Something To Ponder

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I think that this is very important. The story about the homeless man is heartbreaking and outrageous at the same time. That judge should be thrown off the bench. But this happens every day in this country, which is no longer the greatest country in the world by any stretch. And I too am so tired, so bone-tired weary, of watching these smug, insulated, cocktail party-going "journalists" on television as they talk this shit about the bushies.

Throw the motherfuckers in jail! Bet your ass, if you broke the law, they'd put you there. And they have no problem stealing a life, and putting someone away for 25 years to life, for ridiculous, non-violent bullshit. Because the lives of people like us, don't matter. They're not really lives.

The definition of a "two-tiered justice system"

Aside from the intrinsic dangers and injustices of arguing for immunity for high-level government officials who commit felonies (such as illegal eavesdropping, obstruction of justice, torture and other war crimes), it's the total selectivity of the rationale underlying that case which makes it so corrupt. Defenders of Bush officials sing in unison: We shouldn't get caught up in the past. We shouldn't be driven by vengeance and retribution. We shouldn't punish people whose motives in committing crimes weren't really that bad.

There are countries in the world which actually embrace those premises for all of their citizens, and whose justice system consequently reflects a lenient approach to crime and punishment. The United States is not one of those countries. In fact, for ordinary citizens (the ones invisible and irrelevant to Ruth Marcus, Stuart Taylor, Jon Barry and David Broder), the exact opposite is true:

Homeless man gets 15 years for stealing $100

A homeless man robbed a Louisiana bank and took a $100 bill. After feeling remorseful, he surrendered to police the next day. The judge sentenced him to 15 years in prison.

Roy Brown, 54, robbed the Capital One bank in Shreveport, Louisiana in December 2007. He approached the teller with one of his hands under his jacket and told her that it was a robbery.

The teller handed Brown three stacks of bill but he only took a single $100 bill and returned the remaining money back to her. He said that he was homeless and hungry and left the bank.

The next day he surrendered to the police voluntarily and told them that his mother didn’t raise him that way.

Brown told the police he needed the money to stay at the detox center and had no other place to stay and was hungry.

In Caddo District Court, he pleaded guilty. The judge sentenced him to 15 years in prison for first degree robbery.

Under federal law, "the simple possession of just 5 grams of crack cocaine, the weight of about two sugar packets, subjects a defendant to a mandatory five-year prison term." In Alabama, the average sentence for marijuana possession -- an offense for which most Western countries almost never imprison their citizens -- is 8.4 years. Until recently, the state of Florida "impose[d] mandatory-minimum sentences of 25 years for illegally carrying a pillbox-worth of drugs such as Oxycontin" and still imposes shockingly Draconian mandatory sentences even for marijuana offenses.

Our political class has embraced mandatory minimum sentencing schemes as a way to eliminate mercy and sentencing flexibility for ordinary people who break the law (as opposed to Bush officials who do). The advocacy group Families Against Mandatory Minimums details just some of the grotesque injustices here, including decades of imprisonment for petty drug dealing which even many judges who are forced to impose the sentences find disgraceful. Currently in the U.S., close to 7,000 people are serving sentences of 25 years to life under our merciless "three-strikes-and-out" laws -- which the Supreme Court upheld as constitutional in a 5-4 ruling -- including half for nonviolent offenses and many for petty theft.

As I've noted many times before, the United States imprisons more of its population than any other country on the planet, and most astoundingly, we account for less than 5% of the world's population yet close to 25% of the world's prisoners are located in American prisons. As The New York Times' Adam Liptak put it in an excellent and thorough April, 2008 article, revealing how self-absorbed and hypocritical are the cries for mercy, understanding and "moving on" being made by media stars and political elites on behalf of lawbreaking Bush officials:

Indeed, the United States leads the world in producing prisoners, a reflection of a relatively recent and now entirely distinctive American approach to crime and punishment. Americans are locked up for crimes — from writing bad checks to using drugs — that would rarely produce prison sentences in other countries. And in particular they are kept incarcerated far longer than prisoners in other nations. . . .


Whatever the reason, the gap between American justice and that of the rest of the world is enormous and growing.

It used to be that Europeans came to the United States to study its prison systems. They came away impressed.

"In no country is criminal justice administered with more mildness than in the United States," Alexis de Tocqueville, who toured American penitentiaries in 1831, wrote in "Democracy in America."

No more.

"Far from serving as a model for the world, contemporary America is viewed with horror," James Whitman, a specialist in comparative law at Yale, wrote last year in Social Research. "Certainly there are no European governments sending delegations to learn from us about how to manage prisons."

Prison sentences here have become "vastly harsher than in any other country to which the United States would ordinarily be compared," Michael Tonry, a leading authority on crime policy, wrote in "The Handbook of Crime and Punishment."

Indeed, said Vivien Stern, a research fellow at the prison studies center in London, the American incarceration rate has made the United States "a rogue state, a country that has made a decision not to follow what is a normal Western approach" . . . .

The American character — self-reliant, independent, judgmental — also plays a role.

"America is a comparatively tough place, which puts a strong emphasis on individual responsibility," Whitman of Yale wrote. "That attitude has shown up in the American criminal justice of the last 30 years."

And that's to say nothing of the brutal and excessive tactics used by our increasingly militarized police state (Digby's writing on the use of tasers is indispensable) and the inhumane conditions that characterize our highly profitable prison state.

Under all circumstances, arguing that high political officials should be immunized from prosecution when they commit felonies such as illegal eavesdropping and torture would be both destructive and wrong [not to mention, in the case of the latter crimes, a clear violation of a treaty which the U.S. (under Ronald Reagan) signed and thereafter ratified]. But what makes it so much worse, so much more corrupted, is the fact that this "ignore-the-past-and-forget-retribution" rationale is invoked by our media elites only for a tiny, special class of people -- our political leaders -- while the exact opposite rationale ("ignore their lame excuses, lock them up and throw away the key") is applied to everyone else. That, by definition, is what a "two-tiered system of justice" means and that, more than anything else, is what characterizes (and sustains) deeply corrupt political systems. That's the two-tiered system which, for obvious reasons, our political and media elites are now vehemently arguing must be preserved.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/
 
Yeah, we've all said this all before. But that just makes too much sense for the lock em up and throw away the key crowd, Darla. Never in my lifetime has their been a hysteria like the one in the 80's and 90's that lead to the current ultra-harsh sentencing disaster that conservatives have imposed upon us. And our newly minted Republican president isn't going to do shit about it.
 
Again if those against marijuana had actually smoked marijuana they would all go "WHAT THE FUCK HOW DID I SUPPORT PEOPLE GOING TO JAIL FOR THIS"

They act out of ignorance and there is nothing worse.
 
WTF with the exposing the redneck Bush neocons in Louisiana YET again.
Can't Vitter wear his diapers at his prostitutes condo in piece?
 
LOL

Looks like the guy has a place to live for at least 15 years, plus 3 meals a day.

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime...
 
Yeah so lets take down the whole Bush admin.

How much do you think it costs to keep this homeless man in prison?
 
mandatory sentencing was the answer to liberal judicial tyrants imposing weak assed sentences for violent crimes. suck it libs, you made this happen.
 
Sentences were already too harsh before 1980. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that the sentencing system needs to be changed to something fairer. The get tough people went far beyond reason a long time ago; it's no longer even "eye for an eye", it's "life for an eye, life for a tooth" to them; and life for drug crimes too.
 
Here's also something to ponder, conservatards:

http://www.mapinc.org/newscsdp/v08/n891/a05.html

POLL: 60 PERCENT OF AMERICANS OPPOSE MANDATORY MINIMUM SENTENCES

by Amanda Paulson, Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor,
25 Sep 2008
Christian Science Monitor

Attitudes About One of the Toughest Crime Measures From the 1980s May Be Changing.

Chicago - For two decades, politicians have worked hard to polish their tough-on-crime credentials.

Now, though - at a time when concerns about crime are low, prison populations are skyrocketing, and voters are more informed about how sentencing laws play out - Americans may be starting to rethink one of the toughest crime reforms from the 1980s: mandatory minimum sentences for drug offenses.

In a new poll, some 60 percent of respondents opposed mandatory minimums for nonviolent crimes, including a majority of both Democrats and Republicans. Nearly 80 percent said the courts are best qualified to determine sentences for crimes, and nearly 60 percent said they'd be likely to vote for a politician who opposed mandatory minimum sentences.


...more at link
 
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mandatory sentencing was the answer to liberal judicial tyrants imposing weak assed sentences for violent crimes. suck it libs, you made this happen.

No, that's not how it happened at all.

It happened because of the 60's, so-called, "culture wars", and the mythology that the right wing was succesfull in pulling off surrounding that, starting with Nixon and Reagan in the 1968 primaries. The reactionary right managed to frame the hippy culture as being violent, when in fact, it was the cops and right wing vigilantes who perpetrated the vast majority of the violence.

It was, much like the Iraq war, a right wing reaction to a threat which never existed. But it did create demons that people had to elect Republicans to slay.

Same as it ever was.

You're just another fool who fell for it, that's all.
 
Here's also something to ponder, conservatards:

http://www.mapinc.org/newscsdp/v08/n891/a05.html

POLL: 60 PERCENT OF AMERICANS OPPOSE MANDATORY MINIMUM SENTENCES

by Amanda Paulson, Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor,
25 Sep 2008
Christian Science Monitor

Attitudes About One of the Toughest Crime Measures From the 1980s May Be Changing.

Chicago - For two decades, politicians have worked hard to polish their tough-on-crime credentials.

Now, though - at a time when concerns about crime are low, prison populations are skyrocketing, and voters are more informed about how sentencing laws play out - Americans may be starting to rethink one of the toughest crime reforms from the 1980s: mandatory minimum sentences for drug offenses.

In a new poll, some 60 percent of respondents opposed mandatory minimums for nonviolent crimes, including a majority of both Democrats and Republicans. Nearly 80 percent said the courts are best qualified to determine sentences for crimes, and nearly 60 percent said they'd be likely to vote for a politician who opposed mandatory minimum sentences.


...more at link

Yeah, I think the 60's are finally over.
 
I have to stop and wonder, with the huge numbers that are for eliminating mandatory minimums and instituting universal healthcare, why does Obama even blink? I swear I think he's a Republican plant.
 
you guys are so politically full of hate...its disturbing

california is a liberal state with a liberal legislature that enacted teh 3 strikes law....ouch
 
I have to stop and wonder, with the huge numbers that are for eliminating mandatory minimums and instituting universal healthcare, why does Obama even blink? I swear I think he's a Republican plant.

yes, thats it, because no dem could be guilty of anything wrong or against your beliefs :rolleyes:
 
you guys are so politically full of hate...its disturbing

california is a liberal state with a liberal legislature that enacted teh 3 strikes law....ouch

Actually that was voted in after the hysteria caused by a single crime. I've always said that California isn't nearly as liberal as people think; at least not on the law and order issue. But it was nearly amended to put it more in line with other states far less harsh three strikes laws before the governator started a massive ad blitz against it; mainly a cynical political ploy to gain political support for his next run.

I do have a lot of political hate. :)
 
yes, thats it, because no dem could be guilty of anything wrong or against your beliefs :rolleyes:

Yeah I guess by saying that I am giving the Dems far too much credit. I've always said, with Dems like these, who needs Republicans? I probably won't be happy until we have a functioning Green party in the US.
 
Actually that was voted in after the hysteria caused by a single crime. I've always said that California isn't nearly as liberal as people think; at least not on the law and order issue. But it was nearly amended to put it more in line with other states far less harsh three strikes laws before the governator started a massive ad blitz against it; mainly a cynical political ploy to gain political support for his next run.

I do have a lot of political hate. :)

yeah, the dems acted like a bunch of chickens and caved and ol' willie brown admitted it, but really is beside the point as dems are also creating harsher punishments and you guys go on and on as if it is only republicans

do you really think hate is healthy?
 
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