Legalize it Already

Timshel

New member
The issue of drug legalization has become a hot topic as of late. Jim Webb is calling for a commission to study issues related to prison reform and is recommending that all ideas be considered, including legalization of drugs.

The extra press even brought an article from John P. Walters, former Drug Czar, in the Wall Street Journal. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124061336043754551.html

In this article Walters, rolls out what he considers to be the great successes of the Drug War. Those successes, the waning of the crack and meth "epidemics."

Walters fails to realize that the reduction in use of crack and meth can not be fully attributed to the drug policy but rather are due to changing preferences within the market. The fact is that the crack "epidemic" was replaced by the meth "epidemic" which has now been replaced by a prescription drug (mainly oxycontin) "epidemic."

Drug policy does have some effect on these changing preferences. If the government focuses interdiction efforts on cocaine then it has less resources to stop meth. These interdiction efforts will impact cost. That is, the cost of cocaine would increase while the cost of meth would decrease. Any reputable student of economics will tell you that cost is going to affect use.

So the great successes of the drug war are nothing more than a thumb in the dike, slowing the spill from one crack and diverting pressure to create a new fissure.

Further, Walters fails to acknowledge that most of the legalization talk still surrounds marijuana. I am sure he would say that is just the beginning for the legalization efforts. There is some truth to that. I, for one, support legalization or at least decriminalization of all drugs. However, my experience in advocacy of legalization has led me to believe that legalization of marijuana would silence the majority of drug war critics.

Unfortunately, most people only really care about legalizing their own drug of choice. I support legalization of marijuana alone, primarily because it would likely shift usage patterns more to this very benign drug at the deficit of more dangerous drugs. It might harm my libertarian ideals of full legalization, but I am more than willing to sacrifice that for the benefit that it will bring to my fellow Americans.

Another point Walters makes is against the idea that prohibition spawns and strengthens black market cartels, organized crime or the mafia. This is in response to the argument from proponents of legalization that alcohol prohibition created/strengthened organized crime. Walters points out that Bobby Kennedy was battling mafia long after the end of alcohol prohibition. No doubt, the mafia survived past the end of alcohol prohibition. It did so by shifting resources into other areas, gambling (legal or otherwise), newly prohibited drugs, prostitution and other black market activities that should be legal. Some of the shifting (e.g, into legalized gambling) actually legitimized the resources so new generations were less likely to engage in illegal activities.

The mafia has not gone away but it has not been nearly the same since and the end of prohibition made it a much easier target for police.

Walters is probably right that the Mexican cartels will not simply disappear with legalization. Many will move into some new territory of illegal activity. But they will be greatly weakened and that should be enough alone.

P.S. Walters madness should be understood. Don't demonize him. Personally, I see him as an old man that sees his life's work under attack. Even that might be too simplistic. Maybe, he actually believes the nonsense he spews.

I meant to start this as a criticism of arguments for and against legalization. There are many arguments for legalization that are total bs or at least very weak and nearly all the arguments for the status quo are weak. Then I found Walters article. Maybe, I will revisit the subject.
 
I gave my finals speech on Marijuania legalization. Everybody laughed when they saw what it was about, but I made serious arguments and I think it pulled off well. It's not considered the crazy idea it once was, nor is it only thought that only drug heads who want cheaper access to their habit support it.

Every year Gallup has been polling the issue, the number of people supporting legalization has increased. It's still not a majority or plurality, but if the trend holds there will be a majority within 20-30 years. I imagine young people are far more pro-legalization than older folks.

20051101b_1.gif


I am confident that it will happen at least within my lifetime, maybe surprisingly soon.
 
I gave my finals speech on Marijuania legalization. Everybody laughed when they saw what it was about, but I made serious arguments and I think it pulled off well. It's not considered the crazy idea it once was, nor is it only thought that only drug heads who want cheaper access to their habit support it.

Every year Gallup has been polling the issue, the number of people supporting legalization has increased. It's still not a majority or plurality, but if the trend holds there will be a majority within 20-30 years. I imagine young people are far more pro-legalization than older folks.

20051101b_1.gif


I am confident that it will happen at least within my lifetime, maybe surprisingly soon.

Then explain why all these years since the 60's and 70's the voters haven't legalized it??

I mean, they should have all aged enough to be able to vote.
 
Then explain why all these years since the 60's and 70's the voters haven't legalized it??

I mean, they should have all aged enough to be able to vote.

I didn't say young voters in the past. I said modern young voters. I am certain that young voters in the 60's and 70's probably supported it at greater percentages than their parents, but it wasn't enough to form a majority.

If the trend line does not hold, and we have another anti-freedom revolution like we did in the 80's, then it will probably be 50 rather than 20 years before a pro-freedom majority is formed.
 
I didn't say young voters in the past. I said modern young voters. I am certain that young voters in the 60's and 70's probably supported it at greater percentages than their parents, but it wasn't enough to form a majority.

If the trend line does not hold, and we have another anti-freedom revolution like we did in the 80's, then it will probably be 50 rather than 20 years before a pro-freedom majority is formed.


What stopped all those users, from the 60's and 70's, from getting it legalized prior to today, seeing as how they've been of voting age all those years??
 
What stopped all those users, from the 60's and 70's, from getting it legalized prior to today, seeing as how they've been of voting age all those years??

They were more pro-legalization, as the charts show. There wasn't a majority or plurality. There never has been. The trend-line has been for legalization though, which was my point. Support has tripled sine '69. I never said that there was ever a majority pro-legalization. I think you were misinterpreting my point.
 
They were more pro-legalization, as the charts show. There wasn't a majority or plurality. There never has been. The trend-line has been for legalization though, which was my point. Support has tripled sine '69. I never said that there was ever a majority pro-legalization. I think you were misinterpreting my point.

And what I've been trying to get you to address; is that why weren't all those users able to get legalization passe, after all these years??
Unless you feel that there is a larger percentage of the population now, that is in favor of this, then there ever has been.
 
And what I've been trying to get you to address; is that why weren't all those users able to get legalization passe, after all these years??
Unless you feel that there is a larger percentage of the population now, that is in favor of this, then there ever has been.

LET ME RE-FUCKING-ITERATE, THERE IS A LARGER PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION IN FAVOR OF THIS NOW THAN THERE HAS EVER BEEN, IT HAS TRIPLED SINCE '69, BUT THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A MAJORITY IN FAVOR, AS I HAVE SAID A DOZEN TIMES WHILE YOU HAVE REFUSED TO LISTEN, SO HOW COULD IT HAVE BEEN PASSED WITH BOTH THE PEOPLE AND THE ELITE AGAINST IT YOU FUCKING IDIOT

I AM PREDICTING THAT THERE WILL BE A MAJORITY IN THE FUTURE, (NOT THAT THERE IS OR HAS EVER BEEN, EVEN AMONGST YOUNG PEOPLE), BECAUSE OF THE TREND LINES.
 
LET ME RE-FUCKING-ITERATE, THERE IS A LARGER PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION IN FAVOR OF THIS NOW THAN THERE HAS EVER BEEN, IT HAS TRIPLED SINCE '69, BUT THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A MAJORITY IN FAVOR, AS I HAVE SAID A DOZEN TIMES WHILE YOU HAVE REFUSED TO LISTEN, SO HOW COULD IT HAVE BEEN PASSED WITH BOTH THE PEOPLE AND THE ELITE AGAINST IT YOU FUCKING IDIOT

I AM PREDICTING THAT THERE WILL BE A MAJORITY IN THE FUTURE, (NOT THAT THERE IS OR HAS EVER BEEN, EVEN AMONGST YOUNG PEOPLE), BECAUSE OF THE TREND LINES.


When you pull that knobed stick out of you ass and you feel more comfortable, maybe you'll show what information you're using to draw your conclusion.
 
When you pull that knobed stick out of you ass and you feel more comfortable, maybe you'll show what information you're using to draw your conclusion.

20051101b_1.gif


Do you see a trend here you fucking idiot? Do you? I'm just wondering? Are you blind? Do you need glasses? Is this being read to you or something, and the person reading it to you didn't pass on the information from the charts? I'm just wondering because you don't seem to be seeing it, and keep on asking me dumb questions?
 
20051101b_1.gif


Do you see a trend here you fucking idiot? Do you? I'm just wondering? Are you blind? Do you need glasses? Is this being read to you or something, and the person reading it to you didn't pass on the information from the charts? I'm just wondering because you don't seem to be seeing it, and keep on asking me dumb questions?

Is this what you're using as a basis for all this??
There's nothing there to show what percentage of the population was used to come to these numbers.

Were percentages equal to the increased population used??
How was the poll conducted.

I can prove that more people want the drinking age reduced, if I take the poll at High Schools.
 
wait what do those points on the chart mean to imply? someone could have just arbitrarily placed them this is your evidence? im with usfreedom.
 
Is this what you're using as a basis for all this??
There's nothing there to show what percentage of the population was used to come to these numbers.

Were percentages equal to the increased population used??
How was the poll conducted.

I can prove that more people want the drinking age reduced, if I take the poll at High Schools.

US"FREEDOM", it's a Gallup poll. It's a scientific poll, taken of a number of people designed to represent the population at large. It is taken in the same way that the election polls during the election were. There is a margin of error of about 3%, which means that in 19 out of every 20 polls it is predicted to be no more than 3% from the actual main stream opinion. Gallup is a very proffessional polling organization that takes polls on numerous issues from time to time, marijuania legalization being just one of them.

Any more questions from the child?
 
US"FREEDOM", it's a Gallup poll. It's a scientific poll, taken of a number of people designed to represent the population at large. It is taken in the same way that the election polls during the election were. There is a margin of error of about 3%, which means that in 19 out of every 20 polls it is predicted to be no more than 3% from the actual main stream opinion. Gallup is a very proffessional polling organization that takes polls on numerous issues from time to time, marijuania legalization being just one of them.

Any more questions from the child?

And again, what number of people were used.
If you want to believe in polls, go ahead; but just keep plenty of tissues handy, for when you're disappointed.

As to "Any more questions from the child?"; I guess that would depend on what you intend to ask.

Now, stop touching your inner child.
 
And again, what number of people were used.
If you want to believe in polls, go ahead; but just keep plenty of tissues handy, for when you're disappointed.

The number? It doesn't matter. It's a scientific poll, you ignorant fool. A scientific poll of 1000 people is a thousand times more accurate than a straw poll of ten million. The number is enough to make the margin of error within 3%, and that is all you need to know, child, because it's too much for your mind to comprehend.

US"FREEDOM", scientific polls are the best way we have of predicting support issues, and when multiple polls predict a certain number reliably multiple times you can draw certainty from the conclusion that support has greatly increased since 1969.
 
Back
Top