Is it time to re-think free speech?

Flash said:
Today there are more free press issues with social media that is not held to the same standard as the print media.

There have been some interesting free speech cases involving people fired from their jobs for their social media posts (if they are government employees or students--teachers, police).
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Nothing to do with censorship.
 
BidenPresident said:
Nothing to do with censorship.
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I never commented on censorship. However, if the government allows restrictions on free speech that is essentially censorship. For example, if the city prohibits speeches about abortion in a public park that is a violation of our free speech rights and is an example of censorship.
 
Flash said:
I never commented on censorship. However, if the government allows restrictions on free speech that is essentially censorship. For example, if the city prohibits speeches about abortion in a public park that is a violation of our free speech rights and is an example of censorship.
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Has that ever happened? I can't debate hypotheticals.
 
BidenPresident said:
go kill yourself
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This isn't meant to be a partisan discussion. I think both sides would claim that widespread misinformation by perceived "news" sources and certainly on the internet has led to a significant portion of the population believing things that are fabricated or exaggerated.

The difference in even a few decades is alarming. The direction we're headed in - like other issues - isn't positive.
 
BartenderElite said:
It's weird to even type that. It's one of our most sacred principles.

But the original arguments for it & the marketplace of ideas had at its foundation the idea of a mature, educated populace. The theory was that by allowing all speech, the truth would filter everything else out & rise to the top.

That's not happening. I don't think it's really disputable that allowing ALL speech - especially in the internet age, which the founders could not have foreseen - is hurting us as a population, as a society & as a planet. Belief in lies and conspiracy is becoming widespread and ingrained.

If possible, try not to knee-jerk this one. I'm interested in other thoughts on it. It just isn't working as intended.
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Lies, fake news and conspiracy theories were around since the time of the free press, well before the Founders. It's not like this is a new phenomenon or something they were unaware of.

Do we want our government going the route of China and blocking what we can see and read on the internet?
 
anatta said:
oh great another one who thinks censorship is the answer for ignorance..
It's not. repressing ideas just drives them underground.
The answer for ignorance is more free , persuasive speech
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The ignorance is astounding, isn't it? Another stupid sheeplet who wants the gubmint to act as mommy and daddy
 
cawacko said:
Lies, fake news and conspiracy theories were around since the time of the free press, well before the Founders. It's not like this is a new phenomenon or something they were unaware of.

Do we want our government going the route of China and blocking what we can see and read on the internet?
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The founders were brilliant - but no way they could have imagined something like the internet, or its impact.

Like the climate thread I started, I don't have the solution. I just see the problem. I don't know how anyone could argue that this is sustainable.

We can't solve our problems if we don't at minimum share the same reality.
 
BartenderElite said:
The founders were brilliant - but no way they could have imagined something like the internet, or its impact.

Like the climate thread I started, I don't have the solution. I just see the problem. I don't know how anyone could argue that this is sustainable.

We can't solve our problems if we don't at minimum share the same reality.
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Sorry, I really don't know what your point is or what you are advocating. A lot of people think you want the government to violate the constitution and censor information.
 
BidenPresident said:
Sorry, I really don't know what your point is or what you are advocating. A lot of people think you want the government to violate the constitution and censor information.
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The only point was to start a discussion. I'm basically ignoring posts that claim I'm asking for the government to step in, or for true censorship, or anything. I haven't advocated for anything.
 
BartenderElite said:
The founders were brilliant - but no way they could have imagined something like the internet, or its impact.

Like the climate thread I started, I don't have the solution. I just see the problem. I don't know how anyone could argue that this is sustainable.

We can't solve our problems if we don't at minimum share the same reality.
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The alternative is you suppress speech and force it underground or you go the China route and have the gov't restrict access to what people can see.

People have talked a lot about the fear of losing our democracy, this would be a prime example of it
 
BidenPresident said:
so...vague
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It's just "this is a problem...what do you all think?"

That's it. If anyone claims it's NOT a problem, I'd question their take on reality. Widespread misinformation is a huge blockade to finding solutions. We can't agree or compromise if we don't share the same reality.

There are too many know-it-alls on this board. Not every thread has to be a "this is what I think should happen" thread.
 
cawacko said:
The alternative is you suppress speech and force it underground or you go the China route and have the gov't restrict access to what people can see.

People have talked a lot about the fear of losing our democracy, this would be a prime example of it
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It's a fair point. We always err on the side of freedom, which of course we all support. In this case, it's starting to hurt us & have a negative impact.

I'd probably reject that it's either what we have, or government control/suppression. Maybe there is another answer we haven't thought of.
 
BartenderElite said:
I don't have the solutions, EL.

I just see the problem. We have 10's of millions of people who believe complete fabrications & conspiracy.
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Then you need to teach people to think more critically. Twitter and Facebook BOTH have banned people for saying things that the government is now saying. So no one is qualified to limit speech. So the founding fathers were correct to protect free speech.
 
BartenderElite said:
It's a fair point. We always err on the side of freedom, which of course we all support. In this case, it's starting to hurt us & have a negative impact.

I'd probably reject that it's either what we have, or government control/suppression. Maybe there is another answer we haven't thought of.
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Cancel culture. It's basically a way to ostracize someone who doesn't say or do what we want. Do it in a large enough setting and you can control speech that way.
 
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