If Trump Loses and Contests the Election, the Likely Result Will Be Street Level Viol

Micawber said:
I have a mossberg 500, the kind the cops use, for this. But I only have bird shot. I'm hoping never to have to aim it at a human.
But I defintiely have a defensible position and commanding view of anyone coming up a narrow entrance of 45 stairs. They'd have to really
want me for some reason, instead of some other house. They'd basically have to do an Omaha beach and be willing to sacrifice
a dozen before the thirteenth could grab it from my hands. :laugh: Ah fantasy island talk.
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Nothing wrong with #2 birdshot at relatively close range.
 
Hello Dutch Uncle,

Dutch Uncle said:
Agreed with an addition: there are left wing extremists who cause trouble too. A peaceful protest of 3000-5000 Americans and 2-3 knuckleheads is all it takes. The same tactics were used in the 60s protests.

The extreme right wants an excuse to crack down in the left. Look at those RWers on this forum calling for the arrest and execution of LWers as traitors.

The extreme left wants to cause an incident which galvanizes most Americans to turn against the RWers. One way would be if Trump's Troops massacred a bunch of unarmed peaceful protestors. Trump seems to want his own Kent State or Wounded Knee and LW radicals would be happy to assist him because it would be the end of Republicanism in the federal government for a few years to come.
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Sounds plausible enough. Do you have any references supporting this view?

When I said RW hate is a far bigger problem I am thinking of the huge list of hate groups compiled by the SPLC.

"In its 2019 annual report (covering the year 2018), the SPLC listed 1,020 organizations as active hate groups, categorized by type, as follows: Ku Klux Klan (51), neo-Nazi (112), white nationalist (148), racist skinhead (63), Christian Identity (17), neo-Confederate (36), black nationalist (264), anti-immigrant (17), anti-LGBT (49), anti-Muslim (100), and "other hate" (163, consisting of 15 hate music groups, 8 Holocaust denial groups, 2 male supremacy groups, 30 neo-Völkisch groups, 11 radical traditional Catholic groups, and 97 other groups).[2]" wiki

SPLC does not designate whether they are RW or LW, so let's just take a quick look at the categories and select the easily identifiable RW groups and the LW groups:

RW hate groups: "Ku Klux Klan (51), neo-Nazi (112), white nationalist (148), racist skinhead (63), Christian Identity (17), neo-Confederate (36), anti-immigrant (17), anti-LGBT (49), anti-Muslim (100), 15 hate music groups, 8 Holocaust denial groups, 2 male supremacy groups, 30 neo-Völkisch groups." Total 648.

LW hate groups: "black nationalist (264)" Total 264.

It appears that RW hate groups outnumber the LW groups by nearly 3 to 1.
 
Hello Darth,

Darth Omar said:
Imagine the organizational skills these right wing groups have that they can spread out all over the country. Some of them even manage to get arrested without blowing their cover—they even fool the cops into thinking they’re lefties.

Also, right wing extremists have even gone as far as to recruit blacks to pose as BLM protesters/rioters. They’ve sure come along way since the 60’s.

Amazing.
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A position based on imagination hardly stacks up against the careful research of the SPLC.
 
Darth Omar said:
You didn’t really think that was going to fly, did you?

Imagine the organizational skills these right wing groups have that they can spread out all over the country. Some of them even manage to get arrested without blowing their cover—they even fool the cops into thinking they’re lefties.

Also, right wing extremists have even gone as far as to recruit blacks to pose as BLM protesters/rioters. They’ve sure come along way since the 60’s.

Amazing.
Click to expand...

Indeed.

PoliTalker should stay with his cheering the economic loss to million of Americans and their families caused by the virus from China that China failed to contain.

PoliTalker:

"Dive, market, DIVE!

Take DT down with you.


02-28-2020, 06:47 AM #5 | Top
PoliTalker


"Sometimes things have to get worse before they can get better.

We're going down.

BZZZZZT! BZZZZZT! BZZZZZT!

Dive! Dive! Dive!"
 
All the evidence shows that violence at demonstrations depends almost totally on the behaviour of the police/authorities. If they choose to antagonise the crowd, violence follows
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello Dutch Uncle,

Sounds plausible enough. Do you have any references supporting this view?

When I said RW hate is a far bigger problem I am thinking of the huge list of hate groups compiled by the SPLC.

"In its 2019 annual report (covering the year 2018), the SPLC listed 1,020 organizations as active hate groups, categorized by type, as follows: Ku Klux Klan (51), neo-Nazi (112), white nationalist (148), racist skinhead (63), Christian Identity (17), neo-Confederate (36), black nationalist (264), anti-immigrant (17), anti-LGBT (49), anti-Muslim (100), and "other hate" (163, consisting of 15 hate music groups, 8 Holocaust denial groups, 2 male supremacy groups, 30 neo-Völkisch groups, 11 radical traditional Catholic groups, and 97 other groups).[2]" wiki

SPLC does not designate whether they are RW or LW, so let's just take a quick look at the categories and select the easily identifiable RW groups and the LW groups:

RW hate groups: "Ku Klux Klan (51), neo-Nazi (112), white nationalist (148), racist skinhead (63), Christian Identity (17), neo-Confederate (36), anti-immigrant (17), anti-LGBT (49), anti-Muslim (100), 15 hate music groups, 8 Holocaust denial groups, 2 male supremacy groups, 30 neo-Völkisch groups." Total 648.

LW hate groups: "black nationalist (264)" Total 264.

It appears that RW hate groups outnumber the LW groups by nearly 3 to 1.
Click to expand...

You mean like setting off firecrackers or throwing light bulbs at a tense moment when young armed men are pointing their weapons at unarmed protesters who refuse to leave? The knuckleheads have already been tossing rocks and bottles of urine at them. I don't know of any specific references. I read a lot of books on the subject in my younger days along with guerrilla warfare strategies and tactics. Baiting armed people who are already scared to start shooting is easier if they are poorly trained and/or poorly led.

Why do you think unarmed innocent citizen Breonna Taylor was shot up to eight times with more shots fired? Because when one person in a group of armed men starts shooting, they all start shooting.

Kent State is a classic example of how the government fucked up and murdered 4 innocent unarmed Americans and shot another 9. Our nation is quickly headed to a repeat of this tragedy, if not the Jallianwala Bagh massacre, due to Trump's insistence of Federal authority overriding State authority. In my opinion, Trump is setting himself up to cap his tenure as President with the mass murder of American citizens in a tragedy similar to these:

https://www.britannica.com/event/Jallianwala-Bagh-Massacre
Jallianwala Bagh Massacre, Jallianwala also spelled Jallianwalla, also called Massacre of Amritsar, incident on April 13, 1919, in which British troops fired on a large crowd of unarmed Indians in an open space known as the Jallianwala Bagh in Amritsar in the Punjab region (now in Punjab state) of India, killing several hundred people and wounding many hundreds more. It marked a turning point in India’s modern history, in that it left a permanent scar on Indo-British relations and was the prelude to Mohandas (Mahatma) Gandhi’s full commitment to the cause of Indian nationalism and independence from Britain.


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/hist...assacre-changed-university-forever-180974787/
For the past half-century, Kent State has been trying to live down those 13 seconds of bloodshed on Monday, May 4, 1970. Five days prior, President Richard Nixon publicly stated the Vietnam War had expanded into Cambodia, sparking unrest at college campuses nationwide, including at Kent State, a teacher’s college in Northeast Ohio that had a small, but particularly militant, chapter of Students for a Democratic Society. That Friday night, protestors broke windows and threw bottles at police cars. The next day, the ROTC building on campus was set ablaze; arson was suspected, but nobody was ever apprehended. Local officials asked that the university close down, but Ohio Governor James Rhodes—who himself was running in a contested Republican primary for U.S. Senate—called in the National Guard

A noon rally was set for Monday, May 4. National Guard troops fired tear gas at the crowd, which included some people throwing rocks at the soldiers, and appeared to be falling back before several Guardsmen, explained at the time as a moment of panic and fear for their lives, fired a total of 67 shots from M-1 rifles at the students—some protesting the expansion of the Vietnam War into Cambodia and some just on their way to class. Four students, Jeff Miller, Allison Krause, Bill Schroeder and Sandra Scheuer, were killed and nine more were injured.

That evening, White House Press Secretary Ron Zeigler read a statement dictated by Nixon himself:

This should remind us all once again that when dissent turns to violence, it invites tragedy. It is my hope that this tragic and unfortunate incident will strengthen the determination of all the Nation’s campuses—administrators, faculty, and students alike—to stand firmly for the right that exists in this country to dissent and just as firmly against the resort to violence as a means of such expression.​

Three days after the shootings, a general student strike occurred across the country, with nearly 4 million people walking out of class. On May 14, at Jackson State College (now University) in Mississippi, National Guard troops and local law enforcement fired more than 150 shots into a dormitory—responding, they said, to sniper fire. (No evidence of sniper fire was ever found.)[light bulbs or firecrackers? Phillip Gibbs, a student at Jackson State, and James Green, a high school student, were killed in the barrage.

The Kent State shooting remains a watershed moment in American history. It sparked a nationwide student strike shortly thereafter and reverberated throughout the final years of the Vietnam War and the passage of the 26th Amendment in 1971, which lowered the voting age to 18.
 
Hello Dutch Uncle,

Dutch Uncle said:
You mean like setting off firecrackers or throwing light bulbs at a tense moment when young armed men are pointing their weapons at unarmed protesters who refuse to leave? The knuckleheads have already been tossing rocks and bottles of urine at them. I don't know of any specific references. I read a lot of books on the subject in my younger days along with guerrilla warfare strategies and tactics. Baiting armed people who are already scared to start shooting is easier if they are poorly trained and/or poorly led.

Why do you think unarmed innocent citizen Breonna Taylor was shot up to eight times with more shots fired? Because when one person in a group of armed men starts shooting, they all start shooting.

Kent State is a classic example of how the government fucked up and murdered 4 innocent unarmed Americans and shot another 9. Our nation is quickly headed to a repeat of this tragedy, if not the Jallianwala Bagh massacre, due to Trump's insistence of Federal authority overriding State authority. In my opinion, Trump is setting himself up to cap his tenure as President with the mass murder of American citizens in a tragedy similar to these:

https://www.britannica.com/event/Jallianwala-Bagh-Massacre
Jallianwala Bagh Massacre, Jallianwala also spelled Jallianwalla, also called Massacre of Amritsar, incident on April 13, 1919, in which British troops fired on a large crowd of unarmed Indians in an open space known as the Jallianwala Bagh in Amritsar in the Punjab region (now in Punjab state) of India, killing several hundred people and wounding many hundreds more. It marked a turning point in India’s modern history, in that it left a permanent scar on Indo-British relations and was the prelude to Mohandas (Mahatma) Gandhi’s full commitment to the cause of Indian nationalism and independence from Britain.


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/hist...assacre-changed-university-forever-180974787/
For the past half-century, Kent State has been trying to live down those 13 seconds of bloodshed on Monday, May 4, 1970. Five days prior, President Richard Nixon publicly stated the Vietnam War had expanded into Cambodia, sparking unrest at college campuses nationwide, including at Kent State, a teacher’s college in Northeast Ohio that had a small, but particularly militant, chapter of Students for a Democratic Society. That Friday night, protestors broke windows and threw bottles at police cars. The next day, the ROTC building on campus was set ablaze; arson was suspected, but nobody was ever apprehended. Local officials asked that the university close down, but Ohio Governor James Rhodes—who himself was running in a contested Republican primary for U.S. Senate—called in the National Guard

A noon rally was set for Monday, May 4. National Guard troops fired tear gas at the crowd, which included some people throwing rocks at the soldiers, and appeared to be falling back before several Guardsmen, explained at the time as a moment of panic and fear for their lives, fired a total of 67 shots from M-1 rifles at the students—some protesting the expansion of the Vietnam War into Cambodia and some just on their way to class. Four students, Jeff Miller, Allison Krause, Bill Schroeder and Sandra Scheuer, were killed and nine more were injured.

That evening, White House Press Secretary Ron Zeigler read a statement dictated by Nixon himself:

This should remind us all once again that when dissent turns to violence, it invites tragedy. It is my hope that this tragic and unfortunate incident will strengthen the determination of all the Nation’s campuses—administrators, faculty, and students alike—to stand firmly for the right that exists in this country to dissent and just as firmly against the resort to violence as a means of such expression.​

Three days after the shootings, a general student strike occurred across the country, with nearly 4 million people walking out of class. On May 14, at Jackson State College (now University) in Mississippi, National Guard troops and local law enforcement fired more than 150 shots into a dormitory—responding, they said, to sniper fire. (No evidence of sniper fire was ever found.)[light bulbs or firecrackers? Phillip Gibbs, a student at Jackson State, and James Green, a high school student, were killed in the barrage.

The Kent State shooting remains a watershed moment in American history. It sparked a nationwide student strike shortly thereafter and reverberated throughout the final years of the Vietnam War and the passage of the 26th Amendment in 1971, which lowered the voting age to 18.
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CFM said:
You getting what you deserve has nothing to do with fascism. You should know that. All you want is an excuse.

I don't care what you call it as long as you get it. My concern is the end result.
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Well thankfully I live in America, where people have freedom to disagree with the government. I know you wished we lived in a country like China, but no such luck for you.
 
StoneByStone said:
Well thankfully I live in America, where people have freedom to disagree with the government. I know you wished we lived in a country like China, but no such luck for you.
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Even you know the difference between disagreeing and committing criminal acts pretending they're a protest.
 
CFM said:
Even you know the difference between disagreeing and committing criminal acts pretending they're a protest.
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The RW protest in Lansing, MI was illegal. It included death threats against the governor. Also illegal.




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