fucktard barney frank

Mottleydude said:
pwned LOL
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this board seems to have it's own unique definition of "pwned".....other places I have frequented you had to at least win an argument before you could claim it.....

"American liberal" has nothing to do with the list of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, James Madison, John and Sam Adams, Alexander Hamilton, John Jay....

you need to choose from the likes of Code Pink, ACORN, PETA, the nearest gay pride parade organizational committee, and former terrorist bombers turned college professor.......
 
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Mottleydude said:
What would you know about freedom? You're a conservative. There just words to you. You can't handle it when someone actually practices their freedoms.
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I can handle it fine. What I don't like is when some liberal refuses to take responsibility for their own actions, like poking each other up the ass then expecting me to pay for their health care. *shrug*
 
PostmodernProphet said:
this board seems to have it's own unique definition of "pwned".....other places I have frequented you had to at least win an argument before you could claim it.....
.......
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Welcome to the land of liberals who are so dumb they think that they've won an argument by deflection or ad-hom.
 
PostmodernProphet said:
this board seems to have it's own unique definition of "pwned".....other places I have frequented you had to at least win an argument before you could claim it.....

"American liberal" has nothing to do with the list of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, James Madison, John and Sam Adams, Alexander Hamilton, John Jay....

you need to choose from the likes of Code Pink, ACORN, PETA, the nearest gay pride parade organizational committee, and former terrorist bombers turned college professor.......
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Obviously you're not a big student of history.

You may have a PhD in ideology, but you'd have a hard time qualifying for a GED in history based on your comment here.

Obviously, quite obviously, you're unfamiliar with the works of James Locke and the influence he had on all the Founding Fathers, in particular, Jefferson and Madison. He also had great influence of the Declaration of Independance, my favorite American historical document .. as well as great influence on the Constitution.

Where do you think "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" comes from?

Perhaps you should spend some time studying Locke's "Two Treatises of Government", and his thoughts on property, labor, and human understanding before you jump to the contrived ideological conclusion about the Framers.

If you choose to debate this perspective, I'd welcome it.

By the way, although I never use the term, if you choose to pursue this line of debate, perhaps I can give you a demonstratiion of what "pwned" looks like on this site.
 
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ib1yysguy said:
Let me know when you can quote a Republican taking responsibility for the economic downturn which began well before Obama was even nominated for candidacy.
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You are correct, it started well before Obama took office. It started in March of 2000. Though we did have a false growth created by the real estate bubble created by the removal of Glass Steagall (which occurred in 1999), keeping interest rates artificially low from 2002-2005 (yes Greenspan... I am talking to you). Otherwise the bear market began with the tech implosion in 2000.

To be clear, this is not the fault of one party or the other, rather it is the fault of both. Running deficits for 50 straight years (in good times and in bad) tends to lead the country into ruin.
 
ib1yysguy said:
It's commonly acknowledged by economists that the problem with the stimulus was that it wasn't big enough of an expenditure. Who do you think is responsible for railing against the stimulus because it was too big? Who called it "spendulus"?

Please see my economics lesson for retards thread for a very terse summary of the economics behind stimulus spending.

http://www.justplainpolitics.com/basic-economics-retards-deficits-t19661.html
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Idiot. It is not the the stimulus wasnt big enough. It is that the bulk of it hasnt been spent yet. Having "stimulus" that occurs primarily 2-8 years from now really doesn't do much for the economy today.
 
ib1yysguy said:
Japan's deficit spending ≠ the US stimulus package. The economics is sound. You called me not credible for saying economics supported it. I said I could show you a Nobel prize winning economist who thought it should be bigger, you said I was lying. You really stepped in it now.

This is one of the better pwns I've seen on this site in a long time. I'm making my own thread for it.
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Krugman is sound on economics, WHEN he is able to keep his political ideology out of the conversation. This stimulus is NOT too small, it is spread too thin. Six months in and we have spent what portion of the $767 billion? 15%? 20?

Pump this money into shovel ready jobs. There are plenty of people willing to go to work right now.
 
ib1yysguy said:
I deal with this in the other thread. There's no similarity AT ALL between the Japanese recession and our own. The comparison is a very, very sorry attempt to draw attention away from the major pwnage you just suffered.

And it's laughable to see you call anything regarding economics "mistaken" after watching your disappointing performance in this thread.
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HOW is it not comparable? The shear stupidity of such a comment shows your level of comprehension on economics. Take a look at the Japanese market in the 1980's.... compare it to that of the US in the 1990's. Then compare the Japanese market of the 1990's to what the US has seen in the last 10 years. We are following a very similiar pattern.

Deficit spending is necessary at times, but simply throwing money around does not solve any long term fundamental problems. Creating 'stimulus' that is spent over 5-7 years instead of NOW, is not going to help the economy or create a sense of trust among the population that the idiots in DC have any clue as to what they are doing.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
3 nights ago he was on the daily show and told john stewart that the reason the stimulus isn't working as fast as it should have is because the republicans demanded 40 billion be removed from the package. the plan is now in place to blame the republicans for the worsening economy in the attempt to shield obama.

knew the dems weren't going to accept responsibility.
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The Rs are not getting the message across that the stimulus doesn't even really come into effect until October and that this appears to be designed as the re-election plan rather than an actual stimulus. Instead what appears likely to happen is that this will bring a small improvement during the election year and it will effect the Ds chances in the election positively.

They messed with people's lives, and instead of working out what may happen in the future and getting in front of it it appears that the Rs will be reacting again. Why is it that lately they can't even look a few months ahead and speak smartly rather than quickly?
 
Superfreak said:
HOW is it not comparable? The shear stupidity of such a comment shows your level of comprehension on economics. Take a look at the Japanese market in the 1980's.... compare it to that of the US in the 1990's. Then compare the Japanese market of the 1990's to what the US has seen in the last 10 years. We are following a very similiar pattern.

Deficit spending is necessary at times, but simply throwing money around does not solve any long term fundamental problems. Creating 'stimulus' that is spent over 5-7 years instead of NOW, is not going to help the economy or create a sense of trust among the population that the idiots in DC have any clue as to what they are doing.
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And what will replace the government bubble when it bursts? (When the stimulus ends what will make it so we don't have to continue to spend this way to keep the economy afloat?)
 
Superfreak said:
Krugman is sound on economics, WHEN he is able to keep his political ideology out of the conversation. This stimulus is NOT too small, it is spread too thin. Six months in and we have spent what portion of the $767 billion? 15%? 20?

Pump this money into shovel ready jobs. There are plenty of people willing to go to work right now.
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Krugman has been right on the money on the economy and where it was headed for a long time.

His "ideology" can hardly be seperated from his sound economic decisions .. which is why he won the Nobel Prize in the first place.
 
blackascoal said:
You may have a PhD in ideology
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then again, as I think I clearly stated, I might not....it might be a Masters in Theology.....

Obviously, quite obviously, you're unfamiliar with the works of James Locke and the influence he had on all the Founding Fathers, in particular, Jefferson and Madison. He also had great influence of the Declaration of Independance, my favorite American historical document .. as well as great influence on the Constitution.

Where do you think "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" comes from?

Perhaps you should spend some time studying Locke's "Two Treatises of Government", and his thoughts on property, labor, and human understanding before you jump to the contrived ideological conclusion about the Framers.

If you choose to debate this perspective, I'd welcome it.
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feel free, but I believe you are arguing the wrong end of the stick....while I am quite familiar with the beliefs of the founding fathers, you are apparently clueless as to the beliefs of "American liberals".....
 
Damocles said:
And what will replace the government bubble when it bursts? (When the stimulus ends what will make it so we don't have to continue to spend this way to keep the economy afloat?)
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That is the point of the comparison someone brought up with Japan. Government spending done incorrectly simply creates yet another bubble. The spending HAS to be focused on something sustainable or on something that will provide the short term foundation we need. This is why infrastructure spending is the key.

If we take infrastructure spending (something that we HAVE to do anyway) and ramp it up hard during a time when the labor market is loose, we give the rest of the economy the chance to get its feet back under it. These jobs are not meant to be permanent. They are meant to use up the labor force while its available and when the rest of the sectors start picking back up as a result, the transition of labor back to the other sectors takes place and spending on infrastructure tapers back to a sustainable pace. (ie, don't let the labor market get TOO tight or we will have wage inflation to deal with)
 
Superfreak said:
That is the point of the comparison someone brought up with Japan. Government spending done incorrectly simply creates yet another bubble. The spending HAS to be focused on something sustainable or on something that will provide the short term foundation we need. This is why infrastructure spending is the key.

If we take infrastructure spending (something that we HAVE to do anyway) and ramp it up hard during a time when the labor market is loose, we give the rest of the economy the chance to get its feet back under it. These jobs are not meant to be permanent. They are meant to use up the labor force while its available and when the rest of the sectors start picking back up as a result, the transition of labor back to the other sectors takes place and spending on infrastructure tapers back to a sustainable pace. (ie, don't let the labor market get TOO tight or we will have wage inflation to deal with)
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Instead we have a set spending period, and set "investments" so that ramping down if it becomes necessary will take another act of Congress rather than just a capacity for understanding and a decision. If the spending is ineffective we solely have the option to continue spending or the economy becomes still worse, creating an ever larger debt bubble...
 
blackascoal said:
Krugman has been right on the money on the economy and where it was headed for a long time.

His "ideology" can hardly be seperated from his sound economic decisions .. which is why he won the Nobel Prize in the first place.
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His ideology can most certainly be separated from economics. He won the Nobel for his thoughts on international trade patterns and regional economics. NONE of which included is political beliefs.

Yet most of his op-ed pieces for the tabloid Times are stuffed with his hatred of Bush and/or Republicans/Conservatives.
 
Damocles said:
Instead we have a set spending period, and set "investments" so that ramping down if it becomes necessary will take another act of Congress rather than just a capacity for understanding and a decision. If the spending is ineffective we solely have the option to continue spending or the economy becomes still worse, creating an ever larger debt bubble...
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Which is why the current 'stimulus' plan (much like what Japan tried) will not work.
 
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