden's stupid energy policies has helped to more than doubled the price of oil and that is financing the Ukraine war for Russia.

Let me just make some shit up here- since you are!

If Trump was president- TRUMP would have invaded the Ukraine for his little Pootie Pie!

Fuck Off you Trump Ass kissing son-of-a-bitch!

 

[Cypress]

So, did you oppose Kiev's, unproved attacks of the Donbass region - starting in 2014?

Ukraine has the right too suppress an insurrection on it's sovereign territory, in the same way president Lincoln had a constitutional right to suppress a rebel insurrection in the American South.

Did you oppose America's unprovoked invasions of Iraq

No, but you did. I have zero doubt you voted for Bush and cheered for the Invasion of Iraq.

and Afghanistan?

Al Qaeda and their Taliban sponsors attacked us First.

Do you oppose Saudi Arabia's bombing of civilians (supported by the US and GB) of innocent Yemeni's?

Yes.

Do you oppose Turkey's unprovoked invasion of Syria?
Do you oppose Israel's unprovoked refusal to led the Palestinian's go?

I don't have enough information about it to say one way or the other.

 

[Cypress]

What a load of shit.

Your father did not know 99% of those people.

So for him to make vast generalizations about people he never even met is beyond stupid and/or arrogant.

If your and Rep. Majorie Taylor Green are representative of conservatives, then native born conservatives are soft and weak, unwilling to defend this country. You and her keep screaming for Ukraine to just give up and submit, rather than fight for it's sovereignty.

That is weak and soft.

I have zero doubt my father and his immigrants peers would have expected a strong and sustained American response to Kremlin aggression.

 

[McRocket]

If your and Rep. Majorie Taylor Green are representative of conservatives, then native born conservatives are soft and weak, unwilling to defend this country. You and her keep screaming for Ukraine to just give up and submit, rather than fight for it's sovereignty.

That is weak and soft.

I have zero doubt my father and his immigrants peers would have expected a strong and sustained American response to Kremlin aggression.

Show me EXACTLY where I said that 'Ukraine should just give up and submit'?

Guess what - you can't.
Because I never said that - or even thought that.

Why do you make up shit like this?

 

[Cypress]

Show me EXACTLY where I said that 'Ukraine should just give up and submit'?

Guess what - you can't.
Because I never said that - or even thought that.

Why do you make up shit like this?

You and Marjorie Taylor Green have been screaming that it's pointless to resist Russia, and Ukraine should just give up.

If you and her are representative of native born American conservatives, you do not give me confidence you would defend ours nation's sovereignty and territory.

 

[McRocket]

Ukraine has the right too suppress an insurrection on it's sovereign territory, in the same way president Lincoln had a constitutional right to suppress a rebel insurrection in the American South.

Insurrection?
Clearly, you do not even know what that word even means.


The Donbas held referendums and OVERWHELMINGLY voted to leave Ukraine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Donbas_status_referendums
You don't start fucking murdering your own countrymen because they voted to leave.
DUH!!!

And the Civil War was also about slavery...not just succession.

No, but you did. I have zero doubt you voted for Bush and cheered for the Invasion of Iraq.

Again...you are making up shit.

I have NEVER voted for a dem OR rep in my life.
And I was COMPLETELY against the invasion of Iraq.

You make yourself look like a fool when you make these matter-of-fact statements without a shred of proof to back them up.

Al Qaeda and their Taliban sponsors attacked us First.

The Taliban did NOT sponsor al Qaeda.
They had NOTHING to do with the 9/11 attacks.

So...because a few hundred al Qaeda whackos happened to be based in Afghanistan?
That gives America the right to invade the entire, fucking country and occupy it for 20 years?

You are fucking delusional if you believe that.

 

[McRocket]

You and Marjorie Taylor Green have been screaming that it's pointless to resist Russia, and Ukraine should just give up.

If you and her are representative of native born American conservatives, you do not give me confidence you would defend ours nation's sovereignty and territory.

Show me the fucking post where I said that Ukraine should give up?

Because I do NOT think Ukraine should 'give up'.

And I am a native born American.
But not conservative (or liberal).
I have only said that about a thousand times on here...DUH!!!.

 

[PoliTalker]

Hello Cypress,

.
In New Poll, 89% of Ukrainians Reject Ceding Land to Reach Peace With Russia

Ukrainians back Zelensky’s position that peace talks can’t grant Russia land it has seized, WSJ-NORC poll finds
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ws...g-land-to-reach-peace-with-russia-11656504002


Fearing Russia, Representative Marjorie Taylor Green Calls for U.S. to Leave NATO, Recommends Ukraine Just Give Up
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ne...clear-war-russia-calls-protests-1720722?amp=1
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ne...russia-war-ukraine-conflict-mtg-1720627?amp=1

Why am I not surprised that MJT is a quitter?

She should never be president.

The thought is laughable.

But then considering how hateful the American right is these days I wouldn't put it past them to elect her.

I bet if the choice was between Marjorie Taylor Greene and Kamala Harris, Greene would win!

SMH

 

[Cypress]

Hey dumbass?

Show me the fucking post where I said that Ukraine should give up?

Because I do NOT think Ukraine should 'give up'.

DUH!!!

So you insinuate you support Biden's policy of consistent and robust support to Ukraine to assist them in defending their sovereign territory against Kremlin aggression.

Now, I know you're lying.

 

[McRocket]

So you insinuate you support Biden's policy of consistent and robust support to Ukraine to assist them in defending their sovereign territory against Kremlin aggression.

Now, I know you're lying.

I think that the Ukraine War is NONE of America's business.

And I want NO taxpayer money/arms going towards it.


I will ask again...where did I say that Ukraine should surrender?

 

[Cypress]

Insurrection?
Clearly, you do not even know what that word even means.


The Donbas held referendums and OVERWHELMINGLY voted to leave Ukraine.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Donbas_status_referendums
You don't start fucking murdering your own countrymen because they voted to leave.
DUH!!!

And the Civil War was also about slavery...not just succession.




Again...you are making up shit.

I have NEVER voted for a dem OR rep in my life.
And I was COMPLETELY against the invasion of Iraq.

You make yourself look like a fool when you make these matter-of-fact statements without a shred of proof to back them up.



The Taliban did NOT sponsor al Qaeda.
They had NOTHING to do with the 9/11 attacks.

So...because a few hundred al Qaeda whackos happened to be based in Afghanistan?
That gives America the right to invade the entire, fucking country and occupy it for 20 years?

You are fucking delusional if you believe that.

No I am one thousand percent positive you voted for Bush and supported the Iraq war.


President Lincoln had the right to use force to suppress a domestic rebellion in the American South.

Ukraine had the right to suppress an insurrection on their sovereign territory.

Russia had the right to suppress an insurrection in Chechnya, which is part of the sovereign territory of the Russian Federation. They should have done it without flattening Grozny though

 

[McRocket]

No I am one thousand percent positive you voted for Bush and supported the Iraq war.

So...even though I have posted on this site - literally hundreds of times - that I despise both parties.

And I tell you I have never voted for a Dem or Rep in my life?

You still are claiming - with ZERO, factual data to back it up?

That I voted for GWB anyway?

Even though I openly disagreed with his policies?

Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.





Oh, and btw - it is 'one hundred percent positive'.
It is impossible to be more than 100% positive about anything.

Saying otherwise makes you look uneducated.

Just sayin'.

 

[Cypress]

So...even though I have posted on this site - literally hundreds of times - that I despise both parties.

And I tell you I have never voted for a Dem or Rep in my life?

You still are claiming - with ZERO, factual data to back it up?

That I voted for GWB anyway?

Even though I openly disagreed with his policies?

Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.





Oh, and btw - it is 'one hundred percent positive'.
It is impossible to be more than 100% positive about anything.

Saying otherwise makes you look uneducated.

Just sayin'.

I wager there is zero evidence on this site of you supporting the Biden policy of assisting Ukraine's ability to defend itself against a much stronger aggressor state.

If we did things your way Ukraine would have run out of ammunition and the ability to defend itself months ago.

If we did things your way, the Kremlin would have turned Ukraine into a vassal state by now.


I believe in assisting any European nation which is invaded by a powerful aggressor state.

Through word and deed, you believe in rolling over for the Kremlin.

You asked me what my basis for saying immigrants are more patriotic than native born conservatives. You and Marjorie Taylor Green are the gold standards of weak conservatives who can't be counted on to resist aggressor states.

 

[Cypress]

Hello Cypress,



Why am I not surprised that MJT is a quitter?

She should never be president.

The thought is laughable.

But then considering how hateful the American right is these days I wouldn't put it past them to elect her.

I bet if the choice was between Marjorie Taylor Greene and Kamala Harris, Greene would win!

SMH

I could see Majorie Taylor Green, Ted Nugent, and Kid Rock all as legitimate contenders for the GOP presidential nomination. This is a party that nominated a mediocre TV game show host to be the face of their party.

 

[McRocket]

I wager there is zero evidence on this site of you supporting the Biden policy of assisting Ukraine's ability to defend itself against a much stronger aggressor state.

If we did things your way Ukraine would have run out of ammunition and the ability to defend itself months ago.

If we did things your way, the Kremlin would have turned Ukraine into a vassal state by now.


I believe in assisting any European nation which is invaded by a powerful aggressor state.

Through word and deed, you believe in rolling over for the Kremlin.

You asked me what my basis for saying immigrants are more patriotic than native born conservatives. You and Marjorie Taylor Green are the gold standards of weak conservatives who can't be counted on to resist aggressor states.

Like Ron Paul, I do not believe that America has any business getting involved in the Ukraine War except for humanitarian aid.

We are meddling in something that is NONE of our business.


I will ask again...where did I say that Ukraine should surrender?

Or are you too much of a coward to admit that you just made it up?

 

[Grokmaster]

.
In New Poll, 89% of Ukrainians Reject Ceding Land to Reach Peace With Russia

Ukrainians back Zelensky’s position that peace talks can’t grant Russia land it has seized, WSJ-NORC poll finds
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ws...g-land-to-reach-peace-with-russia-11656504002


Fearing Russia, Representative Marjorie Taylor Green Calls for U.S. to Leave NATO, Recommends Ukraine Just Give Up
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ne...clear-war-russia-calls-protests-1720722?amp=1
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ne...russia-war-ukraine-conflict-mtg-1720627?amp=1

IT WAS REPUBLICANS WHO WOULD , OVERWHELMINGLY , FIGHT TO DEFEND AMERICA, COWARD-O_CRATS WHO WOULD NOT ,REMEMBER?