Great Depression vs. 'Great Recession'

I think democrats did a masterful job of crying chicken and false outraging the right column was much worse than thefacts say. Kudos Obama the fear mongerer.
 
I will sum this up in 9 words:

Moderate recession figures
market manipulation
Huge overreaction by Government
 
I don't think people necessarily over-reacted. IF the banking system had been allowed to fail, and there had been no bailouts (same w/ the auto industry), we likely would be in a much worse place today than we are.
 
Right here you can see that this recession is moderate at best. For the most part its on par with all other recessions give or take a little.


Bank failures
Depression: 9,096 – 50% of banks
Recession: 47 – 0.5% of banks

Unemployment rate
Depression: 25%
Recession: 8.1%

Economic decline
Depression: -26.5%
Recession: -1.7%

Change in prices
Depression: -25%
Recession: +0.6%


Now here is the first eye opener. This is unnatural and the explanation is manipulation.
Decline in Dow Jones industrial average
Depression: -89.2%
Recession: -53.8%

I urge you to watch the hedge fund naked shorting manipulation youtube videos for example of what went on:
http://www.justplainpolitics.com/education-youtube-naked-shorting-t17992.html


Next is the most alarming thing to me because unlike throwing some hedgefund managers in jail and overhauling the SEC there is no way to deny this will impact us for years and years to come:

Emergency spending programs
Depression: 1.5% of GDP for 1 year
Recession: 3% of GDP for 2 years

Increase in money supply by Federal Reserve
Depression: 17%
Recession: 140%


Just wow.
 
There's also a good argument for letting corps fail. Sure I'd agree that we'd have had more than this mild recession, but the price tag might have been less than the trillions were paying bankers for ass raping us.
 
Topspin said:
There's also a good argument for letting corps fail. Sure I'd agree that we'd have had more than this mild recession, but the price tag might have been less than the trillions were paying bankers for ass raping us.
Click to expand...

increase in the money supply 140%....... hope your kids have good jobs!!
 
Topspin said:
There's also a good argument for letting corps fail. Sure I'd agree that we'd have had more than this mild recession, but the price tag might have been less than the trillions were paying bankers for ass raping us.
Click to expand...

I agree it's a good argument, and in spirit, I generally agree w/ it in a big way.

I just thought that w/ something as fundamental as banking, which is so integral to everything else, that the dire warnings were not overplayed. We could have let them fail, but it would have been extremely painful, and would have deepened & extended the downturn to a point where - imo - a comparison to the depression would not be that far off.
 
Chapdog said:
Right here you can see that this recession is moderate at best. For the most part its on par with all other recessions give or take a little.


Bank failures
Depression: 9,096 – 50% of banks
Recession: 47 – 0.5% of banks

Unemployment rate
Depression: 25%
Recession: 8.1%

Economic decline
Depression: -26.5%
Recession: -1.7%

Change in prices
Depression: -25%
Recession: +0.6%


Now here is the first eye opener. This is unnatural and the explanation is manipulation.
Decline in Dow Jones industrial average
Depression: -89.2%
Recession: -53.8%

I urge you to watch the hedge fund naked shorting manipulation youtube videos for example of what went on:
http://www.justplainpolitics.com/education-youtube-naked-shorting-t17992.html


Next is the most alarming thing to me because unlike throwing some hedgefund managers in jail and overhauling the SEC there is no way to deny this will impact us for years and years to come:

Emergency spending programs
Depression: 1.5% of GDP for 1 year
Recession: 3% of GDP for 2 years

Increase in money supply by Federal Reserve
Depression: 17%
Recession: 140%


Just wow.
Click to expand...


Perhaps the emergency spending programs (including state aid) and FED actions are reasons why the current recession is not as bad as it may otherwise have been.

This is a bit silly.
 
New banks could have been funded with less capital. They could have lent out many times what has been. Soros and co made money off the little guys raping. Many like him were with Obama. I think they played him like a flute. I also think Mcain would have also grabbed his ankles.
This false emergency has allowed Obama to pass every liberals wish list.
 
Chapdog said:
Right here you can see that this recession is moderate at best. For the most part its on par with all other recessions give or take a little.


Bank failures
Depression: 9,096 – 50% of banks
Recession: 47 – 0.5% of banks

Unemployment rate
Depression: 25%
Recession: 8.1%

Economic decline
Depression: -26.5%
Recession: -1.7%

Change in prices
Depression: -25%
Recession: +0.6%


Now here is the first eye opener. This is unnatural and the explanation is manipulation.
Decline in Dow Jones industrial average
Depression: -89.2%
Recession: -53.8%

I urge you to watch the hedge fund naked shorting manipulation youtube videos for example of what went on:
http://www.justplainpolitics.com/education-youtube-naked-shorting-t17992.html


Next is the most alarming thing to me because unlike throwing some hedgefund managers in jail and overhauling the SEC there is no way to deny this will impact us for years and years to come:

Emergency spending programs
Depression: 1.5% of GDP for 1 year
Recession: 3% of GDP for 2 years

Increase in money supply by Federal Reserve
Depression: 17%
Recession: 140%


Just wow.
Click to expand...

1) Your numbers are comparing the current recession to the Great Depression, not to other recessions

2) Not sure where you are getting the 1.7% in economic decline as they just released fourth quarter 2008 numbers which showed over 6% decline (which would make the total decline for 2008 roughly 3.5%)

3) When you see unemployment rate almost double... that is hardly moderate

4) Recessions are NOT measured by the number of bank failures

5) Yes, the money supply increase does cause concern for future inflation, but part of the reason we slipped into the Great Depression was a restriction of the money supply. They need to be ready to tighten supply quickly once the economy picks back up.

6) We have yet to see if the credit card market is going to snowball into yet another bubble bursting.

7) All that said, firms like Lehman, Indy Bank and Bear Stearns certainly appear to be victims of bear raids. Thanks in large part to the stupidity of removing the uptick rule and the lack of enforcement by the SEC on naked shorts. (you might find this site interesting... http://www.deepcapture.com/)
 
Dungheap said:
Perhaps the emergency spending programs (including state aid) and FED actions are reasons why the current recession is not as bad as it may otherwise have been.

This is a bit silly.
Click to expand...


Maybe to an extent but besides some of the early bailouts (that are marred with corruption) the additional 'stimulus' and increase in govt spending hasnt even taken effect yet. The fear mongering (see obama press conference) just totaly wreaks of government expansion. Its the same rubbish sales tactic after 911 for war with IRAQ. Just different goal in mind.
 
Superfreak said:
1) Your numbers are comparing the current recession to the Great Depression, not to other recessions

2) Not sure where you are getting the 1.7% in economic decline as they just released fourth quarter 2008 numbers which showed over 6% decline (which would make the total decline for 2008 roughly 3.5%)

3) When you see unemployment rate almost double... that is hardly moderate

4) Recessions are NOT measured by the number of bank failures

5) Yes, the money supply increase does cause concern for future inflation, but part of the reason we slipped into the Great Depression was a restriction of the money supply. They need to be ready to tighten supply quickly once the economy picks back up.

6) We have yet to see if the credit card market is going to snowball into yet another bubble bursting.

7) All that said, firms like Lehman, Indy Bank and Bear Stearns certainly appear to be victims of bear raids. Thanks in large part to the stupidity of removing the uptick rule and the lack of enforcement by the SEC on naked shorts. (you might find this site interesting... http://www.deepcapture.com/)
Click to expand...

I took the number right off of the link at the top of the thread.
Regardless of any of the point you bring up the fact is.. We are not even CLOSE to a great depression yet we are about to increase money flow by an amount thats absolutely staggering. Its got the Europeans and the rest of the world in total rage and its going to mean the end of the green back as the world standard for sure. I cant even predict what this is going to do to us.
 
Do you really think this is as bad as it is going to get?

Do you really think things will get back to normal next year?
 
uscitizen said:
Do you really think this is as bad as it is going to get?

Do you really think things will get back to normal next year?
Click to expand...

Yes. maybe earlier

edit: tho i dont know what increasing our money supply by 140% is going to do to our wallets when inflation set in.
 
Onceler said:
I don't think people necessarily over-reacted. IF the banking system had been allowed to fail, and there had been no bailouts (same w/ the auto industry), we likely would be in a much worse place today than we are.
Click to expand...

Had the government not created so much fear in the banking system, the banks wouldn't be in such bad shape to need bailouts. The government basically orcestrated the biggest savings and loan failure in United States history. Just keep watching.... On the 31st JPM has to report to the court what exactly they recieved from WaMu through the FDIC's 'kind' hand. If this makes it to court (my instinct is the FDIC will settle this before it gets too ugly), there is some pretty damning evidence to show the FDIC is in cahoots with some of these banks and caused some of the failures purposelly to benefit their friends.
 
Chapdog said:
I took the number right off of the link at the top of the thread.
Regardless of any of the point you bring up the fact is.. We are not even CLOSE to a great depression yet we are about to increase money flow by an amount thats absolutely staggering. Its got the Europeans and the rest of the world in total rage and its going to mean the end of the green back as the world standard for sure. I cant even predict what this is going to do to us.
Click to expand...

Ok... fair enough... given that I never said we were close to the great depression. I stated I would not call this a 'moderate' recession. As I also stated, I agree the numbers are staggering. China has already called for a new reserve currrency... which is odd given that their US treasury holdings would tank if that were to happen.
 
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