Chairman Enrique Torrio

Is the Chairman of Proud Boys a White Supremacist?

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Darth Omar said:
This isn’t a trivial distinction: much of the bloodshed of the last century arose from what was, essentially, a humanist worldview.

I suggest we not end up there.
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Do you even know what humanism is? It's literally the opposite of bloodshed. Maybe open a dictionary.

Anyway, the Founding Fathers were influenced by the Enlightenment. They were intellectuals and many of them privately condemned religion. Surely you're aware of Jefferson's letters regarding Christianity.

And if you have any lingering doubt that the United States was founded as a secular nation, consider the wording of Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, 1796:


Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims); and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan (Mohammedan) nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

The United States deliberately included this passage so that the Muslims didn't mistake America for a Christian nation or a "continuation" of the Crusades.
 
Chaz said:
That doesn't make them women; it means they have a condition.
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I never said this "makes them women." I'm stating scientific facts.

But, since you bring it up, why does someone's identify bother you so much? These are a minority of the population. It's not like the Union Of Transexual Primadonnas is going to infiltrate your sunday school and make little Johnny an atheist Muslim suicide bomber who runs an abortion clinic as a side gig. (This is sarcasm, btw.)
 
Nerdberg said:
Dept.of Homeland Security; Lone offenders and small cells of individuals motivated by a diverse array if social ,ideological and personal factors will pose the primary terrorust threat to the US.
That is what experts in the field see.
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Is that a description of Antifa?

BTW, I doubt DHS misspells terrorist, so I suspect that "quote" isn't accurate or complete.
 
Michael_Panetta said:
Do you even know what humanism is? It's literally the opposite of bloodshed. Maybe open a dictionary.

Anyway, the Founding Fathers were influenced by the Enlightenment. They were intellectuals and many of them privately condemned religion. Surely you're aware of Jefferson's letters regarding Christianity.

And if you have any lingering doubt that the United States was founded as a secular nation, consider the wording of Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, 1796:


Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims); and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan (Mohammedan) nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

The United States deliberately included this passage so that the Muslims didn't mistake America for a Christian nation or a "continuation" of the Crusades.
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Government——->secular

Nobody wants or is advocating for a non-secular government.

A nation is comprised of people and people can’t be be secular: only institutions or governments can be secular.
 
Michael_Panetta said:
From Wikipedia:

The group believes men—especially white men—and Western culture are under siege; their views have elements of the white genocide conspiracy theory.[21][22][23] Officially, the group rejects white supremacy, although members have participated in multiple racist events and events centered around anti-left violence, with a former member organizing the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville.[24] The organization glorifies violence[25][26][27][28] and the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) has called it an "alt-right fight club."
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Why do you lie so fucking much? A typical Democrat cherry picking shit to fill a narrative. Here from Wiki:

Much more at the link. No wonder Mikey would not link it. Fucking lying sack of shit.

The Proud Boys is a far-right[1][2][3][4] and neo-fascist[5][6][7][8] male-only[9][10] organization that promotes and engages in political violence.[11][12][13][14] It is based in the United States and has a presence in Australia, Canada and the United Kingdom.[15][16] The group was started as a joke in the far-right Taki's Magazine[17] in 2016 by Vice Media co-founder and former commentator Gavin McInnes, taking its name from the song "Proud of Your Boy" from the Disney musical Aladdin.[18][19] The Proud Boys emerged as part of the alt-right, but McInnes began distancing himself from the alt-right in early 2017, saying the alt-right's focus is race while his focus is what he defines as "Western values." This re-branding effort intensified after the Unite the Right rally.[20][21]

The group believes men—especially white men—and Western culture are under siege; their views have elements of the white genocide conspiracy theory.[22][23][24] Officially, the group rejects white supremacy, although it has significant ties with white supremacist groups.[1][2][3][4] Members have participated in multiple racist events and events centered around anti-left violence, with a former member organizing the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville.[25] The organization glorifies violence[26][27][28][29] and the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) has called it an "alt-right fight club."[25][30][31]

In late November 2018, it was reported the FBI had classified the Proud Boys as an extremist group with ties to white nationalism.[13][32] Two weeks later at an FBI briefing in Clark County, Washington, law enforcement officials denied that it was their intent to classify the entire group in this manner and ascribed the mistake to a misunderstanding. During the briefing, FBI agents suggested using websites for more information, including the SPLC resource.[32][33] The official said that their intent was to characterize the possible threat from certain members of the group.[34]
 
Michael_Panetta said:
I never said this "makes them women." I'm stating scientific facts.

But, since you bring it up, why does someone's identify bother you so much? These are a minority of the population. It's not like the Union Of Transexual Primadonnas is going to infiltrate your sunday school and make little Johnny an atheist Muslim suicide bomber who runs an abortion clinic as a side gig. (This is sarcasm, btw.)
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Because it's incorrect and unscientific.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Let's start with who got the ball rolling on it being labeled a White Supremacist group...

No surprise there: The Southern Poverty Law Center.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...te-supremacist-group-law-enforcement-agencies



https://www.dw.com/en/who-are-the-proud-boys/a-55112663

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/group/proud-boys

Now, you have to understand that the Stupid Pathetic Liars Club (SPLC) is a radical Leftist hate organization of its own. They have repeatedly lost lawsuits for deformation, lying about groups and people, labeling them hate groups, racists, etc. The SPLC doesn't have much of a track record of winning against these either.



https://patriotdetroit.com/content/all/splc-sued-must-pay-33-million-for-defamation
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politi...-group-defamation-lawsuit-against-splc-n69883
https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2019/02/04/gavin-mcinnes-sues-splc-for-defamation/
https://thenewamerican.com/splc-sued-again-for-defamation/

The FBI no longer considers them reliable as a source of information

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...aw-center-hate-groups-scam-column/2022301001/
https://afajournal.org/past-issues/2017/december/fbi-splc-not-a-reliable-source/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ab7d60-756d-11e8-9780-b1dd6a09b549_story.html
https://www.cnsnews.com/news/articl...-made-endorsement-southern-poverty-law-center

Basically, the SPLC is not a credible source of information on Right wing groups. Since they are the originating source, since quoted widely by more sympathetic Left leaning and Leftist media sources, the whole idea that the Proud Boys are a White supremacist hate group is based on an unfounded source and is likely just another lie by the SPLC. That doesn't mean they might still be, but it certainly doesn't appear so on the face of what the group itself presents or its membership and actions.

What is going on here is a case of the "big lie." This is a propaganda technique where you smear an opponent and then repeat the lie frequently and widely giving it the appearance of being the truth. I'll even link this to a article about it from a hard Left source:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/3/25/1845142/-The-Big-Lie-Propaganda-Principle-1

The point is, until there is a less biased viewing of this group, it's goals, and members, we aren't getting the truth about it from the SPLC and those that link back to that group in the media.
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Is that the Navy's official position too, Chief? Or does the United States Navy also condemn violent hate groups such as the Proud Boys, the KKK and Antifa?
 
Sailor said:
Why do you lie so fucking much? A typical Democrat cherry picking shit to fill a narrative. Here from Wiki:

Much more at the link. No wonder Mikey would not link it. Fucking lying sack of shit.

The Proud Boys is a far-right[1][2][3][4] and neo-fascist[5][6][7][8] male-only[9][10] organization that promotes and engages in political violence.[11][12][13][14] It is based in the United States and has a presence in Australia, Canada and the United Kingdom.[15][16] The group was started as a joke in the far-right Taki's Magazine[17] in 2016 by Vice Media co-founder and former commentator Gavin McInnes, taking its name from the song "Proud of Your Boy" from the Disney musical Aladdin.[18][19] The Proud Boys emerged as part of the alt-right, but McInnes began distancing himself from the alt-right in early 2017, saying the alt-right's focus is race while his focus is what he defines as "Western values." This re-branding effort intensified after the Unite the Right rally.[20][21]

The group believes men—especially white men—and Western culture are under siege; their views have elements of the white genocide conspiracy theory.[22][23][24] Officially, the group rejects white supremacy, although it has significant ties with white supremacist groups.[1][2][3][4] Members have participated in multiple racist events and events centered around anti-left violence, with a former member organizing the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville.[25] The organization glorifies violence[26][27][28][29] and the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) has called it an "alt-right fight club."[25][30][31]

In late November 2018, it was reported the FBI had classified the Proud Boys as an extremist group with ties to white nationalism.[13][32] Two weeks later at an FBI briefing in Clark County, Washington, law enforcement officials denied that it was their intent to classify the entire group in this manner and ascribed the mistake to a misunderstanding. During the briefing, FBI agents suggested using websites for more information, including the SPLC resource.[32][33] The official said that their intent was to characterize the possible threat from certain members of the group.[34]
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None of this contradicts what I quoted. Are you suggesting that Wikipedia is contradicting itself in the same few paragraphs? Dumbass.
 
Michael_Panetta said:
Trump was asking Wallace which specific group he (Trump) should condemn. Then Trump mentioned the Proud Boys.
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Trump is getting his ass kicked by Republicans on this issue and is now backpedaling like a circus clown.

https://thehill.com/homenews/admini...ys-should-stand-down-after-backlash-to-debate
Trump on Wednesday faced blowback from a number of Republicans who said he should have forcefully denounced white supremacy when he was given the chance.

"I don't know who the Proud Boys are," Trump told reporters when departing for a campaign trip to Minnesota. "I can only say they have to stand down. Let law enforcement do their work."
 
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