Trump is utterly unsuited to deal with this crisis intellectually or temperamentally

Cinnabar said:
And to be fair, Biden is attempting to brush off another debate with Bernie for reasons that are obvious to lots of folks and I call foul. This is the time we need a leader who is laser focused and has the policies that count. Biden has fallen way short and the DNC and the establishment Dems need to get the f**k out of the way and let the actually best suited man be revealed. Bernie's policies are being used as we speak to get us through this crisis and he has been on the battlefield every day since this mess started holding virtual round tables in real time with experts, advocates and real people on his YouTube channel. He mobilized his base and they have collected over two million dollars for the cause. Bernie is the guy to beat Trump! Wake up!
Click to expand...

Never seen a guy derail his own OP to get looks, but I do agree Biden should debate Sanders more. I don't agree about your assessment, but if Sanders gets the nom, I will fully support him
against the incompetent traitor moron criminal 45*. I will yell loudly in the streets and march for Sanders then.

But for me, EVERYTHING yields to removal of the criminal scourge cult leader of the alt right fascist scum. Sanders will scare too many voters, and so I must support Biden for the diametrically opposite reason Trump
prefers Sanders. It is more likely Trump can beat Sanders than Joe Biden.
 
Micawber said:
Never seen a guy derail his own OP to get looks, but I do agree Biden should debate Sanders more. I don't agree about your assessment, but if Sanders gets the nom, I will fully support him
against the incompetent traitor moron criminal 45*. I will yell loudly in the streets and march for Sanders then.

But for me, EVERYTHING yields to removal of the criminal scourge cult leader of the alt right fascist scum. Sanders will scare too many voters, and so I must support Biden for the diametrically opposite reason Trump
prefers Sanders. It is more likely Trump can beat Sanders than Joe Biden.
Click to expand...

Sanders can beat Trump. Biden will only beat him if the economy is in the toilet. Which is ironic being Biden and the rest of the establishment are the reason we have Trump in he first place. If the Dem party stuck to its roots, they never would have lost the working man's and average American's support. The DNC and the corporate owned Dems would rather have Trump win than Bernie because Bernie would rock their way too cozy world and ivory towers. I will never vote for an establishment Dem again!
 
Cinnabar said:
Sanders can beat Trump. Biden will only beat him if the economy is in the toilet. Which is ironic being Biden and the rest of the establishment are the reason we have Trump in he first place. If the Dem party stuck to its roots, they never would have lost the working man's and average American's support. The DNC and the corporate owned Dems would rather have Trump win than Bernie because Bernie would rock their way too cozy world and ivory towers. I will never vote for an establishment Dem again!
Click to expand...

True and false. And I am cozy. I'd rather have Bernie than Trump, but I'd rather have Biden than Sanders. I won't be scared into voting for Trump by Sanders, but my life personally, would be better with Biden than Sanders.
I think you are underestimating Biden's liberal bona fides. There will be no bloody revolutionary style policy change inside the system. Only Lenin can deliver that. Biden and Sanders both work in the system.
Obama in the system, did as much change as can be done. Incremental change. Obamacare change. Biden can forward the ball. Nobody can work miracles inside the system. Huge change can only occur if there is a
protracted depression with like 30% sustained unemployment. Too many people here are affluent. It is what it is. I'm happy, employed and don't want cataclysmic change. I want measured gradual change to a Euro style
economic system and systemic change to the electoral system. I am also extremely concerned about a 20 trillion dollar deficit and global climate change. I am concerned about isolationism. I want pluralism.
I want minority business ownership and women on boards. I want better education and more engineers than lawyers. I want a lot of things. Just because I won't pledge Bernie doesn't mean I don't want changes.

But my non negotiable is taking down the orange jackal. WHOEVER CAN GUARANTEE DELIVERY OF THAT MOST CREDIBLY GETS MY VOTE. I'm a fucking whore. Those are my terms. I will fuck any candidate
who can defeat that fat criminal disgrace.
 
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Micawber said:
True and false. And I am cozy. I'd rather have Bernie than Trump, but I'd rather have Biden than Sanders. I won't be scared into voting for Trump by Sanders, but my life personally, would be better with Biden than Sanders.
I think you are underestimating Biden's liberal bona fides. There will be no bloody revolutionary style policy change inside the system. Only Lenin can deliver that. Biden and Sanders both work in the system.
Obama in the system, did as much change as can be done. Incremental change. Obamacare change. Biden can forward the ball. Nobody can work miracles inside the system. Huge change can only occur if there is a
protracted depression with like 30% sustained unemployment. Too many people here are affluent. It is what it is. I'm happy, employed and don't want cataclysmic change. I want measured gradual change to a Euro style
economic system and systemic change to the electoral system. I am also extremely concerned about a 20 trillion dollar deficit and global climate change. I am concerned about isolationism. I want pluralism.
I want minority business ownership and women on boards. I want better education and more engineers than lawyers. I want a lot of things. Just because I won't pledge Bernie doesn't mean I don't want changes.

But my non negotiable is taking down the orange jackal. WHOEVER CAN GUARANTEE DELIVERY OF THAT MOST CREDIBLY GETS MY VOTE. I'm a fucking whore. Those are my terms. I will fuck any candidate
who can defeat that fat criminal disgrace.
Click to expand...


Presidents either grow or WITHER. Trump uniquely withered like none before him. An incompetent SELF-SERVING BLOWHARD. A shell of man, a shell of a human being.
 
Micawber said:
True and false. And I am cozy. I'd rather have Bernie than Trump, but I'd rather have Biden than Sanders. I won't be scared into voting for Trump by Sanders, but my life personally, would be better with Biden than Sanders.
I think you are underestimating Biden's liberal bona fides. There will be no bloody revolutionary style policy change inside the system. Only Lenin can deliver that. Biden and Sanders both work in the system.
Obama in the system, did as much change as can be done. Incremental change. Obamacare change. Biden can forward the ball. Nobody can work miracles inside the system. Huge change can only occur if there is a
protracted depression with like 30% sustained unemployment. Too many people here are affluent. It is what it is. I'm happy, employed and don't want cataclysmic change. I want measured gradual change to a Euro style
economic system and systemic change to the electoral system. I am also extremely concerned about a 20 trillion dollar deficit and global climate change. I am concerned about isolationism. I want pluralism.
I want minority business ownership and women on boards. I want better education and more engineers than lawyers. I want a lot of things. Just because I won't pledge Bernie doesn't mean I don't want changes.

But my non negotiable is taking down the orange jackal. WHOEVER CAN GUARANTEE DELIVERY OF THAT MOST CREDIBLY GETS MY VOTE. I'm a fucking whore. Those are my terms. I will fuck any candidate
who can defeat that fat criminal disgrace.
Click to expand...

I will never give my vote away to a candidate who stands for nothing I believe in or support. Biden's record sucks and I will never vote for him because as far as I am concerned he's a corporate whore. My vote is mine. I will never tell you or anyone else who to vote for. "Measured" whatever the f**k that is, has worked out real well...don't make me laugh. Bernie's policies are FDR Democratic police.. not radical at all. It's the jerks like Biden that abandoned them and became Republican lite!
 
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Cinnabar said:
I will never give my vote away to a candidate who stands for nothing I believe in or support. Biden's record sucks and I will never vote for him because as far as I am concerned he's a corporate whore. My vote is mine. I will never tell you or anyone else who to vote for. "Measured" whatever the f**k that is, has worked out real well...don't make me laugh.
Click to expand...

Find the place where I told you who to vote for. I advocated my choice. I don't mind you voting for the Bern.
Please if Biden beats the Bern, stay home. You seem angry enough to reelect a criminal incompetent clown and his plutocratic family
of well groomed grifters.
 
Cinnabar said:
And to be fair, Biden is attempting to brush off another debate with Bernie for reasons that are obvious to lots of folks and I call foul. This is the time we need a leader who is laser focused and has the policies that count. Biden has fallen way short and the DNC and the establishment Dems need to get the f**k out of the way and let the actually best suited man be revealed. Bernie's policies are being used as we speak to get us through this crisis and he has been on the battlefield every day since this mess started holding virtual round tables in real time with experts, advocates and real people on his YouTube channel. He mobilized his base and they have collected over two million dollars for the cause. Bernie is the guy to beat Trump! Wake up!
Click to expand...

We certainly need someone other than Trump...but my opinion is that Bernie Sanders could not beat Trump with a baseball bat or crowbar.

Choosing Bernie is conceding the election to Trump.

We are left, by default, with Biden. Biden can beat Trump with Trump's help...and my bet is that Trump will give him all sorts of help.

Biden is not senile...and is not in dementia. He is, and always has been, a different kind of politician...a guy without the histrionics and puffed up chests of most politicians.

The only thing that can defeat the Democrats this election...is the Bernie Sanders base. The Bernie Sanders base HELPED get Trump elected last election...and seems intent on getting him re-elected.

I hope you see that for the disaster it is.
 
Micawber said:
Find the place where I told you who to vote for. I advocated my choice. I don't mind you voting for the Bern.
Please if Biden beats the Bern, stay home. You seem angry enough to reelect a criminal incompetent clown and his plutocratic family
of well groomed grifters.
Click to expand...

I added this to my last post which you likely missed so here it is again...

Bernie's policies are FDR Democratic polices.. not radical at all. In fact they are being used now to dig us out of this crisis. It's jerks like Biden who abandoned them and became Republican-lite! We will get another Trump down the road thanks to the corporate whores like Biden who offer no change, only the next time it will be smarter monster.
 
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Cinnabar said:
I will never give my vote away to a candidate who stands for nothing I believe in or support. Biden's record sucks and I will never vote for him because as far as I am concerned he's a corporate whore. My vote is mine. I will never tell you or anyone else who to vote for. "Measured" whatever the f**k that is, has worked out real well...don't make me laugh. Bernie's policies are FDR Democratic police.. not radical at all. It's the jerks like Biden that abandoned them and became Republican lite!
Click to expand...

As I said...the only thing that will cause Biden to lose to Trump...is the Bernie base.

You guys helped get him elected...and you guys are on a path to get him re-elected.
 
Cinnabar said:
I added this to my last post which you likely missed so here it is again...

Bernie's policies are FDR Democratic polices.. not radical at all. In fact they are being used now to dig us out of this crisis. It's jerks like Biden who abandoned them and became Republican lite! We will get another Trump down the road thanks to the corporate whores like Biden who offer no change, only the next time it will be smarter monster.
Click to expand...

Yes, they are FDR style policies. But FDR had three terms a world war and a depression to foment that power and thus change.

Sanders does not possess a similar crisis level to exploit to catalyze such change again. I would argue we are more liberal than after FDR by far.
His changes have been codified and not overruled. If you would indulge a football analogy, FDR ran off tackle for 30 yards and most ever exceed 10.

Who made great change? Washington, Lincoln, LBJ and FDR. Revolution, civil war, vietnam war and war and depression, respectively..

Do you think Covid and the underclass resentment is sufficient to outweigh the fears of the prosperous many that Sanders will take their houses
and property as Republicans would have us believe?

I will vote Sanders if the polls say he is more likely to defeat Trump. That formula isn't changing regardless of the relative merits
of any other arguments and facts you or I may adduce.
 
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