Ukraine runs the imminent risk of becoming irredeemably dysfunctional

[archives]

Russia will win this war, logistically, they have everything on their side, regardless of how much we supply the Ukraine, they will eventually run out of combatants. Plus, Putin knows that the US will not maintain the course forever, eventually the right wing pro Putin voices will ascend and public approval waver, especially if Trump, or a Trump clone, runs in 2024. Moldavia is next

But what does Putin win, the Ukraine will be devastated, it will never be the Soviet state Putin was hoping to attain. At the same time the Russian economy will be in shambles, and the one goal Putin has of destroying NATO will be but a pipe dream

 

[Cypress]

man you are in complete denial. there isn't going to be any "inflection point" in Donbas, and where is this counteroffensive supposed to come from?
We cant send them more weapons -we've already sent all we got to low inventories.
Germany and Europe want this over,and Germany is not meeting it's weapons committments
Ukraine is a basketcase - large areas unlivable -some of it looks as bad as Syria post-civil war.

But i get it. Just keep sending and then when Ukraine finally decides look for peace...see OP title
Zelensky isn't helping his nation if he cant pivot to ceding territory that he cant win back
and Russia isnt going to stop as long as we keeps sending weapons

They are the one who want to fight for their land.

We are not holding a gun to their head making them do it.

The East Slavic republics have been hardned by centuries of invasion, totalitarianism, deprivation. On balance, I even think Ukranian, Belarusian, and Russian women have more fortitude than American men. Their fortitude and pain tolerance tends to be exceedingly high when they feel the cause is just. MAGA fat asses will have an emotional melt down if Obama wears a tan suit.

 

[dukkha]

They are the one who want to fight for their land.

We are not holding a gun to their head making them do it.

The East Slavic republics have been hardned by centuries of invasion, totalitarianism, deprivation. On balance, I even think Ukranian, Belarusian, and Russian women have more fortitude than American men. Their fortitude and pain tolerance tends to be exceedingly high when they feel the cause is just. MAGA fat asses will have an emotional melt down if Obama wears a tan suit.

you know more about the populace history then I do, But it's a question of war not "tolerance"
The few medium range MLS we are sending cant target Russian artillery,and Ukraine troops are being wiped out
It comes down to force and numbers, and Uk cannot repulse the Russians and there isn't going to be any counterattack on a large scale to do so. I just dont see how that can happen

So better to condition aid on talks,or at least use whatever leverage we can - I'd rather we just dump it in Europe's lap because as long as western Europe doesnt have to do much they wont

Zelensky is stuck on his olive drab victory mode. It's not going to happen as as son as Ukraine starts
to look towards ending this and rebuilding the better it is for its people
Rebuilding is a Herculian task -adding more destruction just makes it worse