Was 2020 election stolen or not?

[LV426]

Loaded question. Another example of your dishonesty.

Hold on a second...

You said that people need mental health care.

OK, so how do you get everyone the mental health care they need without Medicare-for-All?

What is your solution? <-Yet another question that is not rhetorical and will be asked of you given your opposition to M4A.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Literally what the 24th Amendment was about.

i'm guessing 'shall not be infringed' wasn't enough words for you to understand it's the same thing? or the handful of court cases saying the same thing?

 

[LV426]

i'm guessing 'shall not be infringed' wasn't enough words for you to understand it's the same thing?

How are your gun right infringed by a mental health evaluation?

Just answer the question...no need to ask a question back to my question...you maintain that these screenings would be an infringement of your right to own a gun. HOW?

or the handful of court cases saying the same thing?

Are you sure about that?

Because there are plenty of court cases where a mentally ill person lost their guns after a psych evaluation.

In fact, that was the purpose of the psych evaluation; to determine whether or not that person was mentally fit or should lose their guns.

So there already is precedent that exists that strips guns from those who are mentally unwell.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

How are your gun right infringed by a mental health evaluation?

Just answer the question...no need to ask a question back to my question...you maintain that these screenings would be an infringement of your right to own a gun. HOW?

I tried to give you the examples of why by comparing them to rights that YOU wouldn't want to have to pass things to exercise. I even gave you specific court case wording 'prior restraint', but your absolute hatred of guns in civilian hands either won't allow you to understand or YOU ARE BEING OBTUSE

Are you sure about that?

Because there are plenty of court cases where a mentally ill person lost their guns after a psych evaluation.

In fact, that was the purpose of the psych evaluation; to determine whether or not that person was mentally fit or should lose their guns.

So there already is precedent that exists that strips guns from those who are mentally unwell.

there is a difference between the two that i'm sure you're deliberately trying to ignore........

 

[LV426]

I tried to give you the examples of why by comparing them to rights that YOU wouldn't want to have to pass things to exercise.

And your lack of historical context came back to bite you in the ass via the 24th Amendment.

So we're right back to where we started; with the expectation that you would be able to articulate how a mental health screening (let's say it's completely free and paid by Medicare) is infringing on your right to own a gun?

 

[LV426]

I even gave you specific court case wording 'prior restraint', but your absolute hatred of guns in civilian hands either won't allow you to understand or YOU ARE BEING OBTUSE

Court case wording? What the fuck are you talking about?

People get stripped of their guns in court all the fucking time because they're mentally ill.

This thing you're so afraid of already happens.

Someone could bring YOU to court over your guns and that court would probably make you submit to a mental health evaluation.

But again, that evaluation itself is not an infringement on your right, and you can argue in court why you think you're mentally fit despite your doctor saying you're not.

You probably won't win that argument, but you can certainly make it.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[LV426]

there is a difference between the two that i'm sure you're deliberately trying to ignore........

There is no difference.

One is court-ordered, and one would be a law.

Both do the same thing.

I can't believe you wouldn't want every gun owner to be evaluated before they own a gun so that the bad gun owners won't make you look bad by association.

There's no excuse for not doing them.

You said yourself that mentally ill people are responsible for gun violence.

So OK, if we go with that, then we need to screen every single person before they buy a gun to determine if they are mentally ill.

Because you can't tell someone is mentally ill by looking at them.

 

[LV426]

there is a difference between the two that i'm sure you're deliberately trying to ignore........

It seems to me the only reason you oppose mental health pre-screenings for gun ownership is that you don't believe you'd pass that screening.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Right, they're already illegal yet they happen all the time.

Sane people understand that's an enforcement issue. Why do you want to make more gun laws which won't be enforced and only serve to deprive honest, law-abiding Americans the right of self-defense and freedom of choice?

Wait - so now you support Medicare for All?

What is "Medicare for All"? What does it cover? What does it cost? Who pays for it?

I see healthcare, both physical and mental, as a national security issue up to a point. In general, that point is check ups, both physical and mental, vaccinations, preventive medicine and emergency treatment for injuries and illness. After that, it goes private.

Hold on a second...

You said that people need mental health care.

Pretty sure I didn't, but I need a gun and you don't like that. LOL

 

[LV426]

Sane people understand that's an enforcement issue.

OK, so how would you enforce the prohibition against straw purchasing any differently than it's being enforced now?

 

[LV426]

Why do you want to make more gun laws which won't be enforced and only serve to deprive honest, law-abiding Americans the right of self-defense and freedom of choice?

So if you're telling me that gun laws aren't going to be enforced, then you're saying that we have to ban guns.

You're making this argument, Dutch...this is where your argument is heading...

If you say that guns laws are unenforceable either by choice or by accident, then in order to reduce gun violence, we must reduce the guns.

Because there's nothing else that can be done that can get a handle on gun violence if you're not going to enforce the current laws, or if you are and those laws just aren't going to be followed by a certain number of people.

So you just made a very strong argument for total gun prohibition.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

OK, so how would you enforce the prohibition against straw purchasing any differently than it's being enforced now?

Refund the Police.

$20 says you go back to be the multi-posting, cyberstalking psycho scatterbrain everyone thinks you are but are afraid to say.

 

[LV426]

What is "Medicare for All"? What does it cover? What does it cost? Who pays for it?

You're not someone who takes guns very seriously.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Refund the Police.

$20 says you go back to be the multi-posting, cyberstalking psycho scatterbrain everyone thinks you are but are afraid to say.

So if you're telling me that gun laws aren't going to be enforced, then you're saying that we have to ban guns.

You're not someone who takes guns very seriously.

QED

First, I win $20.

Second, I take all American rights very seriously. Deadly serious, in fact. Yours, mine and ours.

Third, you're an idiot.

IIRC, you're female. A lot of the far RWNJs on JPP are lonely males. Sure, most can't get it up anymore, but that doesn't mean they stopped liking women. They're just idiots who don't know how to talk to a woman.

Are you a woman who doesn't know how to talk to a man?

 

[LV426]

What is "Medicare for All"?

The answer is in your question.

What does it cover?

Everything.

What does it cost?

About $1T less than what we're spending right now.

Who pays for it?

We all do.

 

[LV426]

I see healthcare, both physical and mental, as a national security issue up to a point.

That point would be when it ceases to be convenient for you and doesn't run in conflict with the other phony positions you have that are entirely fungible.

 

[LV426]

In general, that point is check ups, both physical and mental, vaccinations, preventive medicine and emergency treatment for injuries and illness. After that, it goes private.

Why?

Can you control getting cancer?

Pretty sure I didn't, but I need a gun and you don't like that. LOL

Oh, so you don't think that mentally ill people should get health care, and they should get guns instead?

 

[LV426]

Refund the Police.

How does that enforce the laws against straw purchasing any differently than they're being enforced now?

Cops don't prevent crime...you understand that, right?

Cops only show up AFTER the crime has been committed. They don't stop crime. They don't even deter crime.

So you need to do some more thinking because this is just fuckin' lazy, and I really do not like laziness and take it as a personal insult when you are lazy.

 

[LV426]

Second, I take all American rights very seriously. Deadly serious, in fact. Yours, mine and ours.

Bullshit.

Third, you're an idiot.

You're the one who wants crazy people to have guns.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The answer is in your question.

Everything.

About $1T less than what we're spending right now.

We all do.

Nice sound bites and, sincerely, I believe your heart is in the right place, but your trying to put sugar on a very large turd. You are oversimplifying, as many people do here, a very complex problem. Worse, our national leaders are doing the same thing.

The world is complex and, as the great Ronald Reagan once said, our children are our nation's greatest resource...and, in 2021, it's clear we are failing our children.

As a nation, we don't properly care of them, we don't properly prepare for their future and we have a really, really nasty habit of kicking the can down the road.

The evidence is the National Debt. The evidence is growing population of native Americans who are becoming less competitive in a modern world because We, the People do not put education as a major priority.

Why don't We, the People care about educating kids? It's obvious. First, it doesn't do shit for the adults who have livestyles to support here and now.

Second, educating a six year old won't pay off until they are 25-30. That's about 20-30 fucking years just to see a profit? What good investor would invest in that long term gamble? Better, in their minds, to look for shorter term profits and let the fucking future take care of itself.

Third...well, you don't give a fuck about third because you're too busy thinking about yourself and the here & now as reflected in the vast majority of your posts.